Infiniti Red Bull Racing 2013

[CHT]

Since Malaysia race thread is locked, thought I post this here.

Interesting analysis on the event.


http://www.planetf1.com/editorial/86096 ... ng-Vettel-

[Juzh]

Since Malaysia race thread is locked, thought I post this here.

Interesting analysis on the event.


http://www.planetf1.com/editorial/86096 ... ng-Vettel-

Good article. What we still dont know is when exactly was webber's car turned down more than sebastian's. For all we know it was after seb passed him when the time difference started to build up between them. If mark seriously turned his engine down when they were battling for position thinking he's in the clear because of some pre-race agreement, then he deserved to loose even more.

[turbof1]

http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2013/04/10/v ... e-winning/

It kind of feels like it is still lingering in the team isn't it? No doubt it was an answer to question, but if you outright state you don't want to apologise for taking the win [like that], without going further into it, it doesn't really tell you he is sorry at all.

[raymondu999]

http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2013/04/10/v ... e-winning/

It kind of feels like it is still lingering in the team isn't it? No doubt it was an answer to question, but if you outright state you don't want to apologise for taking the win [like that], without going further into it, it doesn't really tell you he is sorry at all.

I think the important thing to note here is that the two comflicting messages were given in two separate states - an adrenalin-riddled racing driver just out of his car, versus a clearheaded young man who's had time to reflect and think.

It could be that Vettel was afraid of media backlash just after the race, and in a semi-panicked self-defense mechanism, apologised. Now though, with time to reflect and think through - perhaps he's decided that he's unapologetic after all.

[turbof1]

Remember, he apologied after the race because his team told him so. Looks like he more reflected on whether he needs to listen to his team.

EDIT: found this article (in dutch, sorry. throw it through google translate):
http://www.f1journaal.be/index.php/nieu ... +F1+Nieuws

Essentially Helmut Marko says that Dietrich Mateschitz wants the team to quit giving team orders. Furthermore, it was actually Adrian Newey who gove the order multi21.

[Red Schneider]

What if the team fined Vettel a million dollars and gave the money to Webber every time Vettel violates a team order? Either you can make the fine large enough that Vettel will back down or you can search for the right amount so that Webber accepts his compensation and a satisfactory outcome is achieved for all.

Making Vettel sit out a race is ludicrous, because it would hurt the team.

[Cam]

Vettel's infractions are so minor in comparison as to be almost laughable really. Put him side by side with Tiger Woods, who lost sponsors, ranking, a family, copious amount of cash, the list goes on, but at the end of the day.....



Whoever keeps winning, won't have an issue, certainly not from the benefactors of those wins.

[ringo]

Tiger was unsportsmanlike however. His transgressions were outside of the sport.

[turbof1]

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/106631

Looks like the worst case scenario for Red Bull as a team. Very harsh statements towards Webber.

Winning is one thing, taking a win like that is an other thing, but giving such an interview 3 weeks after, without any sign of even a bit of remorse or care about the consequences inside the team, that's way off the planet. Next time these 2 find eachother fighting for a position, they will end up like Prost and Senna.

[rkn]

Huge statements from Vettel.

Even though i feel Webber was clearly robbed of a victory and that Vettel's actions were immature and disgusting, i actually respect Vettel more after reading that interview. First of all he is right in that he is a racer not only as a person but as professional. Second of all, we all know that the apologies he made to Mark were false and pure media bullsh**. The fact that he is defending his actions, and publicly saying he would have done it again is proof that he thinks he did the right thing. IMO you always should do what you think is right, especially if that is something you know you would do again. But he also displays a clear double standard when he says that he is still sorry for putting himself above the team: If he makes the same move again in the future (which he says he would), that'll also be putting himself in front of the team, so is he then really sorry?

Without a doubt Vettel feels obnoxiously entitled to win, at any cost. My point is that if he is going to behave like this, he might as well own up, and stand for it like he did today, not like he did immediately after the Malaysian GP.

[dren]

The team pays Vettel to race for them. He is clearly stating he will disobey his employer. I would fire anyone working for me that would do that. But this is F1 and Vettel brings wins to the team. He is also showing that he now runs the show, not Horner. This is going to create a lot of issues on the race track. I see future crashes between Mark and Vettel.

[Phil]

IMO - it's a tricky situation. One can tell that there is a lot of friction within the team - even prior to Malaysia, possibly since that race in Turkey in 2010 - and that Vettel is reacting to that, which of course no one outside the team can really relate to because we don't have the full picture.

So when Vettel says "Webber didn't deserve the win" - is he taking into account only the numerous occasions when he felt Webber should have been a better team player - or perhaps the possibility that there is a lot of bad mouthing or provocation going on inside the team that makes Webber come across as a bad guy to him - which is why he thinks he didn't deserve it (and would be determined to do everything to beat him on the track as a type of revenge) - or is he saying this purely from the point of view that he sees himself as the better driver or the championship contender and thus from that angle, he deserves it more?

It's tricky, because coming out like that saying he deserved the win more, isn't exactly being very sportmanship like, especially when we outside the team can only speculate to what goes on within the team. One way or the other, I think Vettel isn't playing the cards right. He won last years championship - with or without Webbers help. Since it seems that Webber wasn't being very supportive only makes his WDC title even better IMO - and he should be happy for that as that only makes him being viewed as a stronger driver.

[turbof1]

Webber did agreed that it would be better to do without team orders. However, the order in malaysia wasn't there to give Mark the advantage, but to ease off, sparing the tyres, engine and fuel. Imo that is critical information; if you want to be sure you finish the race you need to follow these directions. What is the team now supposed to do? They still need to feed in that info, but now they can be sure if those 2 drive close to eachother, they'll throw it out of the window. That'll end up with the 2 being parked before getting to the finish, which might be by itself a very good lesson, but the team, ultimately only taking care for its drivers, has to pay the biggest price of them all.

I can understand Vettel. Webber did not exactly followed directions either. But with Vettel now not doing it as well, it'll lead to big problems.

[Juzh]

Its allways been like that between them so why are people bringing this up now? They hated each other since 2010, nothing is different this year, or last year. Their only crash was at turkey 2010 which was 3 years ago. They've raced a lot of times since then wheel to wheel and gave each other just enough space not to crash, be it webber overtaking vettel or vice-versa, although I can only remember a single race when webber actually overtook vettel on track.

[turbof1]

You did see what happened at malaysia right? Webber forced vettel very close to the wall. Put them in the exact same situation this weekend and I guarantee you that Vettel will have to scrape his car off the wall.