Anyone Else Sick Of The Fuel Saving Section In Races???

[mep]

@WhiteBlue:
You better stop watching formula 1 and follow this series:
http://www.shell.com/home/content/ecomarathon/

[WhiteBlue]

If the cars were mandated to be full of enough fuel to run every lap balls out, there would be heavier cars at the beginning, and more drivers making small errors, increasing the spectacle, showcasing more driver skill, and no periods where a quick driver has to drive slower than they want.

If some cars are faster with less fuel it would be completely counter productive to force them to take as much gas as the fuel inefficient teams. What kind of ethos are we talking about here? Instead we need to allow more efficiency developments of the power train as discussed for the future. If the most fuel efficient teams can finish the race with 10 or 20 kg less fuel it would be moronic in my view to force them to carry fuel ballast.

Unless you have noticed, you are rather lonely with the view that saving fuel is more important than decent racing.

1) I'm not against decent racing. I'm against forcing the more efficient teams to carry fuel ballast so that other less efficient teams can waste fuel at no consequence.

2) I have noticed that some engineers here also think that efficiency improvements are core engineering values. If some performance curbs have to be made in the interest of safety - and there is no doubt for reasonable people about that - one should make them based on a fuel budget.

[ringo]

@WB, If i can't see it, that means something is wrong with how it is presented isn't it?

I can't make myself be entertained. If i have to force myself to see the joy in things, that means that there is something wrong with the formula.

Refueling had more going for it, to me. I liked the lap time battles, even to the pitstops . Sometimes the battle to close the gap is more entertaining than overtaking itself.
And when that battle draws to an overtaking duel, that duel should be more than one car easily passing another because it's massively disadvantaged by fuel issues or it's on a different tyre.

Overtaking should be more than just 1 swift move. It's more entertain when the cars are about equal on fuel and tyres, with the driver making the difference.
We've seen these things in the early 2000's.

It looks good on paper when we have all these variables, like tyre strategies, fueling light, etc. But it doesn't get played out in reality.

F1 should be entertaining at face value. The only thing exciting in F1 now is the drama and politics. Save for Hamilton and a few others, there isn't much going on on track.

[WhiteBlue]

@WhiteBlue:
You better stop watching formula 1 and follow this series:
http://www.shell.com/home/content/ecomarathon/

That is a silly comment which nobody will seriously look at.

@ringo I respect your view but I simply do not agree with it. But life is about choices and we all can make different choices. Nothing wrong with that. I simply feel we had enough refueling for the next decade.

[mep]

@WB, If i can't see it, that means something is wrong with how it is presented isn't it?

I can't make myself be entertained. If i have to force myself to see the joy in things, that means that there is something wrong with the formula.

Refueling had more going for it, to me. I liked the lap time battles, even to the pitstops . Sometimes the battle to close the gap is more entertaining than overtaking itself.
And when that battle draws to an overtaking duel, that duel should be more than one car easily passing another because it's massively disadvantaged by fuel issues or it's on a different tyre.

Overtaking should be more than just 1 swift move. It's more entertain when the cars are about equal on fuel and tyres, with the driver making the difference.
We've seen these things in the early 2000's.

It looks good on paper when we have all these variables, like tyre strategies, fueling light, etc. But it doesn't get played out in reality.

F1 should be entertaining at face value. The only thing exciting in F1 now is the drama and politics. Save for Hamilton and a few others, there isn't much going on on track.

+1
I am on your side.

[mep]

So guys especially White Blue have you seen last race in Hungary?
There was noting absolutely nothing going on at track apart from the pitstops and the Schumi Barichello almost crash.
Vettel was still unable to overtake with a car that was 2 seconds faster then the other one. With 2 or 3 pitstops we would have seen a more exiting race instead of parade laps.

[garrontower]

No way!

In this day and age with Hybrids something approaching 30(UK) gallons only should be permitted

[thearmofbarlow]

To answer the original question, yes I'm sick of the damn fuel saving. The first eight to ten laps will be balls-out stellar, then the last eight to ten will be staggering. In between you have some sort of milky film sliding down the side of the sink.

[MIKEY_!]

Yes!!!!!!!!! I'd like to see the drivers pushing as hard as they can ALL THE TIME

[bhallg2k]

I recognize that this topic has been awakened from a two-year slumber, but as long as F1's tires degrade when someone even glances at them the wrong way, fuel-saving means very, very little.

(Unless, of course, you can't make it back to the pit lane after Q3.)

[Hail22]

@WhiteBlue:
You better stop watching formula 1 and follow this series:
http://www.shell.com/home/content/ecomarathon/

That is a silly comment which nobody will seriously look at.

I looked at it, and i agree with his comment.

Maybe you should stop watching Formula 1 and watch the Ecomarathon?

And as Bhall stated...fuel saving is the least of drivers problems...tyres can go at any given time depending on your lottery...remember the last year of the bridgestones with 3 laps to go? or was it a part failure...hmmm



most likely the reason for fuel rigs not returning is the "Massa Effect":

[N12ck]

I cannot stand fuel saving during races, it prevents a driver who's quicker being able to catch up with the leader as he has to save fuel. Aside from that another annoying factor is saving tyres

[SiLo]

@WhiteBlue:
You better stop watching formula 1 and follow this series:
http://www.shell.com/home/content/ecomarathon/

That is a silly comment which nobody will seriously look at.

I looked at it, and i agree with his comment.

Maybe you should stop watching Formula 1 and watch the Ecomarathon?

And as Bhall stated...fuel saving is the least of drivers problems...tyres can go at any given time depending on your lottery...remember the last year of the bridgestones with 3 laps to go? or was it a part failure...hmmm



most likely the reason for fuel rigs not returning is the "Massa Effect":

The easiest way to stop that would be to implement a failsafe into the fuel filler cap. Whereby the car cannot move until it is fully closed.

[Paul]

I cannot stand fuel saving during races, it prevents a driver who's quicker being able to catch up with the leader as he has to save fuel. Aside from that another annoying factor is saving tyres

Put more fuel in at the start then.

It is actually one of the least artificial parts of racing, teams calculate and put as much fuel as they think will make them finish as high as possible. No-one actually makes them put a certain amount of fuel in the car.

[siskue2005]

I cannot stand fuel saving during races, it prevents a driver who's quicker being able to catch up with the leader as he has to save fuel. Aside from that another annoying factor is saving tyres

Put more fuel in at the start then.

It is actually one of the least artificial parts of racing, teams calculate and put as much fuel as they think will make them finish as high as possible. No-one actually makes them put a certain amount of fuel in the car.

if they put more fuel they cant be quicker and catch up.

The only way to solve this is to have an FIA mandated minimum amount of fuel at the start, which would be same for everyone and would be 20 to 30 lit higher than what they have now.