Mercedes W13

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Henri
Henri
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Re: Mercedes W13

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Sidepods will be back.. hope they work

KeiKo403
KeiKo403
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Re: Mercedes W13

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Henri wrote:
Tue May 17, 2022 10:01 am

Sidepods will be back.. hope they work
That’s not quite what it says is it…

They had a preseason test at Barcelona with conventional sidepods and have the data they collected from that car.
Now they come back to Barcelona with the new zeropods car and will collect data from that to compare.

Same track, different car. Both developed using the same CFD/wind tunnel tools.

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carisi2k
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Re: Mercedes W13

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KeiKo403 wrote:
Tue May 17, 2022 11:26 am
That’s not quite what it says is it…

They had a preseason test at Barcelona with conventional sidepods and have the data they collected from that car.
Now they come back to Barcelona with the new zeropods car and will collect data from that to compare.

Same track, different car. Both developed using the same CFD/wind tunnel tools.
Different time of year, different temperatures and therefore the data is not comparable as the pre season test. To truly test it back to back they will need one car of each spec in testing running the same fuel and tyre specs etc to get a true understanding of what is what.

SuperCNJ
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Re: Mercedes W13

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carisi2k wrote:
Tue May 17, 2022 11:33 pm
KeiKo403 wrote:
Tue May 17, 2022 11:26 am
That’s not quite what it says is it…

They had a preseason test at Barcelona with conventional sidepods and have the data they collected from that car.
Now they come back to Barcelona with the new zeropods car and will collect data from that to compare.

Same track, different car. Both developed using the same CFD/wind tunnel tools.
Different time of year, different temperatures and therefore the data is not comparable as the pre season test. To truly test it back to back they will need one car of each spec in testing running the same fuel and tyre specs etc to get a true understanding of what is what.
True, but it's as close as they're going to get. I'm sure there will be some meaningful data they can glean from this despite the different conditions.

astracrazy
astracrazy
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Re: Mercedes W13

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Henri wrote:
Tue May 17, 2022 10:01 am

Sidepods will be back.. hope they work
That's not what they mean.

Besides, the person making the tweet sounds like they don't know what they are talking about. They don't need to go back to the same track to compare data....

Running around Spain this time isn't going to tell them anything they didn't already know from Miami and given the completely different conditions, it isn't comparable (and certainly not a direct comparison) to pre-season anyway.

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atanatizante
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Re: Mercedes W13

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Are the regs allowing them, had they seen benefits, to design a rear wing with the same elongated front mountings flaps as they did with the front wing endplates?

Then, on another note, could be most of the W13 porpoising issues due to the floor which was designed for the winter test session car with the side pods? Maybe they were somehow constrained by the budget cap, updates schedule and logistic reasons not to build a new floor designed specifically for the actual non-pods car?
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PlatinumZealot
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Re: Mercedes W13

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What Aston Martin's Andrew Green thinks of the zero-pods

https://www.auto-motor-und-sport.de/for ... ndy-green/
Can you explain the different sidepods?

Green: The goal is the same for everyone. Everyone wants clean air to get to the rear brake vents and rear diffuser. If you do it right, you can generate good, efficient downforce there. There are basically two approaches. Some bring the air down from above via the side boxes. That's what we call downwash. The others, like us, try to get the air down along the floor with an undercut. When I look at the Mercedes, I get the impression that, in theory, this solution brings the most air energy to the critical points. Once they get rid of the bouncing, this route could be very interesting. But that is not so easy to copy. To do this, you need a purpose-built chassis.
If Mercedes can eliminate the bouncing they will be crazy quick!
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Mchamilton
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Re: Mercedes W13

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PlatinumZealot wrote:
Wed May 18, 2022 12:04 pm
What Aston Martin's Andrew Green thinks of the zero-pods

https://www.auto-motor-und-sport.de/for ... ndy-green/
Can you explain the different sidepods?

Green: The goal is the same for everyone. Everyone wants clean air to get to the rear brake vents and rear diffuser. If you do it right, you can generate good, efficient downforce there. There are basically two approaches. Some bring the air down from above via the side boxes. That's what we call downwash. The others, like us, try to get the air down along the floor with an undercut. When I look at the Mercedes, I get the impression that, in theory, this solution brings the most air energy to the critical points. Once they get rid of the bouncing, this route could be very interesting. But that is not so easy to copy. To do this, you need a purpose-built chassis.
If Mercedes can eliminate the bouncing they will be crazy quick!
I think miami showed it not all about the bouncing, they seem to struggle massively with getting the tires in the operating window

KiLLu12258
KiLLu12258
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Re: Mercedes W13

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Mchamilton wrote:
Wed May 18, 2022 12:24 pm
PlatinumZealot wrote:
Wed May 18, 2022 12:04 pm
What Aston Martin's Andrew Green thinks of the zero-pods

https://www.auto-motor-und-sport.de/for ... ndy-green/
Can you explain the different sidepods?

