The key point I think is that one party has to be able to trust another. It goes both ways. Honda doesn't build the car or the aero, they build the engine. So they need to be able to trust in the competence of their partner - McLaren - to know what they are doing. The opposite holds true too; McLaren doesn't build the power-unit. So they need to trust in the ability and competence of their partner - Honda - to know what they are doing.Thunders wrote:I'm baffled why there is still People out there that think McLaren or Honda dictated anything to another. Building that PU is a joint Effort and BOTH sides seem Happy with the way they are going. Honda is eager to show they can make a competitive PU as small as possible (read the bit "Lucky" posted above) and nobody at McLaren will complain if they can shrink their Bodywork.
Sometimes in these Threads one could mean they work against each other......
It's about finding the right compromise. You either build an aero optimized masterpiece, but if the engine needs to be constraint in a way it no longer works, the package will not work. The opposite holds true too; Honda can't build an uncompromising engine without any trade-offs - a masterpiece of an engine with the CW of a truck will not beat anyone.
So it's easy to conclude that in a joint effort, both sit down and discuss various options. A size-zero concept is weighed against what Honda thinks they can deliver on the engine side and what McLaren can do with the benefits of that on the aero side. That indirectly translates to laptime and on-track performance. The problem then starts when one of the party underachieve - either because the aero is not as effective as it should be, or the engine isn't. Or it works perfectly to the expectations of both parties, but then they find out that another approach they hadn't thought of, or dismissed, gets better results.
In the end, it still comes down to level of competence. How competent are Honda in knowing what they can and can not achieve. The same applies to McLaran. And as joint-effort, how competent are they both to know which design choice achieves the best possible results. This trust or lack of it is what effectively brought down the relationship between Redbull and Renault. It will be very interesting to see how the relationship with Honda and McLaren shape up to be, even in regards to the design choice of the size-zero concept they are pursuing. They are pursuing that for a reason, because they both believe under the assumption that both parties are competent in their field of expertise, that this can produce a winning package.
2016 will show if that package will 1.) work 2.) be competitive. If it doesn't - one if not both parties will be facing hard questions as to why it isn't.
EDIT: Started replying a bit to early, now after reading Wazari's post and this one:
This.Thunders wrote:If it was really like that and the former Honda President gave McLaren a Carte Blanche that must have been one of the most stupid decisions of his Career. That is limiting them in sooo many Ways to just be able to react..... At the same Time no one could really blame McLaren then. If your Works Partner doesn't give honest Feedback and Input about what they think is best how would anyone know what works best as a Package. That's almost a guaranteed Fail.
Honda can only do a good enough job given the constraints they are set. What baffles me a bit is that McLaren ran the Mercedes engine in 2014, so they were aware of what that produces. I could imagine that at some point within the joint-venture with Honda, they asked - can you deliver this sort of power on a smaller scale (size-zero) so that we can reap additional aero rewards. Or less power, but felt that the gains they could make on the aero packaging would still outweigh the power deficit. Then the question is, did Honda deliver given the constraints they were given, or did they underachieve? Either way - 2015 was probably an eye opener for both of them. Given the size-zero concept is still being actively pursued, I can only imagine that both have faith in each others decision making and feel that the package can be competitive, even under the assumption that the Mercedes and Ferrari packages are evolving further and making gains too.
