Water injected in to cylinders?

[rod farva]

water injection is also used in tractor pulling. pro stock and super stock tractors inject massive amounts of water, compressed air, and fuel to generate upwards of 3,000 hp (pro stock) and 5,000 hp (super stock). not only does the water cool the intake charge, more importantly it prevents the block from melting! also, conversion from water to steam in the cylinders produces additional horsepower. ALOT more horsepower.

http://www.youtube.com/v/_Szp_fIWDbQ

[Belatti]

Moving slightly away from F1 to road cars, my Argentinian neighbour called over the other day to ask if I'd ever heard of mixing diesel and water in a diesel engine.
He heard that people had been doing this in Argentina but didn't know why....

Jeje, didn´t know why... je... thats because someone was selling some water at $2 the liter . Oh!! the oil crisis is hiting us hard!
Here, there are fuel stations that would only sell you only $20 of diesel, cause there is not enough to feed agro industry, stock and public transport... because its simply inefficient (no trains and too many trucks that also made roads more dangerous)

Now seriously, I don´t know about that water/diesel mix he is talking about

[riff_raff]

Newbie,

Those are fuel injectors injecting FUEL. The fuel injectors are located way out at the runner inlet so that the fuel has the maximum amount of time to vaporize. The reduction in temperatures this produces, due to the latent heat of evaporation of the fuel mass, produces a denser and cooler intake charge.

In other words, it's very good for power.

[alleyoop]

In the video of the Renault engine it's fuel you can see being injected, not water. As far as I know water injection isn't used in F1, as least not these days. Does anyone know if the turbocharged F1 cars of the 80s used water injection?

yep, water injection was first introduced in F1 turbo engines, circa 1982;
later the fuels improved so much that water injection was abandoned.

Ale

[donskar]

"The fuel injectors are located way out at the runner inlet so that the fuel has the maximum amount of time to vaporize. The reduction in temperatures this produces, due to the latent heat of evaporation of the fuel mass, produces a denser and cooler intake charge.

In other words, it's very good for power."

Good, clear explanation for those of us who are technically challenged (like me!) Maybe someone can explain why direct injection (which bypasses the intake manifold/runner) is even better for power (and economy and emissions). My partial understanding of direct injection is that it gives an even denser charge and is capable of a finer degree of control of the the fuel:air mix. I believe direct injection is banned from F1(?), but is used by BM, Audi (and others?)

[riff_raff]

donskar,

There are several benefits of direct cylinder injection with spark-ignited, gasoline engines, but it's illegal in F1.

First, it improves mass flow of the intake charge, since the fuel mass fraction does not have to pass through the ports and by the intake valves. This small (<10%), but useful, increase in air mass flow helps with power.

Second, the reduction in charge temperature, due to the latent heat effect of the evaporating fuel, is more pronounced when the fuel is injected later in the compression cycle.

Third, a measure of charge stratification can be achieved with a carefully directed fuel spray. This will allow a leaner A/F ratio to be used without detonation, and thus a lower fuel consumption.

2008 FIA F1 engine reg's:

"5.7 Fuel systems

5.7.1 The pressure of the fuel supplied to the injectors may not exceed 100 bar. Sensors must be fitted which directly measure the pressure of the fuel supplied to the injectors, these signals must be supplied to the FIA data logger.

5.7.2 Only one fuel injector per cylinder is permitted which must inject directly into the side or the top of the inlet port."

[Belatti]

Was just reading about this:
http://www.wrc-cosworth.org/tech/tuning/water.html
and this
http://www.rallycars.com/Cars/WaterInjection.html
WRC used water injection but now is prohibited by (guess who) FIA for 2008 season.

I would appreciate if someone can get some numbers (there are not laptimes to compare) like decrease in engine power/torque output after the ban.