F1technical.net

Guys,

There is a bit of fuss about rear wing flexing, and particularly in the RB16B thread.

Clearly, most are discussing the RB16B wing because of Hamilton's comments and footage, but the topic is probably more widespread.

Personally, I feel we can just create a separate thread for flexing rear wings in 2021. We've done similar things in the past when some topics or car features were just overflowing with everything else that was going on in a car thread.

Anyway, beyond my own opinion, and for the sake of future discussion, I'm curious to know how you'd like this one to be handled?

aral wrote: ↑

18 May 2021, 13:52

Rear wing flexing is not peculiar to the RB16B. Further, there is a dedicated thread already on the aero forum, relating to this. Could you please discuss there, and keep this thread purely for the actual RB16B. Thanks

It's quite frustrating observing a moderator interfere with an active discussion on a highly topical issue that was re-invigorated based on the behaviour of this car.

And not the first time this particular moderator has displayed such heavy-handedness either I might add.

Fulcrum wrote: ↑

19 May 2021, 05:27

aral wrote: ↑

18 May 2021, 13:52

Rear wing flexing is not peculiar to the RB16B. Further, there is a dedicated thread already on the aero forum, relating to this. Could you please discuss there, and keep this thread purely for the actual RB16B. Thanks

It's quite frustrating observing a moderator interfere with an active discussion on a highly topical issue that was re-invigorated based on the behaviour of this car.

And not the first time this particular moderator has displayed such heavy-handedness either I might add.

Instead of the downvote on the moderator comment, please vote in the linked thread.

Perhaps just deal with the individuals posting the off topic nonsense in that thread? The rest of us were discussing the specific aspects of the rear wing on the RB16B, we weren't talking about the legality of the wing, just how it was constructed to circumvent the test, how it flexes, how this could grant an advantage, etc. It's not our fault a fanboi came in and posted their wall of text nonsense that was completely off topic.

I think it should be ok to discuss the rear wing as long as its not discussing whether its flexing or not, or how tests should be done etc. There is still a place for rear wing discussion in the RB16B thread.

For instance, I am interested to know what the wing may look like post rule change, and want to discuss the difference between the high downforce wing and the low downforce wing. I think that's fair to remain in that thread right?

I think there is always a place for cleaning up posts when they have gone totally off-topic, or it had turned into an argument etc.

When it's a grey area in terms of the content to subject and people are having a civilised conversation I believe it should just be left alone.

The RB16B topic should be that, purely about the car. Wing is part of the car but we A have a separate topic to discuss wing flex (and it is not exclusive to only Red Bull, let alone the 16B) and B, we had absolutely idiotic comments like “the revenge of Mercedes is best served cold”. While I applaud people for their sympathetic posts in other teams thread, what the actual f. does that have to do with the RB16B technically. Nothing. So I don’t understand why probably these same people are getting upset that it is shut down. I do actually, and I think those kind of commenters should rethink their presence on this board. I for one am glad mods removed that post and shut it down.

Viable commenters should not feel offended.

Plus, pretty quickly when talking about aero effect it is going to be a broader discussion than purely the effect it has on specifically the RB16B so a general topic seems much better suited. Keep car threads about the car.

Move everything into the "FIA Rear Wing Test - 2021" topic. Then can the topic be renamed? Something like "Rear wing flex and FIA flex tests in 2021". Or something that is nice and descriptive.

Obviously the discussion of the RB rear wing belongs in the RB car thread, but not all the comparison and performance talk. As this issue impacts multiple teams, it makes sense to have a dedicated thread for the topic.

Sieper wrote: ↑

19 May 2021, 13:08

The RB16B topic should be that, purely about the car. Wing is part of the car but we A have a separate topic to discuss wing flex (and it is not exclusive to only Red Bull, let alone the 16B) and B, we had absolutely idiotic comments like “the revenge of Mercedes is best served cold”. While I applaud people for their sympathetic posts in other teams thread, what the actual f. does that have to do with the RB16B technically. Nothing. So I don’t understand why probably these same people are getting upset that it is shut down. I do actually, and I think those kind of commenters should rethink their presence on this board. I for one am glad mods removed that post and shut it down.

Viable commenters should not feel offended.

Plus, pretty quickly when talking about aero effect it is going to be a broader discussion than purely the effect it has on specifically the RB16B so a general topic seems much better suited. Keep car threads about the car.

Firstly, you need to consider the fact you are on a public forum.

