New Suspension For Formula1 - This may change the race?

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Post Tue Jul 12, 2011 1:57 am

Formula 1 currently using suspension that can not resist roll outward rotation. Therefore, there is so much negative camber on the front wheels. These features are major factors in sub-optimal use of tires. Tires used only on 100% inside. The outer part is almost new. Roll out the rotation is a negative feature because of which there is low stability of the behavior of the car. We have to make an earlier inhibition, which particularly affects overall lap times.
Those who have high stability in cornering - a faster lap time.(RB7, McLaren, Ferrari)
Those who have low stability in cornering - a slow lap time.(HRT, LOTUS, VIRGIN).
I do not think that there is a need to further write the theory of this issue.
I want to get a lot of opinions on my proposed new technology.
I propose a new suspension with active roll and tilt wheel to turn.
The main object of the new suspension is a - forced power center of mass.
Operate in a normal center of mass of suspension did not work. The resulting Roll in turn is a consequence of lack of control over the force of the mass center. Therefore, all solutions to improve the suspension to the subordination of the situation. I suggest that the technology before turning to force tilts the bolid in the direction of rotation. Outer side is lifted. The inner side of a little down. All this happens while turning steering wheel. Power of the center of mass first moves in the direction of rotation - stops with the slowdown - and then belatedly seeks to the outside. But at the time of delay is made a turn.
This property with a new suspension technology allows to wheels have negative (-0.5 degrees). Currently, negative camber is(-3.5....- 5 degrees). This allows for better contact patch with the ground the entire surface of tires on the straight sections of the circle. In turns the wheel tilt and have contact with the ground inside part of the tire.
This feature allows you to have a high focus wheel on the road. The consequence is no sliding and the presence of high stability.

Image

This is a summary of the new technology.
Anyone who has an opinion or suggestion on this issue - please welcome to the discussion.
Last edited by DIM-ON on Thu Jul 14, 2011 12:11 am, edited 3 times in total.
DIM-ON
 
Joined: 12 Jul 2011
Location: Ukraine

Post Tue Jul 12, 2011 2:00 am

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DIM-ON
 
Joined: 12 Jul 2011
Location: Ukraine

Post Tue Jul 12, 2011 5:04 am

How much of a body-roll are you suggesting? Keep in mind, you'll wreck the aerodynamics very quickly.
Saribro
 
Joined: 27 Jul 2006

Post Tue Jul 12, 2011 10:13 am

....
Last edited by DIM-ON on Thu Jul 14, 2011 12:09 am, edited 2 times in total.
DIM-ON
 
Joined: 12 Jul 2011
Location: Ukraine

Post Tue Jul 12, 2011 11:14 am

I think you all for good input and wish you all the best
mikesaturday
 
Joined: 12 Jul 2011

Post Tue Jul 12, 2011 11:44 am

........................ not the rigth place - sorry
Last edited by 747heavy on Fri Jul 15, 2011 1:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.
"Make the suspension adjustable and they will adjust it wrong ......
look what they can do to a carburetor in just a few moments of stupidity with a screwdriver."
- Colin Chapman

“Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication.” - Leonardo da Vinci
747heavy
 
Joined: 6 Jul 2010

Post Tue Jul 12, 2011 1:15 pm

Yes, the plane of the rear wheels CP (contact patch) and the plane of the front wheels CP seem to be different in this photo. Because now I do not show the rear suspension - or rather not showing plane of the rear wheels CP (contact patch).

Good for you that drew attention. Yes of course the rear wheels as well change the slope but this is much later. Now I've shown the front part.
DIM-ON
 
Joined: 12 Jul 2011
Location: Ukraine

Post Tue Jul 12, 2011 1:27 pm

I currently interested in opinions on the emergence of a new idea. I showed the new state in turn. This condition is not usual for an ordinary car. Especially for Formula 1.
In 1998 Mercedes Benz Presents - Multi-track curve tilting vehicle technology. This technology has been implemented in a prototype Mercedes Benz F300 Life Jet.
In 2001, a continuation of improvement (tilting vehicle technology) was the emergence of a prototype Mercedes Benz F400 CARVING.
All presented technologies showed excellent result, but weren't suitable for use on serial cars from for kinematics and the operating equipment which a lot of place under a cowl took where there should be a car engine.
DIM-ON
 
Joined: 12 Jul 2011
Location: Ukraine

Post Tue Jul 12, 2011 1:44 pm

....
Last edited by DIM-ON on Thu Jul 14, 2011 12:10 am, edited 1 time in total.
DIM-ON
 
Joined: 12 Jul 2011
Location: Ukraine

Post Tue Jul 12, 2011 2:20 pm

Yes active roll control would be an improvement. But the only reason such a system is not currently used is that its illegal.

The active elements of a suspension bring in many other secondary (and primary) effects beyond the roll angle of the chassis and the direction of the wheels. That is basically why its banned (unfortunately). Because it would become a massively expensive arms race once its legalised

Tim
Not an engineer at Caterham F1
Tim.Wright
 
Joined: 13 Feb 2009

Post Tue Jul 12, 2011 2:25 pm

The active elements of the suspension changed clearance only. The active elements of the suspension never opposed roll in cornering
DIM-ON
 
Joined: 12 Jul 2011
Location: Ukraine

Post Tue Jul 12, 2011 2:46 pm

Well, good point and nice idea. Yep, camber is huge. Did you make multibody analysis?

The suspensions I have seen have anti roll bars, both in front and in the rear. They also use sensors to measure suspension travel, connected to the bellcranks.

Picture provided by Scarbs here: viewtopic.php?f=6&t=8737&start=40
Image

Isn't that enough to control roll? I'd guess so.

As Tim Wright (hi, Tim, long time, nice to coincide, missing you) says, if you allow active suspensions, then, we're back to the 90's novel. Given Senna's fate...

Finally, when you allow some roll, you're changing downforce balance by changing floor tilting, aren't you? I'd guess that's the critical point in design but I'm not sure AT ALL. Xpensive noted that in some thread I cannot find. Perhaps the SAE guys (flyn, mep) can clarify this.
Last edited by Ciro Pabón on Tue Jul 12, 2011 2:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Ciro
Ciro Pabón
 
Joined: 10 May 2005

Post Tue Jul 12, 2011 2:53 pm

........................ not the rigth place - sorry
Last edited by 747heavy on Fri Jul 15, 2011 1:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.
"Make the suspension adjustable and they will adjust it wrong ......
look what they can do to a carburetor in just a few moments of stupidity with a screwdriver."
- Colin Chapman

“Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication.” - Leonardo da Vinci
747heavy
 
Joined: 6 Jul 2010

Post Tue Jul 12, 2011 2:57 pm

Thanks, heavy, I didn't think about that. Tyre model is essential in the multibody analysis.
Ciro
Ciro Pabón
 
Joined: 10 May 2005

Post Tue Jul 12, 2011 3:06 pm

Design and aerodynamics can be a huge obstacle. Bias is present in Formula 1 cars, but not seen since the mass-produced cars. The outer part of the Formula 1 cars are not omitted. Rises only internal. So can not continue.
DIM-ON
 
Joined: 12 Jul 2011
Location: Ukraine

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