Green: The goal is the same for everyone. Everyone wants clean air to get to the rear brake vents and rear diffuser. If you do it right, you can generate good, efficient downforce there. There are basically two approaches. Some bring the air down from above via the side boxes. That's what we call downwash. The others, like us, try to get the air down along the floor with an undercut. When I look at the Mercedes, I get the impression that, in theory, this solution brings the most air energy to the critical points. Once they get rid of the bouncing, this route could be very interesting. But that is not so easy to copy. To do this, you need a purpose-built chassis.
If Mercedes can eliminate the bouncing they will be crazy quick!
I think miami showed it not all about the bouncing, they seem to struggle massively with getting the tires in the operating window
i bet the bouncing is not more worth then 2-3 tenths alone, maybe because they can use a better setup without that. Ferrari shows that bouncing alone isnt a big issue and you can be quick anyway. Maybe its worse for mercedes somehow, but at this point i doubt that its still there biggest issue.

napoleon1981
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Re: Mercedes W13

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Im not convinced that getting your concept endorsed by Aston Martin is a good thing. :D

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NicoS
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Re: Mercedes W13

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napoleon1981 wrote:
Wed May 18, 2022 2:35 pm
Im not convinced that getting your concept endorsed by Aston Martin is a good thing. :D
Yes it's one of those typical "let's satisfy the masses commentary" totally lacking any specifics, but it will keep the media happy. and make him look like a good guy.
We can revisit this commentary again at end of season, might shed some light as to the benefit of having Green on the team.

What will he say when they go the conventional route for 2023? what will we say?

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PlatinumZealot
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Re: Mercedes W13

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napoleon1981 wrote:
Wed May 18, 2022 2:35 pm
Im not convinced that getting your concept endorsed by Aston Martin is a good thing. :D
That's a silly thing to say about Andrew Green.
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napoleon1981
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Re: Mercedes W13

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PlatinumZealot wrote:
Wed May 18, 2022 2:57 pm
napoleon1981 wrote:
Wed May 18, 2022 2:35 pm
Im not convinced that getting your concept endorsed by Aston Martin is a good thing. :D
That's a silly thing to say about Andrew Green.
That's your opinion. Supposedly AM is coming with a big upgrade/redesign in Barcelona, lets see if they put their money where there mouth is and actually go that direction (the concept of "zero" sidepod).

icantride
icantride
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Joined: Mon Feb 21, 2022 10:05 am

Re: Mercedes W13

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napoleon1981 wrote:
Wed May 18, 2022 4:01 pm
PlatinumZealot wrote:
Wed May 18, 2022 2:57 pm
napoleon1981 wrote:
Wed May 18, 2022 2:35 pm
Im not convinced that getting your concept endorsed by Aston Martin is a good thing. :D
That's a silly thing to say about Andrew Green.
That's your opinion. Supposedly AM is coming with a big upgrade/redesign in Barcelona, lets see if they put their money where there mouth is and actually go that direction (the concept of "zero" sidepod).
Green says in the next sentence it wouldn't be easy to copy as it requires a chassis designed around that philosophy. We've seen how wide the radiators are packaged on the AM v the Merc

What will be interesting is how all the cars look in 2023 after a year of development and seeing what ideas have merit

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PlatinumZealot
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Re: Mercedes W13

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napoleon1981 wrote:
Wed May 18, 2022 4:01 pm
PlatinumZealot wrote:
Wed May 18, 2022 2:57 pm
napoleon1981 wrote:
Wed May 18, 2022 2:35 pm
Im not convinced that getting your concept endorsed by Aston Martin is a good thing. :D
That's a silly thing to say about Andrew Green.
That's your opinion. Supposedly AM is coming with a big upgrade/redesign in Barcelona, lets see if they put their money where there mouth is and actually go that direction (the concept of "zero" sidepod).
Green is no fool. He is one of the better technical directors. He is highly rated.
Can't see why you would doubt his insight.
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