2014 Singapore GP - Marina Bay, September 19-21

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SectorOne
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Re: 2014 Singapore GP - Marina Bay, September 19-21

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prince wrote:Assuming that both Nico and Lewis starts with equal load of fuel; With that kind of fuel consumption difference, Lewis carries performance penalty in the later stages of race as he would be carrying more fuel than others. Although he would be free to go much faster than others, the remaining fuel load will nullify that advantage.
If they run the same fuel load he´s at a disadvantage from the get go because he´s carrying fuel in the car he will never need in the race.

Looking at the graph that would be an extra three kilos of worthless weight.
"If the only thing keeping a person decent is the expectation of divine reward, then brother that person is a piece of sh*t"

oT v1
oT v1
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Re: 2014 Singapore GP - Marina Bay, September 19-21

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Let's bet on how many 1000's of times we will see the hotel swimming pool on the roof in-shot during the weekend! Its sooooooo old FOM, pls stop
The Power of Dreams

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Phil
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Re: 2014 Singapore GP - Marina Bay, September 19-21

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SectorOne wrote:
prince wrote:Assuming that both Nico and Lewis starts with equal load of fuel; With that kind of fuel consumption difference, Lewis carries performance penalty in the later stages of race as he would be carrying more fuel than others. Although he would be free to go much faster than others, the remaining fuel load will nullify that advantage.
If they run the same fuel load he´s at a disadvantage from the get go because he´s carrying fuel in the car he will never need in the race.

Looking at the graph that would be an extra three kilos of worthless weight.
I still see no reason to believe the team is underfueling him relative to his team-mate (apart from logic that is). Identical fuel loads = identical cars (at the start) - and what each driver does with it, is up to them I guess. One could also say both drivers get the reference amount and Nico just has to work a bit harder to not run out at the end. I really do wonder why none of the press people have ever confronted Toto with this question. It'd be great to get official clarification if they are aware of the fuel differences and what they are doing about it.
Not for nothing, Rosberg's Championship is the only thing that lends credibility to Hamilton's recent success. Otherwise, he'd just be the guy who's had the best car. — bhall II
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SectorOne
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Re: 2014 Singapore GP - Marina Bay, September 19-21

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I agree, i made a similar point and i´m as amazed as you that no journalist has asked this simple question.
Particularly when Rosberg in so many scenarios has been told to save fuel and Hamilton using less then him.

So if they have unequal fuel loads, Rosberg carrying more then why does he have to save fuel?
I´m just confused by the whole thing and some official clarification would be nice.
"If the only thing keeping a person decent is the expectation of divine reward, then brother that person is a piece of sh*t"

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Pierce89
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Re: 2014 Singapore GP - Marina Bay, September 19-21

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MercedesAMGSpy wrote:I think Lewis Hamilton isn't a big Brembo fan after Hockenheim.
I woulnt be so sure. He was using them because they offer a "better feel". That means a lot.p
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mrluke
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Re: 2014 Singapore GP - Marina Bay, September 19-21

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SectorOne wrote:I agree, i made a similar point and i´m as amazed as you that no journalist has asked this simple question.
Particularly when Rosberg in so many scenarios has been told to save fuel and Hamilton using less then him.

So if they have unequal fuel loads, Rosberg carrying more then why does he have to save fuel?
I´m just confused by the whole thing and some official clarification would be nice.
Presumably the amount of fuel Nico would need to avoid having to save fuel in the race would hinder his qualifying too much.

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FW17
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Re: 2014 Singapore GP - Marina Bay, September 19-21

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Read somewhere that Hamilton has perfected lift and coast while making the deficit time in the corners. If he manages to lift for about 200 m (about 15m every corner) every lap that would mean 2 laps fuel through the race distance.

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SectorOne
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Re: 2014 Singapore GP - Marina Bay, September 19-21

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mrluke wrote:Presumably the amount of fuel Nico would need to avoid having to save fuel in the race would hinder his qualifying too much.
You got me, i´m confused :D Could you expand?

Edit: picked up an interesting piece from Hamilton in the interview below.

