2024 Mclaren Formula 1 Team

[mwillems]

Is there some analysis that shows how much drag reduction has been achieved since Austria last year? Compared to both Ferrari/Red Bull, it looks like drag is still higher from the telemetry at Jeddah.

I did this for the last 5 races last year, looking at the Qualy speeds as a percentage of the maximum speed in Qualification. You could do the same and go further back. This represents with DRS open.

You can get the same figures with DRS closed also and show the trend of our difference from the fastest car, the trend should be reasonably representative.

viewtopic.php?p=1197945#p1197945

[f1isgood]

Is there some analysis that shows how much drag reduction has been achieved since Austria last year? Compared to both Ferrari/Red Bull, it looks like drag is still higher from the telemetry at Jeddah.

I did this for the last 5 races last year, looking at the Qualy speeds as a percentage of the maximum speed in Qualification. You could do the same and go further back. This represents with DRS open.

You can get the same figures with DRS closed also and show the trend of our difference from the fastest car, the trend should be reasonably representative.

viewtopic.php?p=1197945#p1197945

Thanks, appreciate this.

[Juzh]

Moving back to a previous conversation talking about Mclarens high speed abilities, and how this compares to other cars

"Our strengths and weaknesses were shown very well on this circuit. Starting from the strengths, you will have seen that in the first sector everyone was losing ground to us.
This is because, in fast corners – where you just need to give a single steering wheel input – our car responds very well.,” said the Italian engineer

The GPS data confirms this, given that in the snake from turn 4 to turn 10, the MCL38s did not even lose ground with Max Verstappen’s RB20, with Lando Norris showing more speed than the 3-time Champion.

Mclaren ran visibly more wing level, obviously it's making them fast in those corners, but quite slow on straights. Even then Verstappen was faster in those 230+ kmh corners, but slower in sub-200 kmh corners where RB is weak in general.

[Tomsky]

While the category offers its worst day after day, according to authoritative finance sources, Bahrain's sovereign wealth fund appears to be ready to abandon the capital of the McLaren group which would lose its majority shareholder. In fact, it seems that JP Morgan, an American multinational financial services company based in New York, has been given a formal mandate to identify a strategic partner for the electric car manufacturer known worldwide for its participation in F1.

In recent years, the Mumtalakat fund has reportedly invested over 1.5 billion pounds to relaunch the brand founded by Bruce McLaren in 1963 which, thanks to Ron Dennis, entered the supercar sector in 2010 with the MP4-12C. The news is therefore more than surprising, as no later than last December, the majority shareholder had completed total control of the McLaren group.

The F1 team “McLaren Racing” is a branch of the parent company McLaren Group. Despite being an entity that lives its own life, it could be influenced by the possible entry of a partner. A possible name that is constantly circulating is that of Elon Musk. The South African entrepreneur has always shown great interest in the historic English brand. When he finalized the sale of his first company for $22 million, he decided to spend one million of the proceeds to buy a road-going McLaren calling it "the fastest car in the world."

Unfortunately, the precious four-wheeled toy did not last long. The very young and already millionaire creator of Tesla destroyed the Hypercar a few months later. Also on board with him was Peter Thiel, co-founder of PayPal. The English automotive group, which has been trying in vain to compete with Ferrari for years, shows obvious shortcomings on an industrial level and serious problems with financial needs. For this reason, the entry of a partner like Musk could give impetus to the automotive sector. The great know-how in the electricity sector that it would bring could create a winning synergy capable of relaunching the brand.
https://www.funoanalisitecnica.com/2024 ... -musk.html

[LionsHeart]

While the category offers its worst day after day, according to authoritative finance sources, Bahrain's sovereign wealth fund appears to be ready to abandon the capital of the McLaren group which would lose its majority shareholder. In fact, it seems that JP Morgan, an American multinational financial services company based in New York, has been given a formal mandate to identify a strategic partner for the electric car manufacturer known worldwide for its participation in F1.

In recent years, the Mumtalakat fund has reportedly invested over 1.5 billion pounds to relaunch the brand founded by Bruce McLaren in 1963 which, thanks to Ron Dennis, entered the supercar sector in 2010 with the MP4-12C. The news is therefore more than surprising, as no later than last December, the majority shareholder had completed total control of the McLaren group.

The F1 team “McLaren Racing” is a branch of the parent company McLaren Group. Despite being an entity that lives its own life, it could be influenced by the possible entry of a partner. A possible name that is constantly circulating is that of Elon Musk. The South African entrepreneur has always shown great interest in the historic English brand. When he finalized the sale of his first company for $22 million, he decided to spend one million of the proceeds to buy a road-going McLaren calling it "the fastest car in the world."

