So what happened to the new teams?

Post here all non technical related topics about Formula One. This includes race results, discussions, testing analysis etc. TV coverage and other personal questions should be in Off topic chat.

Post Thu May 28, 2009 11:05 am

Do you think there will be any of the other new teams entering F1 other than USF1 (which was coming in even without the £40 mil cap) and or the other one (cant rember the name of)

If this is the case then

a) Why bother with the cap, as it has had no effect
b) what has happened to the rest?
c) Where dose this leave Max - other than left out in the cold, and looking like a right prat again?
d) Why did they fall by the way side, or where just a case of no hope anyway?
u401768
 
Joined: 27 Apr 2009

Post Thu May 28, 2009 11:09 am

I think you've missed a lot of the information already availble on here and other good F1 news sites.

Nothing has been agreed and 3 new teams have signed up.
- Axle
axle
 
Joined: 22 Jun 2004
Location: Norfolk, UK

Post Thu May 28, 2009 11:37 am

I didnt know about the 3rd, but it still stands that USF1 were entering anyway. So the cap looks to be a none start for what it was intended to me.

Its only attracted 2 new teams (not counting USF1 as it was entering under the old system) and last time we had this, it went nowhere (Pro drive and the customer team rule that got killed)

So are we looking at the same all over again - a lot of noise and damage, and then it all gose back to the way it was?

Looking at the FIA site the only ofical entrys lodged to F1 at the mo are Williams, USF1 and CamposS

Until they do that its all just a pipe dream.
u401768
 
Joined: 27 Apr 2009

Post Thu May 28, 2009 11:57 am

I've just read here .. http://f1.gpupdate.net/en/news/2009/05/28/richards-and-prodrive-holding-station/ that Prodrive are waiting until the deadline to submit and already have their chassis designed 8)
______________________________________
greenpower dude reloaded
 
Joined: 29 Dec 2005
Location: Portsmouth, UK

Post Thu May 28, 2009 12:14 pm

axle wrote:I think you've missed a lot of the information already availble on here and other good F1 news sites.

Nothing has been agreed and 3 new teams have signed up.


That's news to me, and I try to keep up.

Campos, USGP and...?
natef1
 
Joined: 30 Oct 2008

Post Thu May 28, 2009 12:28 pm

with Pro drive i'll wait till its actually there a car is testing before i really belive it...
u401768
 
Joined: 27 Apr 2009

Post Thu May 28, 2009 1:27 pm

only 2 teams huh? and how many new teams have entered in the last several years? and what about the current financial situation tells you that now would be a great time to start an F1 team? but yet 2 new teams have jumped on board.
ISLAMATRON
 
Joined: 1 Oct 2008

Post Thu May 28, 2009 1:47 pm

natef1 wrote:That's news to me, and I try to keep up.

Campos, USGP and...?


Epsilon Euskadi were in the news here two days ago, with Joan Villadeprat mentioning that their Le Mans effort was indeed one step towards F1. A plus for Epsilon Euskadi is that they did a LMP1 design from scratch. It wasn't the fastest car but for a first attempt it wasn't too bad. A very big con is that USF1 were supposed to use Epsilon Euskadi's facilities for building the car in order to save in logistics. Could USF1 and EE form a joint venture and share design budget towards a chassis, similar to the Red Bull-Toro Rosso case?
I am not amazed by F1 cars in Monaco. I want to see them driving in the A8 highway: Variable radius corners, negative banking, and extreme narrowings that Tilke has never dreamed off. Oh, yes, and "beautiful" weather tops it all.

"Prediction is very difficult, especially about the future." Niels Bohr
Miguel
 
Joined: 17 Apr 2008
Location: San Sebastian (Spain)

Post Thu May 28, 2009 1:54 pm

They have until next Friday, and any new team that doesn't wait until to the last minute to make their decision _to apply_ are a bunch of buffoons.

They need to wait and see what will happen if anything with regulations and budgets.

Would you shake hands and commit to buying a house before knowing the cost, then just pay whatever later? Your lawyers would advise against it as well I figure.
Before I do anything I ask myself “Would an idiot do that?” And if the answer is yes, I do not do that thing. - Dwight Schrute
Giblet
 
Joined: 19 Mar 2007
Location: Downtown Canada

Post Thu May 28, 2009 1:58 pm

Miguel wrote:
natef1 wrote:That's news to me, and I try to keep up.

Campos, USGP and...?


Epsilon Euskadi were in the news here two days ago, with Joan Villadeprat mentioning that their Le Mans effort was indeed one step towards F1. A plus for Epsilon Euskadi is that they did a LMP1 design from scratch. It wasn't the fastest car but for a first attempt it wasn't too bad. A very big con is that USF1 were supposed to use Epsilon Euskadi's facilities for building the car in order to save in logistics. Could USF1 and EE form a joint venture and share design budget towards a chassis, similar to the Red Bull-Toro Rosso case?


