Can downforce affect tires temperature

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jadatis
jadatis
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Joined: 20 May 2011, 21:54

Re: Can downforce affect tires temperature

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CHT wrote:Using the same theory of a pressure cooker, does anyone know if car with higher down force will increase the tire pressure within the tires and hence affecting the temperature of the tyres?
If there is more downforce on the tire , it will deflect more , yust the same as when there is more weight on it.
I found a relation between the surface on the ground of a tire and the deflection of it, and that is quadratical.
so if downforce or weight on tire is for instance 2 times as much then the deflection is 2*2=4 times as much.
Now I state that the deflection is linear to the heatproduction , so if deflection gets 4 times as much then the difference in temperature between inside and outside the tire also 4 times as much.
So to my conclusion downforce affects tires temperature.
But you can bring the temperature back by highening the pressure , so the deflection gets less and so less heatproduction.
Unless you want higher temperature of the treath to get more gripp.
But to much deflection can damage the tires , by to much bending of the sidewalls , wich can cource blow-out and treath coming loose.
Its not the temperature of the treath or inside tire that damages the tire, but the constant bending of the rubber.
This bending produces energy wich is transformed to heat . But you could get an idea of it by the temperature-rising.
So if it is freesing cold outside the inside tire temperature and treath temperature stay lower but the temperature rising will be about the same.

EDIT: reading back I also read about the pressure rising with the temperature rising.
Especially for racing I once made a spreadsheet to play with the temperature and pressue.
In part 1 a simple calculation of the needed pressure with use of the formula the tire-makers in Europe use and is pretty save for standard load and XL tires . In part 2 you can play with the temperature and even outside pressure to see what it does to the pressure. In part 3 you can give pressure rising and cold inside/outside filling temperature to see what the warm pressure is at that moment.
https://skydrive.live.com/?cid=a526e0ee ... E6DC%21793
Can be found in this map on my skydrive that belongs to my hotmail adress.
First download the pressurecalculationwithtemp spreadsheet by RIGHTCLICKING on it and then choose download.
Dont leftclick or use open in Excell or Web-app , to complicated or goes wrong and you damage the file. If damaged you can get the old back by version history .
After download open in Excell or Open Office CALC to use it.
Will give a picture for a bit higher pressure then used here :wink: for motorhomes.
In that I also calculated the pressure rising and swiched warm and cold pressure , so you can see how you can manipulate the spreadsheet for your need.
Image

CHT
CHT
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Joined: 14 Apr 2008, 05:24

Re: Can downforce affect tires temperature

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guys, thanks for the great explanation.

still on the topic of tyre temperature.

Since F1 cars are rear wheel drive, when the cars are moving in the straight, will the rear tyre temperature be warmer than the front??

jadatis
jadatis
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Joined: 20 May 2011, 21:54

Re: Can downforce affect tires temperature

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When you are driving at constant speed,I think it wont.
But when driving away with spinning wheels a lot of heat is produced by the treath/road slipping.

Jersey Tom
Jersey Tom
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Joined: 29 May 2006, 20:49
Location: Huntersville, NC

Re: Can downforce affect tires temperature

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Driving at constant speed there's still aero drag etc. to overcome so there will still be torque being put into the rear tires.

As for whether the fronts or rears are warmer... there are MANY factors at play. Front and rear inflation pressures, front and rear downforce distribution, camber, how fast you're driving (and how much torque is needed to maintain that speed), etc etc.
Grip is a four letter word. All opinions are my own and not those of current or previous employers.

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SectorOne
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Joined: 26 May 2013, 09:51

Re: Can downforce affect tires temperature

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temperature is an eleven letter word basically ;)
"If the only thing keeping a person decent is the expectation of divine reward, then brother that person is a piece of sh*t"

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strad
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Joined: 02 Jan 2010, 01:57

Re: Can downforce affect tires temperature

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Don't you have tire pressure sensors on your road car?
The rears always gain pressure faster than the fronts cause they are doing the work.
To achieve anything, you must be prepared to dabble on the boundary of disaster.”
Sir Stirling Moss

jknights
jknights
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Joined: 08 Oct 2013, 13:02

Re: Can downforce affect tires temperature

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Ask Red Bull Racing or Adrian Newey he seems to get it right time and time again!
I think the answer is that it depends on the car. ;-)
My answer would be Yes but then I am a PhD Microbiologist/Immunolgist, not Aerodymicist so I know nothing!