You're expecting to achieve completely perfect topics where posts are all about very specific things and this is an unrealistic expectation. Virtually every single topic on this forum has posts, paragraphs or sentences that going by your strict criteria would fail or potentially offend you.

This is a forum to talk about a sport, with a specific emphasis on technical aspects. Sport is involved so fans with subjective opinions or loyalties are an unavoidable consequence I'm afraid!!

There are other sides to this too:

- If you censor posts to the extreme and keep deleting things people get bored and leave. That reduces the community, fun and individual inputs.

- If I want to talk about anything related to the Redbull car, I'd go to the Redbull car topic. Why would I think to, or want to split off into multiple other topics when it's about that car?

- To stress again... this is a public forum about a SPORT where anybody in the world can join in. Don't get carried away thinking it's an invite-only engineering forum or something.

I am often (myself) also guilty of going off topic, I am not expecting full compliance there. I also have no problem with mods removing the offtopic parts even if I have contributed. We all do need to keep the topic in mind when posting but yes, that is easy to get wrong, and sometimes it is debatable what is wrong (like with the wing).

What I have the real problem with is people either deliberately, or perhaps in their grievance unawarely (is that a word?) come and post with messages just to antagonize. And maybe that in itself you are (like you say, perhaps) free to do, but then at the very least do that in a correct topic.

I don't need to read about "cold dished revenge by mercedes" in an RB16B topic. That has no relation whatsoever with the car itself.

Sieper wrote: ↑

19 May 2021, 14:23

I am often (myself) also guilty of going off topic, I am not expecting full compliance there. I also have no problem with mods removing the offtopic parts even if I have contributed. We all do need to keep the topic in mind when posting but yes, that is easy to get wrong, and sometimes it is debatable what is wrong (like with the wing).

What I have the real problem with is people either deliberately, or perhaps in their grievance unawarely (is that a word?) come and post with messages just to antagonize. And maybe that in itself you are (like you say, perhaps) free to do, but then at the very least do that in a correct topic.

I don't need to read about "cold dished revenge by mercedes" in an RB16B topic. That has no relation whatsoever with the car itself.

I get what you're saying and agree that when you have somebody submitting a post that is only an insult or comment to antagonise this is going too far and not needed by anybody. Those posts should be deleted and repeat offenders given a warning.

I'm guilty of putting a fan hat on and having a subtle dig at another car or team. That is just having a bit of fun. But I would try and mix it in with something constructive or have a serious paragraph, then a cheeky little line at the end or something.

What I'm saying is there needs to be a balance and everybody who is debating this subject needs to take a step backwards and consider the bigger picture. Some of which being the things mentioned in my above post about the fact this is a public sports forum etc.

100% agree, and having a bit of fun with each other should be an objective (of live) I sometimes get too easily offended, or let people get to me that I shouldn't.

I find the moderation in this forum to be extremely uneven.

In some cases, no moderation at all, to the point where a thread becomes a slanging match between a couple of users.

Then, as in this case, a moderator actively intervenes in a discussion that is both interesting and engaging, where multiple participants are involved, talking (largely) constructively around a topic that does pertain to the general thread.

It might not be the "perfect place", but the users themselves are having the conversation, they have defined where the "forum" is taking place.

Interventions of this nature, also the blunt, heavy-handed manner in which the moderator communicated, are disappointing, especially when they are unnecessary.

Please keep in mind that some of the posts were not moved, but deleted. And rightfully so.

I believe a generic wing topic is much, much better suited for the remaining and interesting discussion. In fact, it should not be hidden in the RB16B topic. Nor clog that up. I also don’t agree it was dealt with too heavy handedly. Short concise message, removal of the crap, and keeping of the interesting discussion, but in the better place.

Fulcrum wrote: ↑

19 May 2021, 05:27

aral wrote: ↑

18 May 2021, 13:52

Rear wing flexing is not peculiar to the RB16B. Further, there is a dedicated thread already on the aero forum, relating to this. Could you please discuss there, and keep this thread purely for the actual RB16B. Thanks

It's quite frustrating observing a moderator interfere with an active discussion on a highly topical issue that was re-invigorated based on the behaviour of this car.

And not the first time this particular moderator has displayed such heavy-handedness either I might add.

Agreed with last point 100%. He goes overboard sometimes, deleting posts that had more than enough relevancy, but he'll for whatever inexplicable reason leave the ones that started it all