2017 Japanese Grand Prix - Suzuka, 6-8 October

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Silent Storm
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Re: 2017 Japanese Grand Prix - Suzuka, 6-8 October

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Phil wrote:
08 Oct 2017, 08:35
Hamilton: PU vibrations at the end?

Also: i think the Mercedes was very vulnerable in dirty air?
Bottas didn't suffer that much in dirty air, I think Lewis had some issue with the engine which made it worse in dirty air.
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simieski
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Re: 2017 Japanese Grand Prix - Suzuka, 6-8 October

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DiogoBrand wrote:
08 Oct 2017, 08:38
Diesel wrote:
08 Oct 2017, 08:36
DiogoBrand wrote:Alonso gets investigated for holding Verstappen for half a straight, and yet Massa is OK for holding him for half a lap.
No it was for holding Hamilton up.

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Fernando let Lewis pass from a long way back on the hairpin, i don't see how he held Hamilton up.
Probably after being told he risked getting a penalty.
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DiogoBrand
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Re: 2017 Japanese Grand Prix - Suzuka, 6-8 October

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Maybe the vibrations on the PU are from the setting they used to let Rosberg win and they forgot to take it off.

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Phil
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Re: 2017 Japanese Grand Prix - Suzuka, 6-8 October

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Re: blue flags. Tricky situation... i think the Mercedes had more trouble in closing the gap to the point the car ahead wellt obliged to move to the side?
Not for nothing, Rosberg's Championship is the only thing that lends credibility to Hamilton's recent success. Otherwise, he'd just be the guy who's had the best car. — bhall II
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Just_a_fan
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Re: 2017 Japanese Grand Prix - Suzuka, 6-8 October

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foxmulder_ms wrote:
08 Oct 2017, 02:31
Just_a_fan wrote:
08 Oct 2017, 00:01
Don't think this has been posted so far:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DUoEB5r1QgM
The comparison between the smoothness of the current cars whilst carrying big speed through the Ss etc. to the 2006 cars is quite amazing. Hamilton looks like he's out for a Sunday drive where Massa looks to be having to work the steering a lot to get the time from the car.

Interesting to see that his 2006 time is only 1/10 faster than his Q2 time this year and a 1/10 slower than his Q3 time. He'd have still only got 9th on the grid for this race with his previous record time. Who says the current cars aren't fast?
Yeah, nowadays, cameras have much better image stabilization ;)
How does image stabilization make the drivers move the steering wheel less? Look at Hamilton's legs - you can see them vibrating over kerbs and bumps but the steering stays smooth.
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DiogoBrand
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Re: 2017 Japanese Grand Prix - Suzuka, 6-8 October

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I just can't help but wonder how good next season can be. I don't see anyone taking on the Mercs, especially since they seem to have a problem after their suspensions tricks got banned, which I expect them to fix for next season and just cruise to the titles. But seeing Ferrari so close this season and Red Bull coming closer and closer, I hope to see the most exciting fights for podiums and wins ever since the turbo era started. Also I hope McLaren will at least come 4th in constructors, hurts to see them struggle so much.

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Phil
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Re: 2017 Japanese Grand Prix - Suzuka, 6-8 October

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Dont forget more restrictive oil regulations... that might narrow the gap in qualifying...
Not for nothing, Rosberg's Championship is the only thing that lends credibility to Hamilton's recent success. Otherwise, he'd just be the guy who's had the best car. — bhall II
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GrandAxe
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Re: 2017 Japanese Grand Prix - Suzuka, 6-8 October

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Its not a long shot to imagine Max vying with Lewis for the WDC next season. All Red Bull needs is a decent engine.

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Phil
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Re: 2017 Japanese Grand Prix - Suzuka, 6-8 October

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Regarding Alonso and holding up Verstappen - just saw a replay. I dont think its an issue or that Alonso did anything wrong. It looks exaggerated from Max’s view because the incident takes place in the hairpin and Max goes to the inside and compromizes his exit (the turn in was far too tight). Because Alonso didnt stop is car, he automatically ended in front again (due to the bad exit by Max).

Hamilton just had a better position to pass Alonso at that point.
Not for nothing, Rosberg's Championship is the only thing that lends credibility to Hamilton's recent success. Otherwise, he'd just be the guy who's had the best car. — bhall II
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i70q7m7ghw
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Re: 2017 Japanese Grand Prix - Suzuka, 6-8 October

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DiogoBrand wrote:
08 Oct 2017, 08:38
Diesel wrote:
08 Oct 2017, 08:36
DiogoBrand wrote:Alonso gets investigated for holding Verstappen for half a straight, and yet Massa is OK for holding him for half a lap.
No it was for holding Hamilton up.

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Fernando let Lewis pass from a long way back on the hairpin, i don't see how he held Hamilton up.
He was holding him up for a couple of laps... Why do you think Ves caught up so much?
Phil wrote:
08 Oct 2017, 08:59
Regarding Alonso and holding up Verstappen - just saw a replay. I dont think its an issue or that Alonso did anything wrong. It looks exaggerated from Max’s view because the incident takes place in the hairpin and Max goes to the inside and compromizes his exit (the turn in was far too tight). Because Alonso didnt stop is car, he automatically ended in front again (due to the bad exit by Max).

