F1 Night races

Post here all non technical related topics about Formula One. This includes race results, discussions, testing analysis etc. TV coverage and other personal questions should be in Off topic chat.
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Ray
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Joined: 22 Nov 2006, 06:33
Location: Atlanta

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Really, I'm tired of the uninformed whining about this. It's cheaper to light a track for a night race than build lame tracks like China. That thing cost how much, and it's a really sh*tty track. Lights are cheaper. You invest the money up front to install it, and then you pay for maintenance. Just like anything else. The ones installed around our tracks in the U.S. are loved because they provide more than adequate lighting, with no glare. So I wish they would quit being sissies and do it. Plus most of you that are talking about it being too dark, you are thinking about street lights and such.



http://www.musco.com/projshow/project.p ... otorsports

Read the little side bar on the right about the lumens and cost. The cost of electricity per hour=$240. Cost too much? PLEASE, another lame excuse cause you guys are afraid to do something different, or god forbid use a good idea from an 'inferior' racing series.

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flynfrog
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Joined: 23 Mar 2006, 22:31

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ds.raikkonen wrote:night races are a no no from a driver's point of view..and that too at the challenging Suzuka?they ll be mad to do that! and as already mentioned by yu ppl..its gonna be costly as well...floodlights on the track all around..and the stratospheric bill..and the possibility of drivers drifting off to sleep :wink: ..just kidding..Bernie, plz think again.

here in the states id guess most of the racing is at night ive raced Motocross in the dark for god sakes i actuly prefer it less glare from the sun and its cooler


I guess im trying to say im with Ray

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jddh1
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Joined: 29 Jan 2007, 05:30
Location: New York City

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Don't get me wrong, I'd like to watch a race at night. My only concern is that they work out all the kinks before they do it. I just feel like they are rushing this option a bit too fast. How could they test these systems? Well, how about running the GP2 series this season in the dark and then gather data and driver input from there.

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Ray
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Joined: 22 Nov 2006, 06:33
Location: Atlanta

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There is no data to gather. It's been proven in NASCAR. I don't understand why everyone thinks this is a new concept. It's been done in the US for YEARS at local dirt tracks. If a driver in NASCAR, with thier cramped cars and already limited visibility can see better than in daylight, then what is data is there to gather? There isn't. Swallow your pride and ask someone that knows what they are doing. Like Musco lighting. They are the experts. All this 'data gathering' is what makes F1 so frustrating. Intead of seeking experts in a respective field, everyone wants to spend the money to do worthless testing.


Not that it isn't a good idea to scope out the problems associated with a particular track. Quite the opposite. Do the research on the track in question, but don't balk at it cause it's never been done in F1. It's been done for years elsewhere, F1 isn't so special and 'exclusive' it won't work.

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ds.raikkonen
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Joined: 04 Apr 2007, 08:11

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you cant compare Motocross with F1 for god's sake!! you dont jump around in 'cool' air in F1...neither do you experience 5.5g thru the corners...so dont even think of it! NASCAR drivers have to drive around in oval tracks...things are relatively easier in it than in F1...just stick to the wall and all that...you need 110% visibility in F1...
“Speed has never killed anyone. Suddenly becoming stationary...that’s what gets you.” - JC

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Ray
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Joined: 22 Nov 2006, 06:33
Location: Atlanta

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ds.raikkonen wrote:you cant compare Motocross with F1 for god's sake!! you dont jump around in 'cool' air in F1...neither do you experience 5.5g thru the corners...so dont even think of it! NASCAR drivers have to drive around in oval tracks...things are relatively easier in it than in F1...just stick to the wall and all that...you need 110% visibility in F1...
You are completely missing the point. I compare NASCAR to F1 cause basically they are they same. Racing cars driving at night. ( Or they would be) The SAME principles apply to NASCAR and F1. Proper lighting for Nextel Cup cars, with their visibility problems from the cramped cockpits, is more than enough for an F1 car. If they took advice from Musco lighting, they could light ANY track sufficiently for any racing series. I'm not comparing the racing, the cars, or anything other than if it's sufficient for NASCAR, it's more than enough for F1. You seriously need to watch a NASCAR race before you spout things like that, cause you obviously are ignorant to what the visibility is like from one of those cars. Not to mention you have no idea what it's like to drive one of them. Ask JPM just how easy it is. He's doing really well, but he's not setting the place on fire. If ovals are so easy, and all you have to do is 'stick to the wall', how come he ran so crappy at Bristol? Cause it's not easy, that's why.

