2009 in Review - Fastest Laps (Making Up The Numbers)

[rubbergoat]

Evening all

Tonight I have published the next in the series of Driver Analyses from my blog 'Making Up The Numbers' - this time it's a short post on fastest laps. Hope you like it http://f1numbers.wordpress.com/2009/12/31/2009-in-review-fastest-laps/

The next post will be about 'Driver Consistency', which is what the majority of my posts have been about this year. Look out for that one soon!



//Gavin
http://f1numbers.wordpress.com/

[marcush.]

this one is a very intersting means of comparing driver performance.
but as ever there are the same difficulties as with qualy times :you are hurting those who opt for a strategies sacrificing outright speed for end result.
villeneuve was a good example of a guy who seemed to like strategy starting with a big fuelload and stopping less than others ...so no way his speed would or should be equal to those stopping more often and always run on more fresh rubber or less fuel.
Of course these tactics seldom go your ways and maybe it reflects also on the results achieved ...but there is a point to this.

[mep]

Hey seems like you would be the right person to make a chart about the lap times over the years.
It seems like the people here are just guessing a few hard facts would be nice to see.

viewtopic.php?p=138780&f=1#p138780

[ISLAMATRON]

worthless actually...

It would have been better to each driver's fastest lap over the entire weekend and compare it to his teammates and from that percentage compare overall.

Race fast laps ill be much more meaningful next year when everybody is on the same fuel strategy(although not necessarily on the same tire strategy)

plus all Q's will be on empty tanks, but even still the differences in cars should be taken into account.

[rubbergoat]

worthless actually...

It would have been better to each driver's fastest lap over the entire weekend and compare it to his teammates and from that percentage compare overall.

Race fast laps ill be much more meaningful next year when everybody is on the same fuel strategy(although not necessarily on the same tire strategy)

plus all Q's will be on empty tanks, but even still the differences in cars should be taken into account.

Seems a bit harsh but I see your point - the discussion of comparing between teams has been brought up before on other forums...

I have listed all the drivers individually so you can always compare those

One question - how do you propose to take the differences between cars into account? I can see that you could do it with Fisi this year, but even then you have to factor in circuit types. Any ideas?


//Gavin Brown (RubberGoat)
http://f1numbers.wordpress.com/

[rubbergoat]

Hey seems like you would be the right person to make a chart about the lap times over the years.
It seems like the people here are just guessing a few hard facts would be nice to see.

viewtopic.php?p=138780&f=1#p138780

I'll look into that later, cheers

[rubbergoat]

this one is a very intersting means of comparing driver performance.
but as ever there are the same difficulties as with qualy times :you are hurting those who opt for a strategies sacrificing outright speed for end result.
villeneuve was a good example of a guy who seemed to like strategy starting with a big fuelload and stopping less than others ...so no way his speed would or should be equal to those stopping more often and always run on more fresh rubber or less fuel.
Of course these tactics seldom go your ways and maybe it reflects also on the results achieved ...but there is a point to this.

I guess you could say it's more of a snapshot then - just to see how each driver fares... I would say that this isn't as important as finishing positions or race consistency (which will be coming soon )


//Gavin Brown (RubberGoat)
http://f1numbers.wordpress.com/

[ISLAMATRON]

Seems a bit harsh but I see your point - the discussion of comparing between teams has been brought up before on other forums...

I have listed all the drivers individually so you can always compare those

One question - how do you propose to take the differences between cars into account? I can see that you could do it with Fisi this year, but even then you have to factor in circuit types. Any ideas?


//Gavin Brown (RubberGoat)
http://f1numbers.wordpress.com/

No harshness intended

Outright speed is probably the easiest driver quality that the difference between the car can be taken into account.

Take each driver's fastest lap of the weekend(usually Q2, but sometmes not) add them up over the season and divide by the total of his teams' fastest lap.(if 1 drivers sets them all(like Alonso in '09 then his percentage will be 100).