Hamilton just had a better position to pass Alonso at that point.
The investigation was for holding up Hamilton, Alonso was being shown the blue flag for a couple of laps.

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ringo
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Re: 2017 Japanese Grand Prix - Suzuka, 6-8 October

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Well,
Three races in a row now Ferrari has the de-facto fastest car and somehow reliability has set them back big time.

The W08 doesn't deserve to be on the podium today. Had the two Ferraris had a clean weekend, it would be 1234 for ferrari and redbull.
Hamilton is really just driving perfectly and the reliability has been perfect. The W08 doesn't seem to be the most robust when it comes to going hammer and tongs over a whole race distance like the ferrari and the redbull, but its been fairly steady for at least the first stints to put itself out of harms way; with the help of its Q3 engine trick of course.
I am a Lewis fan, but he is looking very lucky this season; driving well yes, but it has been Ferrari's to lose at the second half of the season, and for some reason uncharacteristic failures have met them when it really counts.
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WaikeCU
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Re: 2017 Japanese Grand Prix - Suzuka, 6-8 October

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Phil wrote:
08 Oct 2017, 08:52
Dont forget more restrictive oil regulations... that might narrow the gap in qualifying...
Question will be what phylosophy they are going with? Build further on this long wheelbase and low rake or go with shorter wheelbase and larger rake.

Bill_Kar
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Re: 2017 Japanese Grand Prix - Suzuka, 6-8 October

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ringo wrote:
08 Oct 2017, 09:12
Well,
Three races in a row now Ferrari has the de-facto fastest car and somehow reliability has set them back big time.

The W08 doesn't deserve to be on the podium today. Had the two Ferraris had a clean weekend, it would be 1234 for ferrari and redbull.
Hamilton is really just driving perfectly and the reliability has been perfect. The W08 doesn't seem to be the most robust when it comes to going hammer and tongs over a whole race distance like the ferrari and the redbull, but its been fairly steady for at least the first stints to put itself out of harms way; with the help of its Q3 engine trick of course.
I am a Lewis fan, but he is looking very lucky this season; driving well yes, but it has been Ferrari's to lose at the second half of the season, and for some reason uncharacteristic failures have met them when it really counts.
LH was seriously down on engine mode plus he was coasting today, it's impossible to say that VET would be faster.

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Phil
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Re: 2017 Japanese Grand Prix - Suzuka, 6-8 October

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ringo wrote:
08 Oct 2017, 09:12
Well,
Three races in a row now Ferrari has the de-facto fastest car and somehow reliability has set them back big time.

The W08 doesn't deserve to be on the podium today. Had the two Ferraris had a clean weekend, it would be 1234 for ferrari and redbull.
Hamilton is really just driving perfectly and the reliability has been perfect. The W08 doesn't seem to be the most robust when it comes to going hammer and tongs over a whole race distance like the ferrari and the redbull, but its been fairly steady for at least the first stints to put itself out of harms way; with the help of its Q3 engine trick of course.
I am a Lewis fan, but he is looking very lucky this season; driving well yes, but it has been Ferrari's to lose at the second half of the season, and for some reason uncharacteristic failures have met them when it really counts.
To be honest, while i agree with most of it, i am not convinced Ferrari would have been much faster. Hamilton drove and had fantastic pace on the SS stint. This may be also because Max had trouble with thre front-end (post race interview). On the second stint, it was a question of tire management. I think the optimum would have been 2 stops, but RB dictated the strategy for Mercedes, so they needed to make it work. This meant that Hamilton had to manage his pace, making sure that the tires lasted to the end, but also to not run into a safety car situation and then face a competitor on tires in a better state.

Then evidently, the Mercedes was extremely vulnerable in dirty air - highlighted by when Hamilton closed in on Bottas. Facing backmarkers, it was less of a problem due to the speed difference, but it still gave an opportunity to RB to close in.

Regarding luck - yes, Hamilton has been fairly lucky so far (but also unlucky, like Baku and Austria). Facing a competitor as strong as Vettel and Ferrari, i am happy that Hamilton closed most of the gap throughout the championship not true luck, but stellar performance before and after the summer break. Notably Spa, Monza and Singapore too (in the rain). The big share of “luck” in form of technical issues for his biggest rival have only dictated the last two races and extended the championship by possibly ~40 points (guestimate).

I refuse to take Vettels error in Singapore as a token of “luck”. Malaysia and Japan however, absolutely.
Not for nothing, Rosberg's Championship is the only thing that lends credibility to Hamilton's recent success. Otherwise, he'd just be the guy who's had the best car. — bhall II
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RZS10
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Re: 2017 Japanese Grand Prix - Suzuka, 6-8 October

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You never know how reliable the info is you get from the teams/team members but Wolff said they were cruising all race and could have gone way faster even with the 'tyre issues' and that there was nothing in the data indicating any issues with the PU, only Max doing a last lap attempt for the win