Unfortunately, the precious four-wheeled toy did not last long. The very young and already millionaire creator of Tesla destroyed the Hypercar a few months later. Also on board with him was Peter Thiel, co-founder of PayPal. The English automotive group, which has been trying in vain to compete with Ferrari for years, shows obvious shortcomings on an industrial level and serious problems with financial needs. For this reason, the entry of a partner like Musk could give impetus to the automotive sector. The great know-how in the electricity sector that it would bring could create a winning synergy capable of relaunching the brand.
https://www.funoanalisitecnica.com/2024 ... -musk.html

Tesla smashes the hypercar? I assume this is true on straight sections? How are things going in the corners? I have seen how a Tesla of any model and configuration drives on the Nurburgring. Turns are a quiet horror for her.

[Snowblindoz]

Tesla smashes the hypercar? I assume this is true on straight sections? How are things going in the corners? I have seen how a Tesla of any model and configuration drives on the Nurburgring. Turns are a quiet horror for her.
[/quote]

Elon Musk smashed 'his' hypercar (i.e. his Mclaren, the one he purchased and wrapped around a tree)

I won't comment on the T**la, as i'd be quite happy if every electric car burnt quickly and fiercly.

[LionsHeart]

Tesla smashes the hypercar? I assume this is true on straight sections? How are things going in the corners? I have seen how a Tesla of any model and configuration drives on the Nurburgring. Turns are a quiet horror for her.

Elon Musk smashed 'his' hypercar (i.e. his Mclaren, the one he purchased and wrapped around a tree)

I won't comment on the T**la, as i'd be quite happy if every electric car burnt quickly and fiercly.
[/quote]

Aaah, yeah. Thanks! I read it briefly and didn’t get the gist. I remember that Mr. Bean also trashed his McLaren F1. There is no stabilization system or ABS. And that's great.

[Darth-Piekus]

If Newey leaves RedBull now, he will join Ferrari.
He has mentioned in a podcast some time ago that his career regrets were not having designed a ferrari car and not having worked with drivers like fernando and lewis.

He can write off two of those regrets in one go if he leaves and joins Ferrari next year.

I'm aware of those regrets he has but is Mclaren confident enough he can beat Andrian Newey wether he is on Red Bull or Ferrari when the upgrades from the new tunnel started coming along with the new car next year? Are we that full that we can't get such a good name that can help us a lot?

[mwillems]

Moving back to a previous conversation talking about Mclarens high speed abilities, and how this compares to other cars

"Our strengths and weaknesses were shown very well on this circuit. Starting from the strengths, you will have seen that in the first sector everyone was losing ground to us.
This is because, in fast corners – where you just need to give a single steering wheel input – our car responds very well.,” said the Italian engineer

The GPS data confirms this, given that in the snake from turn 4 to turn 10, the MCL38s did not even lose ground with Max Verstappen’s RB20, with Lando Norris showing more speed than the 3-time Champion.

Mclaren ran visibly more wing level, obviously it's making them fast in those corners, but quite slow on straights. Even then Verstappen was faster in those 230+ kmh corners, but slower in sub-200 kmh corners where RB is weak in general.

This is true but I don't think a little bit more wing makes up for too much though in relation to overall downforce. Point being that the car is very competitive in those corners in its own right, even if ultimately with a little less wing it runs behind RB in those high speed corners.

McLaren's straight line speed appears not down to the wing, the cars speed seemed in line with the other cars with DRS closed, which relates to the point above that the wing is not the difference here, I don't think, but for sure it will help a little.

As you can see, in the Qualy fast laps, we don't have a straight line speed issue at Jeddah, we have a DRS efficiency issue. In the race this was made to seem worse by the fact we were up against a Merc that was inferior over a lap apart from its straight line speed, which is substantially faster than most with DRS closed. In fact in our Qualy fastest laps, we were faster than Ferrari with DRS closed.

[LionsHeart]

Moving back to a previous conversation talking about Mclarens high speed abilities, and how this compares to other cars

"Our strengths and weaknesses were shown very well on this circuit. Starting from the strengths, you will have seen that in the first sector everyone was losing ground to us.
This is because, in fast corners – where you just need to give a single steering wheel input – our car responds very well.,” said the Italian engineer

The GPS data confirms this, given that in the snake from turn 4 to turn 10, the MCL38s did not even lose ground with Max Verstappen’s RB20, with Lando Norris showing more speed than the 3-time Champion.

Mclaren ran visibly more wing level, obviously it's making them fast in those corners, but quite slow on straights. Even then Verstappen was faster in those 230+ kmh corners, but slower in sub-200 kmh corners where RB is weak in general.

This is true but I don't think a little bit more wing makes up for too much though in relation to overall downforce. Point being that the car is very competitive in those corners in its own right, even if ultimately with a little less wing it runs behind RB in those high speed corners.

McLaren's straight line speed appears not down to the wing, the cars speed seemed in line with the other cars with DRS closed, which relates to the point above that the wing is not the difference here, I don't think, but for sure it will help a little.

As you can see, in the Qualy fast laps, we don't have a straight line speed issue at Jeddah, we have a DRS efficiency issue. In the race this was made to seem worse by the fact we were up against a Merc that was inferior over a lap apart from its straight line speed, which is substantially faster than most with DRS closed. In fact in our Qualy fastest laps, we were faster than Ferrari with DRS closed.

https://i.postimg.cc/631hbqg5/Jeddah-Qu ... Speeds.png

When I studied racing telemetry in Bahrain, I saw the same thing. In a race without the use of DRS, McLaren drives the same as its rivals. I would say in terms of average maximum speed it is in the middle of the list, but the difference to the leaders is not more than 2-3 km/h. This is not critical at all.