You actually CAN compare F1 to motocross as well. IF the subject of comparison is lighting conditions. What flynfrog is trying to get across is (forgive my errors if I'm wrong:lol: ), that racing at night is more comfortable for him. Because the sun is not usually out at night, the temperatures are cooler, and more comfortable. And the more comfortable you are, the harder you can push. Ergonomics for the racer you might say. That and the track is very visible without the sun blinding you. Read more than the words ds.raikkonen, read what the point the person is making.

The principles are the same no matter what kind of race track, series, or cars you are trying to provide lighting for. Lots of light, no weird shadows thrown on the track or caused by cars, and no glare. Musco lighting did that with mirrors. The drivers at places like Daytona say they can see much much better at night because of the design. There is no glare, the light is better than natural sunlight. F1, if they are serious about it, need to swallow their pride and ask for help. Not waste millions doing it their way. They would be much better off, and dare I say more successful.

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ds.raikkonen
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Joined: 04 Apr 2007, 08:11

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hey...i did nt say that NASCAR is easy...i said that its easiER than F1 a bit..i have seen NASCAR...i have even driven a simulation of NASCAR...and i dare say its easier than F1.yes karting has produced great drivers like Senna ,Michael but they ultimately go to F1 to release their real talent... Dude whatever you may think of F1,thats yur story..the fact of the matter is that I still like & respect F1 more than any sport in this wotld..end of story.
“Speed has never killed anyone. Suddenly becoming stationary...that’s what gets you.” - JC

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m3_lover
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Joined: 26 Jan 2006, 07:29
Location: St.Catharines, Ontario, Canada

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Simon: Nils? You can close in now. Nils?
John McClane: [on the guard's phone] Attention! Attention! Nils is dead! I repeat, Nils is dead, ----head. So's his pal, and those four guys from the East German All-Stars, your boys at the bank? They're gonna be a little late.
Simon: [on the phone] John... in the back of the truck you're driving, there's $13 billon dollars worth in gold bullion. I wonder would a deal be out of the question?
John McClane: [on the phone] Yeah, I got a deal for you. Come out from that rock you're hiding under, and I'll drive this truck up your ass.

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ds.raikkonen
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Joined: 04 Apr 2007, 08:11

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hey thanks for that....loved it!!!! moron
“Speed has never killed anyone. Suddenly becoming stationary...that’s what gets you.” - JC

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Tom
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Joined: 13 Jan 2006, 00:24
Location: Bicester

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Ladies, put down your handbags, pick up your wheel guns and read this
Murphy's 9th Law of Technology:
Tell a man there are 300 million stars in the universe and he'll believe you. Tell him a bench has wet paint on it and he'll have to touch to be sure.

bizadfar
bizadfar
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Joined: 03 Jan 2007, 15:51

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ds.raikkonen wrote:hey...i did nt say that NASCAR is easy...i said that its easiER than F1 a bit..i have seen NASCAR...i have even driven a simulation of NASCAR...and i dare say its easier than F1.yes karting has produced great drivers like Senna ,Michael but they ultimately go to F1 to release their real talent... Dude whatever you may think of F1,thats yur story..the fact of the matter is that I still like & respect F1 more than any sport in this wotld..end of story.
What many DO NOT AND 100% FAIL to understand is that NASCAR may look easy at first look. But if it's so easy. Why arn't you number 1? You see it is so difficult to be FAST in NASCAR. Many people say NASCAR has no skill. Say that, then prove it. Because NASCAR is probably the hardest motorsport to be fast in, because it looks so simple. I don't follow NASCAR since we don't have any coverage or news (unless someone dies aka Dale Earnhardt jnr) here. But I bet I understand the sport and it's difficulties way better than Mr ignorant "ds.Raikkonen"

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Scuderia_Russ
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Joined: 17 Jan 2004, 22:24
Location: Motorsport Valley, England.

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lol @ M3
"Whether you think you can or can't, either way you are right."
-Henry Ford-

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ds.raikkonen
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Joined: 04 Apr 2007, 08:11

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look ppl...im not here to contradict you guys...im just giving my opinion..NASCAR may be difficult to drive...maybe coz they dont handle as well as F1 racers...or whatever it is...[/quote]
“Speed has never killed anyone. Suddenly becoming stationary...that’s what gets you.” - JC

DaveKillens
DaveKillens
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Joined: 20 Jan 2005, 04:02

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In the real world, each is as difficult to drive, and each is just as competitive. They are just two completely different disciplines.
I've also raced the simulator, NASCAR 2003 Season online, and it's not easy. For online racing, you have to at least match the computer opponents set at 100%, and that's just scraping by.

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ds.raikkonen
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Joined: 04 Apr 2007, 08:11

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i agree
“Speed has never killed anyone. Suddenly becoming stationary...that’s what gets you.” - JC