F1 world championship without MS

Post here all non technical related topics about Formula One. This includes race results, discussions, testing analysis etc. TV coverage and other personal questions should be in Off topic chat.
-shr3d-
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Joined: 27 May 2003, 07:52
Location: Melbourne, Australia

F1 world championship without MS

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hey all, did you see that F1 racing mag is including an article following this years championship without including one michael schumacher.....
tis dam close and even closer after the european gp...... how many wins do you think he can rack up this season.... without a serious challenge from williams or mclaren and bar and renault only able to offer on occasion you could see maybe 12 or so wins... maybe even more.. :oops:

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Spencifer_Murphy
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Joined: 11 Apr 2004, 23:29
Location: London, England, UK

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I've never liked schumi...maybe cause I grew up watching the likes of Mansell and Hill, and being English I obviously wanted Hill to beat Schumi, their constant battles where thrilling although I grew to dislike schumi...and if i'm honest I still do. BUT...I have always had HUGE respect for the man, and it is statistics like this which explain why...apart from his retirement at Monaco its been a 100% record for him (All wins). Its crazy, Mansell managed the same feat in 1992 but at least then he had to really work hard to get it...Schumi is just running away with this championship. But an interesting thing to look at is how we haven't got the public outcry which we had back in 2002. I think this might be due to the fact that apart from Schumi the rest of the field have all had some really exciting wheel to wheel racing and if we discount schumi the championship has been thrilling...back in 2002 this was not the case as both ferrai's where just in a different league to the rest of the field.

Like i said before I don't like Schumi much...but anyone who doesn't respect his huge talent is simply stupid...the man is almost a living legend...not in the same class as Fangio, Senna, Clark, Stewart or Moss etc. (who else is?!) But schumi is something very very special...a real enigma, and his dominace this season just goes to prove it further.
Silence is golden when you don't know a good answer.

NDR008
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Joined: 20 May 2004, 12:04
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I must agree, in general, out in qualifying, he is always cool, and takes pole, and is as relaxed as can be. On the race he is always elegant driving, i mean he seems like he is not really racing. Unforetnatly, I enjoy seeing Schumi win coz I have grown up to love Italian things, aspecially Ferrari. (Though I would prefer to see Toyota win.) Never the less, i must say it is sad for the F1 sport to see Schumi so drastically better.

-shr3d-
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Joined: 27 May 2003, 07:52
Location: Melbourne, Australia

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hehe, yeah i kind of agree with you both there cause i am a ferrari man but was disappointed when schu went to ferrari cause it meant Alesi was leaving and there is no driver more in love the the scuderia ferrari than him and more passionate bout driving for them....... well maybe schu now.....
and senna was always my favorite driver and always will (even when schu beats his pole positions tally i will still call Ayrton the king of qualifying) but you must give it to him..... noone else comes close when it comes to motivation year in year out...... 5 titles and still hungry as ever.

inspectah
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Joined: 03 Mar 2004, 13:18
Location: Helsinki, Finland

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Well, i guess some of your appraisal is going to the wrong address. It's easy to be cool and confident and drive like you would be driving to the supermarket on sunday, when you have a car that is just incredible comparing to the others, you have another driver securing your back, slowing other drivers down if they get too close, a master tactician, a brilliant design team and a ferrari engine behind you, and reliability that goes beyond words. In the position that schumi is, it would be easy for anyone to be the champion. Though with a little extra talent you can make it even bigger, like schumacher has. But i certainly don't think he is all that much better than Montoya or Räikkönen. I think we saw how much of ferrari's succes is up to schumi last season, when their car wasn't up to the job during the test ban. Schumi got lapped in the race, and he didn't shine with his skills in any way. Infact, he seemed just like any other middlefield crap team driver.
That's why i don't like him, and don't like it when people praise him as the next senna or something. I don't think he really is as special as a six time worldchampion should be, his car is. I give all my credit to ferrari as a team, because they are the ones that have done the amazing job. Schumi is just in the spotlight, taking all the glory with his teamrules and ---.

-shr3d-
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Joined: 27 May 2003, 07:52
Location: Melbourne, Australia

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well i guess we shall find out in a couple of years hey inspectah.... i guess it shall be somewhat like Mclaren when Senna left or dare I say Benetton when Schu left....... and remember I am a Ferrari fan who didnt want him to go there.....
You could even see the effect in 99 when he was injured, Ferrari where still there for awhile with Irvine mouthing off bout not needing him, then they started to decline until schu came back and wiped the field in qualifying for the Malaysian GP by a full second.....
Is he perfect, no... he still cracked under pressure in the Japanese GP last year.. is he more perfect than the rest at building and maintaining a championship challenge, definitively yes....

