Variable Camber

[mike]

i have only recently came across a system that design to maximize contact patch and equalize the temperature of in and outside of a give tire by changing its camber during the cornering (like bikes)
however the only info i manage to get is a few websites describing the system and a official site that no longer works.

http://horsepowersports.com/oncamber-variable-camber-steering-system/
http://www.carbibles.com/suspension_bible_pg2.html

can any of you shed some light on this

[al_kar]

Camber changes can be achieved by clever suspension geometry and without using servos that add weight to the car.

[mike]

true but it achieves camber only during turning as the wheel have nearly zero camber in the straight and upon turn in it will change the camber infavor of the direction
it basically means that it can achieve a perfect setting for every corner, braking and acceleration every time and it also prolongs the life of the tyre
i got a feeling that this does the job of a caster angle but you rarely see motobikes turn in with the front wheel(which has caster), they use the lean on the bike to turn

[FLC]

I am pretty sure Mercedes had a concept car with this feature a few years ago, not sure about how it was achieved though. I'll try to look it up.

[FLC]

Wasn't very hard to find. I'm not sure what exactly you're after, but it was called "F-400 Carving" and it had adjustable camber on both outer wheels when cornering. It was done in 2002, by the way, and it required special tires with a more rounded shoulder.

You can read more here

[al_kar]

true but it achieves camber only during turning as the wheel have nearly zero camber in the straight and upon turn in it will change the camber infavor of the direction
it basically means that it can achieve a perfect setting for every corner, braking and acceleration every time and it also prolongs the life of the tyre
i got a feeling that this does the job of a caster angle but you rarely see motobikes turn in with the front wheel(which has caster), they use the lean on the bike to turn

Bikers do that because of the centrifugal force. They need to lean otherwise they will fall. In a car the equivalent is an active suspension (like citroens for example). Not the camber changing servo. But i insist, there is no need to put on heavy equipment, like servos or pushrods, in a car to achieve camber change. It can be done passively with the geometry of the suspension.

[FLC]

Up to 20 degrees? with regular tires? or would it still be a bit of a compromise?

[Scotracer]

I thought about such a system a few years ago but just left it at that. It could have been a way to fast-forward my engineering career

[Ted68]

Designer Len Terry had a wonderfully simple system back in the 60's. Dig up some of his old books.

[Belatti]

... But i insist, there is no need to put on heavy equipment, like servos or pushrods, in a car to achieve camber change. It can be done passively with the geometry of the suspension.

Can you tell us how?

If you dont wanna tell us here, I would pay you thousands of dollars if you can design for me a car with your passively suspension geometry that can have 0° camber in the straights and, while rolling, controlled negative camber in the outer wheels and controlled positive camber in the inner wheels.

[mike]

al_kar
do you even know what you are talking about?
bikes lean to achieve better speed, you can turn the front wheel to turn but it will be really slow.
this system is not about the lean of the car its the lean of the tires on the car. it does not require the car to have a weight transfer before it reacts, it uses the lean of the tyres to turn quicker

[Carlos]

A little OT. But slightly related.

[Belatti]

Maybe al_kar works for Renault and Michelin...

http://www.f1technical.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=330

http://forums.atlasf1.com/index.php?showtopic=55364

http://scarbsf1.com/renault_opt/Renault_OPT.htm

[tomislavp4]

[quote="Carlos"]A little OT. But slightly related.

That´s a nice system, but it has it´s drawbacks. The most obvious would be the aero one, I mean, the shocks are exposed and the "thingie" that they´re bolted on is also exposed giving a rather big drag penalty. Than, ofcourse, the vehicle needs to be narrow and have a big ground clearance...

[DaveKillens]

... But i insist, there is no need to put on heavy equipment, like servos or pushrods, in a car to achieve camber change. It can be done passively with the geometry of the suspension.

Can you tell us how?

If you dont wanna tell us here, I would pay you thousands of dollars if you can design for me a car with your passively suspension geometry that can have 0° camber in the straights and, while rolling, controlled negative camber in the outer wheels and controlled positive camber in the inner wheels.

http://scarbsf1.com/renault_opt/Renault_OPT.htm