[De Wet]

While the category offers its worst day after day, according to authoritative finance sources, Bahrain's sovereign wealth fund appears to be ready to abandon the capital of the McLaren group which would lose its majority shareholder. In fact, it seems that JP Morgan, an American multinational financial services company based in New York, has been given a formal mandate to identify a strategic partner for the electric car manufacturer known worldwide for its participation in F1.

In recent years, the Mumtalakat fund has reportedly invested over 1.5 billion pounds to relaunch the brand founded by Bruce McLaren in 1963 which, thanks to Ron Dennis, entered the supercar sector in 2010 with the MP4-12C. The news is therefore more than surprising, as no later than last December, the majority shareholder had completed total control of the McLaren group.

The F1 team “McLaren Racing” is a branch of the parent company McLaren Group. Despite being an entity that lives its own life, it could be influenced by the possible entry of a partner. A possible name that is constantly circulating is that of Elon Musk. The South African entrepreneur has always shown great interest in the historic English brand. When he finalized the sale of his first company for $22 million, he decided to spend one million of the proceeds to buy a road-going McLaren calling it "the fastest car in the world."

Unfortunately, the precious four-wheeled toy did not last long. The very young and already millionaire creator of Tesla destroyed the Hypercar a few months later. Also on board with him was Peter Thiel, co-founder of PayPal. The English automotive group, which has been trying in vain to compete with Ferrari for years, shows obvious shortcomings on an industrial level and serious problems with financial needs. For this reason, the entry of a partner like Musk could give impetus to the automotive sector. The great know-how in the electricity sector that it would bring could create a winning synergy capable of relaunching the brand.
https://www.funoanalisitecnica.com/2024 ... -musk.html

[Tomsky]

https://speedcafe.com/analysis-mclaren-mcl38/

[mwillems]

Great article. Still pointing to the idea that the car cannot maintain a seal on the floor at lower speeds due to the airflow from the front interacting with weaker vortices trying to seal the floor. I'm willing to increase my bet from 600 Rubles to 650 Rubles

"At highspeed, there is little yaw in the car and the defining force is focused on the nose of the car. But at lower speeds, there becomes a point when the aero load shifts and begins to attack the car from the side relative to its direction of travel, with the front wheels playing a significant factor in the airflow over the car."

“There’s another element, which is the ride heights,” he added.

“In low speed, the car is high [from the ground]. In highspeed, very, very close to the ground.

“So I would say these yaw aspects, and the right heights, are the two most fundamental elements of differentiating why cars can be good in high speed or low speed.”

[LionsHeart]

Great article. Still pointing to the idea that the car cannot maintain a seal on the floor at lower speeds due to the airflow from the front interacting with weaker vortices trying to seal the floor. I'm willing to increase my bet from 600 Rubles to 650 Rubles

"At highspeed, there is little yaw in the car and the defining force is focused on the nose of the car. But at lower speeds, there becomes a point when the aero load shifts and begins to attack the car from the side relative to its direction of travel, with the front wheels playing a significant factor in the airflow over the car."

“There’s another element, which is the ride heights,” he added.

“In low speed, the car is high [from the ground]. In highspeed, very, very close to the ground.

“So I would say these yaw aspects, and the right heights, are the two most fundamental elements of differentiating why cars can be good in high speed or low speed.”

What is the point of the bet? It says a lot of what I, you and Small Soldier said earlier. Who were you going to argue with?

I'll even add: I'm very glad that there are many smart guys here on the forum who can determine the true causes of problems without the help of frank comments on behalf of the team.

mwillems, why not 765? There's more downforce there.

[mwillems]

Great article. Still pointing to the idea that the car cannot maintain a seal on the floor at lower speeds due to the airflow from the front interacting with weaker vortices trying to seal the floor. I'm willing to increase my bet from 600 Rubles to 650 Rubles

"At highspeed, there is little yaw in the car and the defining force is focused on the nose of the car. But at lower speeds, there becomes a point when the aero load shifts and begins to attack the car from the side relative to its direction of travel, with the front wheels playing a significant factor in the airflow over the car."

“There’s another element, which is the ride heights,” he added.

“In low speed, the car is high [from the ground]. In highspeed, very, very close to the ground.

“So I would say these yaw aspects, and the right heights, are the two most fundamental elements of differentiating why cars can be good in high speed or low speed.”

What is the point of the bet? It says a lot of what I, you and Small Soldier said earlier. Who were you going to argue with?

I'll even add: I'm very glad that there are many smart guys here on the forum who can determine the true causes of problems without the help of frank comments on behalf of the team.

mwillems, why not 765? There's more downforce there.

I'm just being daft, the bet was around Ferrari and Mclaren fighting it out. I know that you agree with me on the issues with the front and tyre wake.