So lets say the total for RBR this year was 1000 seconds and BGP was 990, normalize the times, and compare between the drivers.

of course this makes several assumptions that dont allways hold up... such as the faster driver extracted 100% from the car(we now that this is not true), and that a car's performance is not track sensitive, also not true... this effects the analysis because the track times are not equal. But those are the obstacles of any comparisons of this type.

[Fil]

interesting that the mods are allowing these threads advertising another website when a previous user had his on-topic posts, advertising his USF1 blog, deleted for doing the exact same.


For the record i do actually visit this site from time to time and do enjoy the detail it takes to the numbers, but share similar concerns to Islam. Feels like some of the analysis is done just for the sake of it.

[rubbergoat]

interesting that the mods are allowing these threads advertising another website when a previous user had his on-topic posts, advertising his USF1 blog, deleted for doing the exact same.


For the record i do actually visit this site from time to time and do enjoy the detail it takes to the numbers, but share similar concerns to Islam. Feels like some of the analysis is done just for the sake of it.

Right... fair enough. I don't want to break the rules but I thought it would be interesting to discuss my results here as the blog is technically minded. However, would it be better if I posted my results and a summary here and then link to the blog posts for further info? Because if that is the case I will be happy to do that instead in future...


//Gavin Brown (RubberGoat)
http://f1numbers.wordpress.com

[rubbergoat]

Seems a bit harsh but I see your point - the discussion of comparing between teams has been brought up before on other forums...

I have listed all the drivers individually so you can always compare those

One question - how do you propose to take the differences between cars into account? I can see that you could do it with Fisi this year, but even then you have to factor in circuit types. Any ideas?


//Gavin Brown (RubberGoat)
http://f1numbers.wordpress.com/

No harshness intended

Outright speed is probably the easiest driver quality that the difference between the car can be taken into account.

Take each driver's fastest lap of the weekend(usually Q2, but sometmes not) add them up over the season and divide by the total of his teams' fastest lap.(if 1 drivers sets them all(like Alonso in '09 then his percentage will be 100).

So lets say the total for RBR this year was 1000 seconds and BGP was 990, normalize the times, and compare between the drivers.

of course this makes several assumptions that dont allways hold up... such as the faster driver extracted 100% from the car(we now that this is not true), and that a car's performance is not track sensitive, also not true... this effects the analysis because the track times are not equal. But those are the obstacles of any comparisons of this type.

Thanks mate. I'll keep that in mind later on if I decide to take a look at this again. To be honest, I am not paying too much attention to fastest laps when evaluating driver performance compared to the other categories I will evaluate (average finishing position, qualifying, consistency) because I don't see fastest laps as that important and there are so many problems comparing 'like for like'.

It's very interesting that when I have posted articles on this forum that there is a high standard of technical feedback - which has not been available on other fora... So I just want to say thanks again, because I take all feedback into consideration in order to improve the quality of the blog posts


//Gavin Brown (RubberGoat)
http://f1numbers.wordpress.com

[ringo]

I am yet to see any data on total overtakes over the season by individual drivers by any other data collectors online.
That would be useful along with total places gained, start to finish, over the season.

[Fil]

interesting that the mods are allowing these threads advertising another website when a previous user had his on-topic posts, advertising his USF1 blog, deleted for doing the exact same.

Right... fair enough. I don't want to break the rules but I thought it would be interesting to discuss my results here as the blog is technically minded. However, would it be better if I posted my results and a summary here and then link to the blog posts for further info? Because if that is the case I will be happy to do that instead in future...

hey, if they're letting you do it this way, then keep on motoring on i say! they'll let u kno otherwise i guess, and at worst merge it all together.

[Giblet]

Rubbergoat is just offering something for us, that is from somewhere else. If this site had a matrix of times over the years, that would be different.

The USF1 blog guy's account was basically just a billboard for links. There was no substance, just a web page holder wanting to steal eyeballs from here, and have his name showing up often in searches of forums that are constantly scrubbed the 50 foot tall google robot.