Limit for front-wheel drive cars?

[ds.raikkonen]

Some say that the absolute limit for a FWD car is 280-320bhp, and after that driving and steering bcomz very difficult or none at all! How true is it? For ex-The Alfa Romeo Brera has a 3.2l V6 and pumps out 320bhp and is FWD, and fromwhat ive seen it can drive very well, ok, its understeery but atleast it turns.

[m3_lover]

I thought the limit was around 200 hp before you get massive amounts of understeer

[ds.raikkonen]

Even the acceleration figure are poor, the Brera does 0-100kph in 8sec!

[vis]

Even the acceleration figure are poor, the Brera does 0-100kph in 8sec!

Brera poor acceleration is spoiled by its high weight, plus front wheel drive lack of traction due to rear biased weight shifting when accelerating. Thus front wheels become unloaded and then can transfer only a limited amount of power to the ground before spinning.

[ds.raikkonen]

Then why did they do that to it? its a beautiful car, cudve gone faster with RWD.

[vis]

Then why did they do that to it? its a beautiful car, cudve gone faster with RWD.

Initial project was to pick a V8 powerplant from Maserati with trans-axle drivetrain, then it was axed in favour of a less expensive in-house all front layout, sourcing the 3.2 V6 from the 147 GTA

[mahesh248]

one of my friends in college told me that he drifted with a ford car which was a front wheel drive .....he was so dum dint even knew how to lie properly ...HEHE Front wheel drives are absolute night mare for race car drivers ..

[ds.raikkonen]

...then it was axed in favour of a less expensive in-house all front layout, sourcing the 3.2 V6 from the 147 GTA

Thats sad really , to make an Alfa and then compromise on vital things like this. You know what, the Brera reminds me of the SLR, with that long bonnet and relatively smaller cabin...ya i know its shocking but thats what i feel.

one of my friends in college told me that he drifted with a ford car which was a front wheel drive ..

dont worry , one of mine was talking about a full 360 in an 800

[kurtiejjj]

I think FWD can handle a bit more than 320 BHP if you bear in mind that most of the 90s FWD supertourers were approaching 320BHP with special diffs, gearbox etc. and according to some they are not awful to drive at all. However you will never get the feel in the steering as you get with RWD.

[Tom]

ds.raikkonen

mahesh248 wrote:

one of my friends in college told me that he drifted with a ford car which was a front wheel drive ..

dont worry , one of mine was talking about a full 360 in an 800

Don't jest you two, I've done far more than 360 degrees in a FWD car before, admittedly spinning uncontrolably on wet grass but thats besides the point , and its entirely possible to do a 360 by simply combining a handbrake turn with a reverse flick (a manouver near impossible in a RWD).

As for drifting, take a look at my video. (Sorry I keep bringing it up but I'm quite proud of it) those minis near the start are clearly sideways without the use of a handbrake! Other options for sliding a FWD car include left foot braking, which is extremely hard to perfect, or the rally bred Scandinavian Flick involving unsettling the car by throwing the weight from side to side which is easy enough below 80km/h but needs a skilled pilot above and is a good way to flip the car.

So just because the guys on Top Gear moan about understeer don't immediately write the car off as an undrivable piece of --- because there are lots of ways to get the car to do what you want if your driving is good enough. Also front wheel drive is considered the most stable format and could easily save your life in slippery conditions. In reverse it can easily out accelerate a RWD in the same gear, even with a much bigger engine, another factor which could easily save someones life.

I'm racing on the 12th and I plan to make another video with lots of different on-board views aswell as capturing competitors, this should proove beyond doubt that front wheel drives are as dynamic and agile as any other, hell I've watched Russ Swift do doughnuts in a new mini!

That all said I'd sure love a go in Gary's Eccy MkII.

[zac510]

I think FWD can handle a bit more than 320 BHP if you bear in mind that most of the 90s FWD supertourers were approaching 320BHP with special diffs, gearbox etc. and according to some they are not awful to drive at all. However you will never get the feel in the steering as you get with RWD.

Indeed. The cars being talked about here seem to be burdened with the limitations of a production/manufacturer-based chassis.

[dumrick]

Other options for sliding a FWD car include left foot braking, which is extremely hard to perfect, or the rally bred Scandinavian Flick involving unsettling the car by throwing the weight from side to side which is easy enough below 80km/h but needs a skilled pilot above and is a good way to flip the car.

I could drift my AX GT just by lifting the throttle, if I was close enough to the lateral limit. In a good FWD you can easily convert under to oversteering that way, which allows you to carry a whole lot of speed through a turn and just hit the right spot on the exit of the turn by lifting and using the rear axle drift to put it inline... from what I've read in the past, it only takes you a good old 205 GTI to have a pleasantly lively rear axle

[Jersey Tom]

1) Every passenger car I know of understeers. Its inherently stable, they design it as such.

2) You can drift a FWD car and all sorts of trick --- with it. Watch the following

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid ... bber&hl=en

3) Can put 300-400 HP in a FWD car easily. Its like asking "well how much power can I put in a RWD car before it just oversteers?" Function of what tires you run, and how clumsy you are with the throttle.

[ds.raikkonen]

Don't jest you two, I've done far more than 360 degrees in a FWD car before, admittedly spinning uncontrolably on wet grass but thats besides the point , and its entirely possible to do a 360 by simply combining a handbrake turn with a reverse flick (a manouver near impossible in a RWD).

Trust me on this one Tom, the cars we were talking about cannot perform 360s...ill give you a snap of the 800, so that youre satisfied..


and another one of the 800 in action

well how much power can I put in a RWD car before it just oversteers?" Function of what tires you run, and how clumsy you are with the throttle.

yes, but horrible oversteer can be corrected, but what about horrible understeer? it cant be ... and another negative pt. of FWD cars is the amount of torture the front tyres have to cope with

[3KGT]

I have read about front wheel drive Hondas with over 600hp, it certainly is possible but makes for terrible handling characteristics. I remember reading about an EG Civic hatchback with around 800bhp, when the journalist that was test driving it pulled along side a Mustang or something at a stop light he got smoked because he could not get the front wheels to grip. I do not think that front wheel drive cars can handle much more than 250bhp.