2022 Oracle | Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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AR3-GP
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Re: 2022 Oracle | Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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Singapore is undercut friendly....but also VSC/SC friendly...The race will be a bit of a lottery.

Bill
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Re: 2022 Oracle | Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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atanatizante wrote:
Sat Sep 17, 2022 3:18 pm
The reason why RB18 is so fast down the straights and in general, afterall :

another take on pu https://www.formulapassion.it/opinioni/ ... 34419.html

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atanatizante
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Re: 2022 Oracle | Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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Thanx Bill! It seems that the rumours I read are true after all:

... "The strong point is the abundance of energy that allows you to deliver electrical power to the end of the straights without resorting to clipping. This is possible thanks to combustion partially and deliberately sacrificed to have more energy at the exhaust, with which to recharge the battery through the turbine and MGU-H."

https://www-formulapassion-it.translate ... r_pto=wapp

At the above article, it's also an interesting graph regarding PU deployment over a lap in all the races till now, although I wonder which are the proofs that lead to those visual representations:

Image

Then we have a Ferrari vs. Honda clipping graph at Monza where we could see that Honda ERS continue to climb up to the breaking point.:

Image
"I don`t have all the answers. Try Google!"
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Juzh
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Re: 2022 Oracle | Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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atanatizante wrote:
Mon Sep 26, 2022 1:05 pm
Thanx Bill! It seems that the rumours I read are true after all:

... "The strong point is the abundance of energy that allows you to deliver electrical power to the end of the straights without resorting to clipping. This is possible thanks to combustion partially and deliberately sacrificed to have more energy at the exhaust, with which to recharge the battery through the turbine and MGU-H."

https://www-formulapassion-it.translate ... r_pto=wapp

At the above article, it's also an interesting graph regarding PU deployment over a lap in all the races till now, although I wonder which are the proofs that lead to those visual representations:
What rumours? It's been known almost conclusively already since Bahrain GP red bull/honda has ers advantage due to various factors. ERS graphic in this article is a complete miss and there's no way they'd be able to calculate with such precision actual deployment strategies, Theory about sacrificing low end performance for some top end gains is complete nonsense as well, no sane PU manufacturer would employ such tactic, purposely losing out at the start to gain a tiny bit at the end - completely counterproductive. I don't know who comes up with this stuff.

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organic
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Re: 2022 Oracle | Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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kediown
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Re: 2022 Oracle | Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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Anyone have information about what Max was testing?

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Zynerji
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Re: 2022 Oracle | Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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kediown wrote:
Mon Sep 26, 2022 6:52 pm


Anyone have information about what Max was testing?
New RBR Supercar?🤔

AR3-GP
AR3-GP
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Re: 2022 Oracle | Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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RB17 is a good guess although if Max is happy with it...it will have far too much oversteer for the average person :lol:

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ispano6
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Re: 2022 Oracle | Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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Juzh wrote:
Mon Sep 26, 2022 1:25 pm
What rumours? It's been known almost conclusively already since Bahrain GP red bull/honda has ers advantage due to various factors. ERS graphic in this article is a complete miss and there's no way they'd be able to calculate with such precision actual deployment strategies, Theory about sacrificing low end performance for some top end gains is complete nonsense as well, no sane PU manufacturer would employ such tactic, purposely losing out at the start to gain a tiny bit at the end - completely counterproductive. I don't know who comes up with this stuff.
I tend to agree. My colleague and I speculated this year will be more about race pace than qualifying pace, and tyre management is really the key to race pace like most seasons, as seen in Monza and several circuits this year including Miami and Hungary with very contrasting ambient environment. Perhaps there is more to the pull-rod front suspension and gearing working with the floor and diffuser that let's the RB18 really stretch it's legs. The Honda PU is no slouch either but top speed really comes down to corner-exit speed and it seems Max has been able to tame the RB18 and make use of it's strengths.

AR3-GP
AR3-GP
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Re: 2022 Oracle | Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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ispano6 wrote:
Mon Sep 26, 2022 9:54 pm
Juzh wrote:
Mon Sep 26, 2022 1:25 pm
What rumours? It's been known almost conclusively already since Bahrain GP red bull/honda has ers advantage due to various factors. ERS graphic in this article is a complete miss and there's no way they'd be able to calculate with such precision actual deployment strategies, Theory about sacrificing low end performance for some top end gains is complete nonsense as well, no sane PU manufacturer would employ such tactic, purposely losing out at the start to gain a tiny bit at the end - completely counterproductive. I don't know who comes up with this stuff.
top speed really comes down to corner-exit speed and it seems Max has been able to tame the RB18 and make use of it's strengths.
I'm afraid that's very incorrect. Especially in a circuit like Monza or Spa.

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ispano6
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AR3-GP wrote:
Mon Sep 26, 2022 10:30 pm
I'm afraid that's very incorrect. Especially in a circuit like Monza or Spa.
I don't mean having the fastest top speed, I mean fastest way of reaching top speed of a given car set up and characteristics. Having the top speed doesn't necessarily equate to the fastest lap time or best race pace.

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Wouter
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Re: 2022 Oracle | Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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Yesterday in Budapest.

Image

Today in Budapest. How about tomorrow?! :lol: Singapore is calling!

The Power of Honda!

Jaisonas
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Re: 2022 Oracle | Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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atanatizante wrote:
Mon Sep 26, 2022 1:05 pm


... "This is possible thanks to combustion partially and deliberately sacrificed to have more energy at the exhaust, with which to recharge the battery through the turbine and MGU-H."
Wasn't this banned after pre season 2020 causing a massive deficit in opening races?
I recall that we discussed extensively the ""antilag"" sounds and occasional flames with the forced fuel burning on the turbo which Wazari-san confirmed was deliberate and how they disappeared after that.
IIRC the directive ban was the main reason Honda switched concepts in 2021.

Alexf1
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Re: 2022 Oracle | Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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Jaisonas wrote:
Tue Sep 27, 2022 2:06 pm
atanatizante wrote:
Mon Sep 26, 2022 1:05 pm


... "This is possible thanks to combustion partially and deliberately sacrificed to have more energy at the exhaust, with which to recharge the battery through the turbine and MGU-H."
Wasn't this banned after pre season 2020 causing a massive deficit in opening races?
I recall that we discussed extensively the ""antilag"" sounds and occasional flames with the forced fuel burning on the turbo which Wazari-san confirmed was deliberate and how they disappeared after that.
IIRC the directive ban was the main reason Honda switched concepts in 2021.
Combustion of fuel outside the chamber (in the exhaust) was banned yes, not letting late ignited fuel exit the chamber which allows very high energy gasses to pass the MGU-H (my guess is a small part of the total injected fuel is being injected and ignited very late). It's kind of the same idea but legal. They found a way to minimize the ICE loss and maximize the MGU-H gain. This can work if you have a very fuel efficient ICE. Looking at how Max passed George in Zandvoort they've done a pretty good job. Both cars were on max downforce and he still passed him coming from 0.7s back on a relative short straight. That can't be aero and drs only.

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etusch
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Re: 2022 Oracle | Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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is it banned in any way or just combusting it with spark plug in exhoust?