Ferrari F2012

A place to discuss the characteristics of the cars in Formula One, both current as well as historical. Laptimes, driver worshipping and team chatter does not belong here.

Post Sun May 06, 2012 4:55 am

Image

I think teams would love such an "aero-neutral" exhaust configuration these days.

(They blew the rear wing with ease.)

It's easy to rush to judgment* when one sees Car A turning out quicker lap times than Car B as if the exhaust layout is the major factor for the differences in performance, but it just doesn't work that way. I've seen quotes from the teams that indicate about 25% of the benefits of pre-2012 EBDs can be recovered under the 2012 regulations. If we take the 2011 British Grand Prix as a very, very, very rough estimate, we can see that the 0.5 sec advantage enjoyed by Red Bull over Ferrari in qualifying was reduced to 0.1 sec when off-throttle exhaust was temporarily banned. That implies a rough value of 0.4 sec of which 0.1 sec can be recovered. Even by F1 standards, that's not a whole lot.

You also can't really look at other teams' solutions and expect to see a carbon-copy implemented elsewhere. In the case of McLaren's exhaust, it's unlikely Ferrari will adopt that solution for the very simple reason that Ferrari's engine has very different cooling requirements than the Mercedes. At the same time, however, that doesn't mean the two teams aren't pursuing the same exhaust philosophy. They just look different.



* I should know. No one, and I mean no one, rushes to judgment faster.
bhall
 
Joined: 28 Feb 2006
Location: America, Inc.

Post Sun May 06, 2012 6:38 am

I think that the development of exhausts in 2012 is still beneficial, but as much as other areas of development.....So teams can concentrate on different areas but still achieve the same lap-times...red bull has been obsessed wit exhausts in 2012...but lotus hasn't....yet in bahrain they were about equal in performance...
amouzouris
 
Joined: 14 Feb 2011

Post Sun May 06, 2012 1:11 pm

bhallg2k wrote:Image

I think teams would love such an "aero-neutral" exhaust configuration these days.

(They blew the rear wing with ease.)


I thought the main benefit of this configuration was the shorter exhaust pipes?
Gerhard Berger
 
Joined: 20 Sep 2010

Post Sun May 06, 2012 3:04 pm

Gerhard Berger wrote:
I thought the main benefit of this configuration was the shorter exhaust pipes?


Yep...
#58
Gridlock
 
Joined: 27 Jan 2012

Post Sun May 06, 2012 3:22 pm

The rationale was two fold: improved cooling and aerodynamics. Either way, it was far from aero-neutral, and that's the point I was trying to get across.
bhall
 
Joined: 28 Feb 2006
Location: America, Inc.

Post Sun May 06, 2012 10:14 pm

What day this week do the cars arrive in Barcelona?
Chuckjr
 
Joined: 24 Feb 2012

Post Sun May 06, 2012 10:21 pm

Chuckjr wrote:What day this week do the cars arrive in Barcelona?


They will probably arrive tomorrow or Tuesday. Although I'm sure the latest Ferrari parts won't arrive until Thursday evening or Friday morning.
Crucial_Xtreme
 
Joined: 15 Oct 2011
Location: Charlotte

Post Tue May 08, 2012 4:45 pm

ok thanks guys,

so T3-9-16.
Interesting how he disregards Mclaren and Red Bull, the latter which has been well known to have the most downforce for years now.
"Il Phenomeno" - The one they fear the most!

"2% of the world's population own 50% of the world's wealth."
Nando
 
Joined: 10 Mar 2012

Post Tue May 08, 2012 6:43 pm

elFranZ wrote:Guys, I don't want to downplay anyone's enthusiasm, but just wanted to remember that Gene is the same guy talking about "sauber fashioned" exhausts few days before Mugello tests. I strongly hope to be wrong.
Curious, he's referring to the only other (known) team developing reactive suspensions.


I thought the reactive suspension was RIP. Where is the evidence that Ferrari is indeed working on this?
Chuckjr
 
Joined: 24 Feb 2012

Post Tue May 08, 2012 8:18 pm

Chuckjr wrote:
elFranZ wrote:Guys, I don't want to downplay anyone's enthusiasm, but just wanted to remember that Gene is the same guy talking about "sauber fashioned" exhausts few days before Mugello tests. I strongly hope to be wrong.
Curious, he's referring to the only other (known) team developing reactive suspensions.


I thought the reactive suspension was RIP. Where is the evidence that Ferrari is indeed working on this?


Sorry, I meant they developed the thing, not that they're still working on it.
Like F2012, my English still has some areas to improve :)
elFranZ
 
Joined: 27 Mar 2012

Post Tue May 08, 2012 9:35 pm

as before with the exhaust configurations Ferrari has tried up to now...i made drawings of the upgrades Ferrari brought to Mugello...

First is the turning vanes under the nose ala Red Bull that Massa tried on the 2nd day:

Original turning vanes:
Image

Turning vanes tested in Mugello ala Red Bull:
Image

Then its the very upgraded rear end of the Ferrari...

starting off with the upgraded rear wing extension that help direct the flow out of the diffuser...
these are the original ones:
Image

and these are the upgraded ones which now feature many more slots to improve the extraction of air:
Image

another big difference is the upgraded beam wing...
original beam wing with monkey seat:
Image

this is the upgraded beam wing which is now detached and the monkey seat is gone...the detached beam wing also works better with the new exhaust (see a few pages back where i posted the exhaust drawings http://www.f1technical.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=11778&start=4035)

Image

also the profile of the rear wing has changed and the slots on the end plate for the reduction of vortices...they are now many more slots..

original:
Image

upgraded:
Image

in addition there were new brake ducts and brake duct fins with the upgraded ones featuring a much more sculpted shape...

original:
Image

upgraded:
Image

an upgraded floor was also tested on the 1st day when Alonso was testing the new exhaust with the coanda 'tongue'...
the new floor features 2 turning vanes to direct the flow of the exhaust:
Image
amouzouris
 
Joined: 14 Feb 2011

Post Tue May 08, 2012 9:42 pm

Great stuff, but tell me amorous Z, what software do you use for thse images?
"I spent most of my money on wine and women...I wasted the rest"
xpensive
 
Joined: 22 Nov 2008
Location: Somewhere in Scandinavia

Post Tue May 08, 2012 9:44 pm

Great work amouzouris -- thank you.
Enzo Ferrari was a great man. But he was not a good man. -- Phil Hill
donskar
 
Joined: 3 Feb 2007
Location: Texas, USA

Post Tue May 08, 2012 9:45 pm

xpensive wrote:Great stuff, but tell me amorous Z, what software do you use for thse images?

i use photoshop!! if you wanna know how i do it inbox me X...but im warning u...its a pain in the ass!
amouzouris
 
Joined: 14 Feb 2011

Post Tue May 08, 2012 9:45 pm

donskar wrote:Great work amouzouris -- thank you.

thank U!
amouzouris
 
Joined: 14 Feb 2011

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