Monstrobolaxa
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Joined: 28 Dec 2002, 23:36
Location: Covilhã, Portugal (and sometimes in Évora)
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Well being a DAmon Hill fanatic...and now a Montoya fanatic....F1 without Schummy would be a paradise for me!!! :twisted:

rumpelstulskin
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Joined: 26 Jan 2004, 16:56

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wouldn't it be awesome to have a WWF style deathmatch between schumacher and raikonnen on a ferrari if you will.
now that's what i call entertainment!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

-shr3d-
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Joined: 27 May 2003, 07:52
Location: Melbourne, Australia

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ahh what will always be Schumachers achilles heel in the history books..
that he has never had a world class teammate... and that is a shame because that would be very entertaining indeed... mind you i do remember a certain other revered figure who vetoed who could be his teammate during his career when he was in a position to do so... :b

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Spencifer_Murphy
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Joined: 11 Apr 2004, 23:29
Location: London, England, UK

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Its true that Michael is in a very fortunate position, and without being in this position he would be mearly a fraction of what he is view as being. But (and remember I really don't like the man) we have to be careful not to be too biased...I hate Schumi, his antics in his early carear I simply cannot forgive. But Schumi is in the position he is in because of his talent. People praise him for how he "single handedly" turned around Ferrari...which is nonsence because he brought Ross Brawn, Rory Bryne and half the championship winning Benneton design team with him! He did turn Ferrari around single handedly...if single handed means "with the assistance of 100 other talented proffessionals". But saying that we have to remember that to pull THAT many people you have to have some sort of impact on them...impact that only a great (or at the time future great) driver has. But I must agree Schumi has always had the best car in his championship years. He has never made a slow car quick. He has only raced for three teams (his first team Jordan, he left after only a handful of races) so really he hs only raced for two teams for any length of time. Benneton, who where already at the top, and Ferrari who have a phenominal budget...that coupled with half a championship winning team, there was no doubt he was going onto big things. He's good. He may even be great, but he doesn't rank amongst the top 10 ever.

In my view, i think the top 10 ever are (in no particular order):
Juan Manuel Fangio
Alberto Ascari
Jack Brabham
Sterling Moss
Jim Clark
Jackie Stewart
John Surtees
Ayrton Senna
Niki Lauda
Graham Hill

(although I may edit that list in future...I think maybe I have missed out a few drivers)
Silence is golden when you don't know a good answer.

-shr3d-
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Joined: 27 May 2003, 07:52
Location: Melbourne, Australia

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hey spencer..... im going to disagree with you in the strongest terms possible without resorting to flaming.....
to say that schu has never made a slow car quick is absolute nonsense... i dont recall his teammates in 92 or 93 ever looking remotely possible of winning a race and whilst they hit the ground running in 94 with a superb package, 1995 was a very different story and one where Williams had a better car, all year....
then 96 in a quirky Ferrari with a brand new V10 engine he won 3 races whereas in 94 and 95 they only managed 1 a piece... and in 97, still in a john barnard car he managed to drag back a significant margin in early season to almost take the title....
fortunately he has only had the best car available in 94, 01 onwards or the stats could have been way more frightening..
ps. i think the people most significant in turning Ferrari around would be Luca diMontezemelo and Jean Todt in that order because they made the whole Schu process start and dealt with the enormous pressures involved till they won the championship again...

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Spencifer_Murphy
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Joined: 11 Apr 2004, 23:29
Location: London, England, UK

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Okay you're right, I wasn't clear enough. What I meant was that some drivers seem to have this ability to be able to take a slow car and somehow drag pace out of it kicking and screaming. I did not mean a car which was uncompetative (as in your examples) I meant a car that for some reason was not performing at a particular track, or a car that he doesn't like the handling of that much. An example of the former is Hungary last year, for some reason the Ferrari didn't perform too well all weekend, and Michael was helpless to sort it out. An example of the latter is the F2003-GA...its handling characteristics weren't quite to Michael's taste (due to its long wheel base) But Rubens proved the car was a real stunner by matching Schumi's impressive speed almost all season. In the F2003-GA Michael was made to look (for want of a better word) Ordinary...but saying that his true brilliance shone through by still winning the championship (with a bit of help from a bdly timed Tyre complaint and some fortunate weather lol).

Also in '92 Schumi has Brundle as a team mate...brundle used to cause even Senna some real problems in British F3 so he was by no means a slow driver, he was however very unfortunate. Also in '92 the car itself was indeed quick amonst other things the high nose really helped.

You said "in '97 still in a John Barnard car"...are you implying that a John Barnard designed car is not good??? Because if you are you must be forgetting that the man was the genius behind the first ever carbonfibre monocoque F1 chassis. His cars are good (altho i will agree that the '96 model wasn't :oops: )

I will agree with you about the Ferrari turn-around topic however, I don't belive it is all down to Michael (as you probably guessed from my previous post)...But you're right, Luca di Montezemolo and Jean Todt especially have worked what can only be described as miracles.

Oh btw, your comment about his never having a truely world class teamate, it is a shame he never did...I mean could you imagine him and Mika at the same team...it would be Prost and Senna all over again! :D
Silence is golden when you don't know a good answer.

pompelmo
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Joined: 22 Feb 2004, 16:51
Location: Lucija, Slovenia

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I think F1 with out MS would be more interesting!
Than boring! But the organisators will lose a lot of money because
many pople come to see the race yust because MS!
The tickets will be cheaper-jeea :twisted:

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ashf1mclaren
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Joined: 16 Dec 2009, 23:31
Location: United Kingdom

Re: F1 world championship without MS

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hi do any of you have a great team name for my f1 in schools team thanks
Yellow wakes me up in the morning. Yellow gets me on the bike every day. Yellow has taught me the true meaning of sacrifice. Yellow makes me suffer. Yellow is the reason I'm here.

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Giblet
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Joined: 19 Mar 2007, 01:47
Location: Canada

Re: F1 world championship without MS

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2004 called and they want their thread back.
Before I do anything I ask myself “Would an idiot do that?” And if the answer is yes, I do not do that thing. - Dwight Schrute

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