Steel in modern F1

Here are our CFD links and discussions about aerodynamics, suspension, driver safety and tyres. Please stick to F1 on this forum.
ChipAyten
0
Joined: 23 Sep 2012, 09:18

Steel in modern F1

Post

With the development of modern lighter materials what parts of the car are still made from steel? Piston rods, axle shaft, pins, crank bearings? Just some I suspect.

Jersey Tom
166
Joined: 29 May 2006, 20:49
Location: Huntersville, NC

Re: Steel in modern F1

Post

Hubs too I'd imagine.

Steel is good stuff. Don't fall into the trap of thinking it's heavy.. and that heavy is bad. I'll admit my knowledge of steel specs outside the US is a bit rusty (pun!)... but stuff like 4340 and 300M (or EN24, EN26, EN36A ??) can have very, very high yield strength. When you have a high yield strength you can typically use less material and lightweight steel parts.

Really it's a question of efficiency, how much strength can you get per some size and mass of part - and that varies with alloying and temper. For that matter you could have aluminum parts made from some crap alloy which then wind up being quite heavy.
Grip is a four letter word. All opinions are my own and not those of current or previous employers.

Smokes
4
Joined: 30 Mar 2010, 17:47

Re: Steel in modern F1

Post

i agree with jersey tom you need to used the right material for the application and steel is still the best material in terms of strenght to weight ratio and cost for a lot of high stress applications

marcush.
159
Joined: 09 Mar 2004, 16:55

Re: Steel in modern F1

Post

exhaust systems are entirely made from Inconel 625 steel .Some motorcyle exhausts have been made from ti but as i understand that has not happened in Formula 1 lately.
I hear a german company just developped some new Ti alloy to serve high temperature exhaust applications.(S+D Spezialstahl gmbH)the maximum temperature capability is 800°C ...maybe a bit marginal for formula 1 applications..

If anyone had a chance to hold a complete formula 1 exhaust in his hands he would stop to think of steel as a "heavy"material....
Data sheet Inconel 625:
http://www.bibusmetals.ch/pdf/datasheet ... %20625.pdf

noname
10
Joined: 13 Feb 2009, 11:55
Location: EU

Re: Steel in modern F1

Post

Ti can handle high temperature but does not like when its range is too wide.
Not sure about F1, but one of the leading Le Mans teams is using steel pistons. Due steel's high strength they can be lighter than AL ones.

Tommy Cookers
617
Joined: 17 Feb 2012, 16:55

Re: Steel in modern F1

Post

marcush. wrote:exhaust systems are entirely made from Inconel 625 steel .
Data sheet Inconel 625:
http://www.bibusmetals.ch/pdf/datasheet ... %20625.pdf
Inconel is not steel
(look at the composition, the Iron content is small)

there are families of super-strength steels eg 'Maraging' steels that are hugely valuable for some work
Vascomax is a brand that comes to mind

some others classed as steel are the reason for the mandating/banning of some materials in F1 (to avoid cost escalation)
(super-strength steels (like other metals) will not have good fatigue lives if the designer uses their full strength, eg about the only place in aviation that uses such steels is carrier aircraft tailhooks, they are only used (loaded in 1 direction) about 500 times)

Richard
Moderator
Joined: 15 Apr 2009, 14:41
Location: UK

Re: Steel in modern F1

Post

This prompts a statistic often quoted by another member ....
xpensive wrote:Modulus over density:

Steel: 2.1 E11 / 7800 = 26.9 E6

Aluminium: 0.7 E11 / 2700 = 25.9 E6

Titanium: 1.1 E11 / 4500 = 24.4 E6

Magnesium: 0.45 E11 / 1740 = 25.9 E6

Beryllium: 2.9 E11 / 1850 = 157 E6 !!!

marcush.
159
Joined: 09 Mar 2004, 16:55

Re: Steel in modern F1

Post

Tommy Cookers wrote:
marcush. wrote:exhaust systems are entirely made from Inconel 625 steel .
Data sheet Inconel 625:
http://www.bibusmetals.ch/pdf/datasheet ... %20625.pdf
Inconel is not steel
(look at the composition, the Iron content is small)

there are families of super-strength steels eg 'Maraging' steels that are hugely valuable for some work
Vascomax is a brand that comes to mind

some others classed as steel are the reason for the mandating/banning of some materials in F1 (to avoid cost escalation)
(super-strength steels (like other metals) will not have good fatigue lives if the designer uses their full strength, eg about the only place in aviation that uses such steels is carrier aircraft tailhooks, they are only used (loaded in 1 direction) about 500 times)

My bad -has steel necessarily Fe content ? I was a bit negligeant on that side as stainless steel like 310 or 321 do have zero Fe content so i did not bother.