"It´s gonna be really important that we are on the same strategy always because there´s been a couple times where perhaps Nico´s been on a different strategy to me and what that gives is either more or less power"

http://www1.skysports.com/f1/news/12433 ... -clampdown

Are they perhaps giving the second fiddle guy more power to make up for the strategy deficit?
That way they ensure a battle in the end but it will separate them mid-race (for safety reasons i presume)
"If the only thing keeping a person decent is the expectation of divine reward, then brother that person is a piece of sh*t"

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gray41
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Re: 2014 Singapore GP - Marina Bay, September 19-21

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WilliamsF1 wrote:Read somewhere that Hamilton has perfected lift and coast while making the deficit time in the corners. If he manages to lift for about 200 m (about 15m every corner) every lap that would mean 2 laps fuel through the race distance.
He doesn't get the benefit as it would be unfair on Rosberg, those two laps could be used with maximum engine settings.
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iotar__
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Re: 2014 Singapore GP - Marina Bay, September 19-21

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WilliamsF1 wrote:Read somewhere that Hamilton has perfected lift and coast while making the deficit time in the corners. If he manages to lift for about 200 m (about 15m every corner) every lap that would mean 2 laps fuel through the race distance.
This is getting weirder and weirder as always when it's about Hamilton
- perfected lift and coast, what's there to perfect? Are you sure it wasn't about some regular throttle application, down-shifting, longer gears, style etc.= micro "lifting and coasting" (not really) that cumulates into fuel savings?
- he doesn't use fuel in corners? if he uses less wouldn't that be a separate issue (from "perfect lift and coast")? Not only corners of course, gear-changes, throttle, lines, braking - everything else apart from end of straight coasting, like Monaco for example when there's no place to do that.
- it didn't help him every time Rosberg was faster in races, many times
- we're talking about stages of races when fuel is an issue - lifting and coasting, longer gears (as Rosberg in did in Monaco), fuel setting independent from drivers and stages when it's not and they drive without corrections
- I would say it's more about style to run at maximum pace comfortably (shifting, throttle, lines etc.) and trade off with power/fuel saving. End result is those 2 kg or whatever it is on average between them. Tyres also dictate pace, they don't drive as comfortably as they want all the time.
- shouldn't almost certain safety car make it less problematic in Singapore? That's the issue, I think : dividing race into stages when you don't care and care about fuel, they can assume safety car happens but it might be risky when you don't know when. That's why all this monitoring and letting driver know was important from strategy point of view.
- good to see that the first topic after banning communication is who uses more fuel - focus on the right thing FIA/FOM #-o .

Richard
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Re: 2014 Singapore GP - Marina Bay, September 19-21

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Driving style and fuel use needs a new thread all of its own ....

:arrow: http://www.f1technical.net/forum/viewto ... =1&t=20195

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SiLo
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Re: 2014 Singapore GP - Marina Bay, September 19-21

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I'm just wondering how many broken rear suspensions we are going to see, or rear punctures as the larger amount of oversteer moments result in walls being touched... Could ruin a fair few peoples day!
Felipe Baby!

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Redragon
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Re: 2014 Singapore GP - Marina Bay, September 19-21

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SectorOne wrote:
prince wrote:Assuming that both Nico and Lewis starts with equal load of fuel; With that kind of fuel consumption difference, Lewis carries performance penalty in the later stages of race as he would be carrying more fuel than others. Although he would be free to go much faster than others, the remaining fuel load will nullify that advantage.
If they run the same fuel load he´s at a disadvantage from the get go because he´s carrying fuel in the car he will never need in the race.

Looking at the graph that would be an extra three kilos of worthless weight.
Well if we check the weight of both drivers, the difference between Hamilton (68 Kg) and Rosberg (71Kg) is 3 kg, that disadvantage it is gain by body weight

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SectorOne
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Re: 2014 Singapore GP - Marina Bay, September 19-21

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Redragon wrote:Well if we check the weight of both drivers, the difference between Hamilton (68 Kg) and Rosberg (71Kg) is 3 kg, that disadvantage it is gain by body weight
Assuming the car is over the weight limit. If it´s below then those 3kg´s is only marginal through weight distribution.
And CoG i suppose assuming that weight sits in Rosberg´s torso rather then legs or evenly distributed.
"If the only thing keeping a person decent is the expectation of divine reward, then brother that person is a piece of sh*t"

Kingshark
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Re: 2014 Singapore GP - Marina Bay, September 19-21

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Here's an interesting statistic I found on another site:

ALO statistic in singapore - including FP1, FP2, FP3, Q1, Q2, Q3 and race from 2008-2013:
ALO outqualified/finished ahead of his team-mate in 41 of 42 occasions.
Only Felipe Massa was quicker 2013 in Q3 due to a bad last sector of ALO by 0.048 sec.

Other drivers with impressive stats around Singapore include Vettel, who is 36-6, and Rosberg, who is 30-11.