No, as STR will have to make their own chassis starting next year, same reason why Prodrive wasn't able to come in. I'm sure Mclaren would have had no trouble changing their design department into a separate "business entity" to sell chassis to Prodrive, if they were allowed.
Before I do anything I ask myself “Would an idiot do that?” And if the answer is yes, I do not do that thing. - Dwight Schrute
Giblet
 
Joined: 19 Mar 2007
Location: Downtown Canada

Post Thu May 28, 2009 2:50 pm

Hopefully customer chassis will be allowed from next year on... with less FOM money going to the teams that run them
ISLAMATRON
 
Joined: 1 Oct 2008

Post Thu May 28, 2009 3:12 pm

Giblet wrote:They have until next Friday, and any new team that doesn't wait until to the last minute to make their decision _to apply_ are a bunch of buffoons.

They need to wait and see what will happen if anything with regulations and budgets.

Would you shake hands and commit to buying a house before knowing the cost, then just pay whatever later? Your lawyers would advise against it as well I figure.


Next Friday? Surely, you mean TOMORROW?
But then again, if one considers all the yearly rule changes in F1, it'll still be pretty much a gamble for anyone to enter.. Even with the budget cap, there can be no guarantee of costs if the FIA don't guarantee some stability by securing NO RULE CHANGES for, say, 5 years..
The most merciful thing in the world, I think, is the inability of the human mind to correlate all its contents. H.P.Lovecraft
andartop
 
Joined: 8 Jun 2008
Location: London, UK

Post Thu May 28, 2009 3:20 pm

Giblet wrote:
Miguel wrote:
natef1 wrote:That's news to me, and I try to keep up.

Campos, USGP and...?


Epsilon Euskadi were in the news here two days ago, with Joan Villadeprat mentioning that their Le Mans effort was indeed one step towards F1. A plus for Epsilon Euskadi is that they did a LMP1 design from scratch. It wasn't the fastest car but for a first attempt it wasn't too bad. A very big con is that USF1 were supposed to use Epsilon Euskadi's facilities for building the car in order to save in logistics. Could USF1 and EE form a joint venture and share design budget towards a chassis, similar to the Red Bull-Toro Rosso case?


No, as STR will have to make their own chassis starting next year, same reason why Prodrive wasn't able to come in. I'm sure Mclaren would have had no trouble changing their design department into a separate "business entity" to sell chassis to Prodrive, if they were allowed.

Force India may well want to jump the queue to get ahead of Prodrive, given their technical partnership deal with McLaren : if they're using McMerc's engine, gearbox & personnel already, then why shouldn't they take advantage of the proposed relaxation of chassis regs for a year?

It'd certainly give them a chance to experience (and reverse-engineer) the qualities that make a chassis superior to anything they currently produce.

Of course, this is entirely speculative, based on the recent Mercedes proposal for an interim cap ...
Last edited by gridwalker on Thu May 28, 2009 3:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.
"Change is inevitable, except from a vending machine ..."
gridwalker
 
Joined: 27 Mar 2009
Location: Sheffield, UK

Post Thu May 28, 2009 3:20 pm

Andartop, I think you overestimate the added costs of the rule changes... every team designs & builds a new car every year regardless of rule changes.

I doubt the design and build process cost Ferrari anymore for the F60 than it did for the F2007, even with all the aero rules changes. Yes KERS cost them something but that money came from the money saved from the engine freeze. The move to slicks didnt really cost the teams much, they would have done the same testing.

The only rules change that was really silly and cost the teams alot of money as the switch from V-10's to v8's... that was not a well thought out move.

Some of these rule changes were necessary because of the handling nature of the cars leading to boring races. But would you really like seeing Brawn & Button dominating for the next 5 years just for stable rule package?
ISLAMATRON
 
Joined: 1 Oct 2008

Post Thu May 28, 2009 3:37 pm

I might be overestimating these costs, or I might not, only an F1 Team manager could tell us.
But the way I see it, stability in the regulations might be an easy way to a)save some money, b)level the field somewhat (eventually), c)lure new teams and sponsors, as:
a)evolving a design GRADUALLY over a long period of time (and as dictated by the competition) sounds to me cheaper than starting from scratch every year and then struggling to evolve said design ASAP within a very limited amount of time.
b)the big spenders would sooner rather than later end up in a position where they'd be squeezing 99.99% of the original design's performance, and then it would take a much longer process (and more expensive) to get that extra 0.01%, slowing the evolution process down and thus allowing the minor players to catch up eventually.
c)ANYBODY investing in ANYTHING wants SECURITY and STABILITY first. makes sense.

Of course, I'm not saying the rules would have to stay the same for ever..but what do I know? :?
The most merciful thing in the world, I think, is the inability of the human mind to correlate all its contents. H.P.Lovecraft
andartop
 
Joined: 8 Jun 2008
Location: London, UK

Next

Return to General chat

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Just_a_fan and 7 guests