Exhaust Idea

[eiterndergoblin]

hi folks

inspired by this :
http://www.formula1.com/news/technical/2007/778/444.html

i thought about accelerating the air passing underneath the car with the help of the hot air exiting the exhaust pipes, by changing their position. would this be legal to use according to the rules ? would this be better than the hot air accelerating the air passing underneath the rear wing (as it is now ?!), wich causes a similiar effect ? (correct me if i´m wrong)
i´m quite sure the cooling problems wich would appear can be solved somehow ^^

here is an image of what i´m thinking about :



here the url, if it doesnt work : http://www.bilder-space.de/show.php?file=DGCdQQrgjqTRvaC.jpg

placing the exhaust quite in the middle would help avoiding huge tyre wear due to too much heat i guess

and here a cross-sectional image, for better understanding ^^



here the url, if it doesnt work :
http://www.bilder-space.de/thumb/2OReOF6itmg6I4W.jpg

sorry for bad drawing skills xD
i just hope you understand what i´m thinking about ^^

[Conceptual]

I'm pretty sure that the teams used to do this, although I do not know the reason that they dont do it today. Possibly regulation related.

Chris

[Jersey Tom]

Used to be done. But with that, you start developing a strong dependency on engine revs for downforce. Not good. Hard enough to manage when it falls off so rapidly with speed.

[Belatti]

In 1998 Ferrari began to use the action-reaction principle, the same used to accelerate rockets: exhaust gases going up, pushes the car down.

Apparently then designers began to lean back exhaust pipes again, I suppose because it was disruptive for airflow.

I´m sure that in Top Fuel cars that huge 8 pipes pointing up must do a lot to press that car against the floor, and they are not in the way of rear wing airflow.

Now I´m thinking in placing a wing just after the pipe

[DaveKillens]

About a decade ago, the exhaust used to exit the car down low, right inside the diffuser. Apparently though, changing revs would alter the gas flow, thus affecting the balance of the car. Get on the gas, more downforce via the diffuser. Get off the gas, less downforce. But imagine a car in a very fast sweeper, and suddenly a slower car was ahead. Get off the gas in a fast sweeper, the car loses grip... slip slide into the grass and worse. So eventually, the exhaust migrated away from the diffuser and exited on top of the rear of the sidepod. The fore and aft balance of the car was no longer affected by the position of the driver's foot.

[modbaraban]

Benneton B188

[eiterndergoblin]

hm mkay
sorry guys, didn´t knew that
but nevertheless, thx alot

[WhiteBlue]

plus exiting in the middle would not be possible due to the "wooden" plank

[CMSMJ1]

Also due to the increased revs of modern engines the optimal length of the headers is shorter and so the periscope design is the only real solution.

I can recall a quote form the 80's where a "you could see the car squat" when the throttle was blipped!

[RJC_pt]

I can recall a quote form the 80's where a "you could see the car squat" when the throttle was blipped!

That quote was on brabham bt46 fancar....

[mini696]

The downforce created by facing them up would be mimimal at best.

The teams dont guide them into the diffuser now because of the "waisting" of the cars. They gain more advantage having the car "coke-bottled" than the exhaust does producing downforce.

Also the diffuser is so small now, any disruption to the smooth flow would be negative. Having the exhaust sticking into the diffuser as shown above is again more negative than positive.

Tuning the differences in pressure at different revs would be even more difficult now because of the smaller diffuser too.

[WhiteBlue]

I can recall a quote form the 80's where a "you could see the car squat" when the throttle was blipped!

That quote was on brabham bt46 fancar....

Jeeze, look at those tyres.... FAT

[mini696]

I can recall a quote form the 80's where a "you could see the car squat" when the throttle was blipped!

That was because of the extra suspension travel and softer spring rate of that era.

[CMSMJ1]

I can recall a quote from the 80's where a "you could see the car squat" when the throttle was blipped!

That was because of the extra suspension travel and softer spring rate of that era.

I would have said the flat bottomed cars would run stiffer settings than modern day cars and certainly when the cars had skirts (or fans) the ride height had to be very stiffly controlled.

Do you not agree?

[mep]

But they moved the exhaust on top of the car wile they still
had the bigger diffusors, so the reason can't be the change in the rules.
I still wonder what effect it exactly makes to let them point up.
The effect must be better than leting point them into the diffusor.

The stability of the car is true but who cares on it.
The cars are designet to be fastest on one hot lap and the driver
simply has to get used to the cars handling.