Tommy Cookers
617
Joined: 17 Feb 2012, 16:55

Re: Steel in modern F1

Post

on the whole these metals in Richard's list complement each other rather than compete with each other
(because they have roughly equal specific stiffness and specific strength, but very different densities)

often the stiffness of a structure determines its strength, a low density material will allow greater thickness for the same weight, the stiffness will be much greater, so the structure will be stronger
a steel monocoque built down to the weight of an aluminium alloy one will be so thin it will crinkle like a drink can
a magnesium alloy one will need to be only slightly thicker than an aluminium alloy one to be equally strong, but will be lighter
'carbon fibre' etc have even lower density, also wood

the strength of a connecting rod will not be affected by stiffness issues, so steel is competitive
Ferrari had a gearbox casing of steel because it was physically smaller than anything else for the required strength

Beryllium as shown is too brittle for use (alloyed with Aluminium it is still remarkable, but it's still a very difficult material)

@marcush.
in my understanding anything called steel (eg stainless steel) should have Iron (Fe) as the main constituent, but many of these classifications are a bit artificial anyway, accidents of history
eg Maraging steel has a lot of Nickel (and some have a lot of Cobalt), the Elastic Modulus is lower than any normal steel's
Last edited by Tommy Cookers on 03 Nov 2012, 23:00, edited 1 time in total.

Jersey Tom
166
Joined: 29 May 2006, 20:49
Location: Huntersville, NC

Re: Steel in modern F1

Post

Another advantage to steel is hardness and abrasion resistance. There are some applications (IMO like centerlock hub threads) where that's a critical requirement.

For as wonderful as aerospace Titanium and Aluminum alloys are, they are relatively soft and easy to abrade. At least with Aluminum you can hard anodize, but that has some challenges in itself.
Grip is a four letter word. All opinions are my own and not those of current or previous employers.

User avatar
humble sabot
27
Joined: 17 Feb 2007, 10:33

Re: Steel in modern F1

Post

marcush. wrote:My bad -has steel necessarily Fe content ? I was a bit negligent on that side as stainless steel like 310 or 321 do have zero Fe content so i did not bother.
If you relook at the chemical composition of 310 and 312, you'll note that the Iron content is classified as the balance after the Ni, Cr, C, S etc. are added. This comes out to between 48 and 51 percent for 310; and just under 48% for 312.
the four immutable forces:
static balance
dynamic balance
static imbalance
dynamic imbalance

aussiegman
105
Joined: 07 Feb 2012, 07:16
Location: Sydney, Hong Kong & BVI

Re: Steel in modern F1

Post

ChipAyten wrote:With the development of modern lighter materials what parts of the car are still made from steel? Piston rods, axle shaft, pins, crank bearings? Just some I suspect.
So, from the FIA 2012 regs directly:

9.6.4 Gear ratios must be made from steel. - So the gear ratio's are steel

10.5.2 The loads from the suspension members and wheel bearings must individually and entirely be carried by the suspension upright. Exceptionally up to three suspension members may be connected together by titanium, aluminum alloy or steel components before their load is passed into the upright. - So some of the suspension can be steel

5.17.2 Piston pins must be manufactured from an iron based alloy and must be machined from a single piece of material. - Whilst specified as steel, high strength steel predominately I'd expect

5.17.3 Connecting rods must be manufactured from iron or titanium based alloys and must be machined from a single piece of material with no welded or joined assemblies (other than a bolted big end cap or an interfered small end bush). - I expect most to be titanium, however they could be steel if required.

5.17.4 Crankshafts must be manufactured from an iron based alloy. -Again, not steel specifically, high strength steel predominately I'd expect

5.17.5 Camshafts must be manufactured from an iron based alloy. - Again, steel

5.17.6 Valves must be manufactured from alloys based on Iron, Nickel, Cobalt or Titanium. Hollow structures cooled by sodium, lithium or similar are permitted. - possibly steel but I expect titanium (intake) and inconel (exhaust) to dominate.

5.17.7 Reciprocating and rotating components: b) Rolling elements of rolling element bearings must be manufactured from an iron based alloy. - and again.

Pistons are typically aluminum based alloys, either Al-Si, Al-Cu, Al-Mg, or Al-Zn.

Gearbox cases (as said), hubs, some fasteners and a few other parts would/could use various steels.
Never approach a Bull from the front, a Horse from the back, or an Idiot from any direction

User avatar
WhiteBlue
92
Joined: 14 Apr 2008, 20:58
Location: WhiteBlue Country
Contact:

Re: Steel in modern F1

Post

Anchor plates in MGUs are also iron based. Steel
In the alternator as well.
In the clutch
In the diff
The steering assy
Various pumps
Hydraulics
In spark plugs
Fuel injectors
Sensors
Bearings
Formula One's fundamental ethos is about success coming to those with the most ingenious engineering and best .............................. organization, not to those with the biggest budget. (Dave Richards)

User avatar
Kiril Varbanov
147
Joined: 05 Feb 2012, 15:00
Location: Bulgaria, Sofia
Contact:

Re: Steel in modern F1

Post

Titanium wing insert from Jenson's BAR Honda from 2006.
Weight: 14 gr, length - 4 cm. Part number when full zoomed. I was really surprised by the weight.
Now in my pocket :)

Image

aussiegman
105
Joined: 07 Feb 2012, 07:16
Location: Sydney, Hong Kong & BVI

Re: Steel in modern F1

Post

WhiteBlue wrote:Anchor plates in MGUs are also iron based. Steel
In the alternator as well.
In the clutch
In the diff
The steering assy
Various pumps
Hydraulics
In spark plugs
Fuel injectors
Sensors
Bearings
The spherical bearings and fasteners in these titanium suspension plates and suspension mounts I just checked and they are steel.

Image
Never approach a Bull from the front, a Horse from the back, or an Idiot from any direction