2017 Japanese Grand Prix - Suzuka, 6-8 October

[Bill_Kar]

Lewis' start over here was extremely similar to the one Vettel made in Singapore.

No. He cut across when he was clearly in front. VET cut across when MV front wing was aligned with his back.

I said similar. Not the same.

Yeah the technique was the same, rather usual for a polesitter. But the fact he was in front and what Phil said makes a whole lot of difference between the two.

[Schuttelberg]

Come on Schuttelberg, you are better than that. It’s like poker.

In Singapore, Vettel was gambling with a driver that had less (nothing) to lose. He was also “dealt” a worse start.

Here, Hamilton had an equal start to Vettel, but was gambling directly with his championship rival who trailed him by 34 points.

There is a subtle difference here: If Hamilton shunts both off (assuming he had a worse start than Vettel), then they both DNF but the outcome favors Hamilton.

In Singapore, Vettel risked a shunt with someone who isnt in contention for the WDC, had nothing to lose and is known to extremely aggressive. He gambled and lost.

These two situations arent even remotely comparable, other than to show that Vettel in Singapore was racing the wrong person.

Come on Phil! Of all people you're micro judging?

These guys are racers. Not chartered accountants.

Anyway, it's been a great year of racing and I'm genuinely happy for you, Hamilton and all his fans! After the horror of last year, this is a title well deserved. And knowing me, you will know that I always mean what I say.

Today was a dagger driven deeper in the heart for us Vettel fans, but that doesn't take away from the brilliance of the rivals. Well, at least we gave this a good old run for it.

[Bill_Kar]

Lewis' start over here was extremely similar to the one Vettel made in Singapore.

No. He cut across when he was clearly in front. VET cut across when MV front wing was aligned with his back.

I said similar. Not the same.

Yeah the technique was the same, rather usual for a polesitter. But the fact he was in front and what Phil said makes a whole lot of difference between the two.

Come on Phil! Of all people you're micro judging?

These guys are racers. Not chartered accountants.

Anyway, it's been a great year of racing and I'm genuinely happy for you, Hamilton and all his fans! After the horror of last year, this is a title well deserved. And knowing me, you will know that I always mean what I say.

Today was a dagger driven deeper in the heart for us Vettel fans, but that doesn't take away from the brilliance of the rivals. Well, at least we gave this a good old run for it.

Respect for this post.

[Schuttelberg]

Lewis' start over here was extremely similar to the one Vettel made in Singapore.

Yes! damnit, Vettel should have been allowed to move over to the other side while there were other cars driving there and Lewis should be punished for moving over while there was no one next to him!!!

Racecraft should be banned! Spacial awareness is for losers!

While Vettel is on track, all drivers should make way and let him go on his way!

Hey thanks for the reply!

[Schuttelberg]

By the way, no one is going to bring this up because it had no bearing on the championship, but we saw another tyre failure today. Suzuka is a notoriously fast circuit and we all know what happened a couple of years back. The entire grid, world champions even have said clearly that the wet tyres are not good enough. Every year there are these tyre failures and in my opinion this is a major quality issue for a series that's so big. May be we only learn when someone loses their life! It's just a bloody disgrace!

[Shrieker]

Lewis' start over here was extremely similar to the one Vettel made in Singapore.

Sorry, but this is business as usual. He clearly had the space, and moved over. In Singapore Vettel had someone alongside and forced him to yield and risked contact, come on now how are they similar... Get real.

[Shrieker]

Anyway, it's been a great year of racing and I'm genuinely happy for you, Hamilton and all his fans! After the horror of last year, this is a title well deserved. And knowing me, you will know that I always mean what I say.

Yes it looks like a formality now, but it ain't over until it's over. We've seen worse...

[Jolle]

By the way, no one is going to bring this up because it had no bearing on the championship, but we saw another tyre failure today. Suzuka is a notoriously fast circuit and we all know what happened a couple of years back. The entire grid, world champions even have said clearly that the wet tyres are not good enough. Every year there are these tyre failures and in my opinion this is a major quality issue for a series that's so big. May be we only learn when someone loses their life! It's just a bloody disgrace!

Stroll you mean? looked more like a rim failure to me.... But tires are rubber balloons with air inside them rubbing against tarmac with bits of carbon flying around (all at great speed). 100% safety is impossible and the only other issues we had were at Silverstone, where the Ferrari's had a very very long run on them plus I think one of them was a normal puncture.

If you want to make tires safer, they will come with mandatory max laps. Teams will always stretch just before failure. How much risk you want to take. In general in motorsport it is: the closer you come to failure, the better it is.

[Bill_Kar]

Just a note, finally we saw the VSC (I think since Spain?Could be mistaken). It seemed to me like they had forgotten it, or they were using usual SC for fake drama.

[f1316]

Absolutely ludicrous statements.

On pure pace, we can sure agree Vettel would have had around 60 additional points from the last three races (I personally estimate 2 wins and 1 second place - so 68 points) and therefore would have been right with if not ahead of Hamilton (who would have likely scored fewer points) .

Even assuming Vettel would have won and scored as you suggested does not mean that Hamilton wouldnt have scored any points at all - e.g. to balance out a 59 point advantage. They’d be closer yes, but Hamilton would still be leading.

You’re aware what you’re saying doesn’t make any sense?

Let’s say Hamilton scored exactly the same amount of points - which would mean, say, Vettel is 2nd to him in SIN, Vettel beats him in Malaysia but somehow Ham is 2nd (he wouldn’t have been as Ver would have beaten him), and Vettel is second to Ham in Japan - then Vettel has an extra 61 points and is leading the championship.

[Jolle]

Oh I agree on this too. New ICE is a certainty IMHO.

Why may I ask?

They can take a no risk policy. Why run an ICE that has miles on the clock when you can stick a new one in wth very little cost (In relative terms).

????

What risk? In the PU pool, they still have enough miles to make it to the end of the season. No failures on HAM's car so far, no binned components yet, lots of miles on safe mode... There is no indication what so ever they need extra components.

I think you hope that they didn't do their homework....

[Shrieker]

Just a note, finally we saw the VSC (I think since Spain?Could be mistaken). It seemed to me like they had forgotten it, or they were using usual SC for fake drama.

Yeah in some of the races with incidents it looked really suspicious, many people including me felt that they were interfering with the race WWE style. Remember that 'muricans own F1 now I hope for the sake of the sport that that's not what happened and does not repeat.

I think you hope that they didn't do their homework....

Well... To be honest, has anyone ended a season with no component related penalties in the current formula ?

[Steven]

By the way, no one is going to bring this up because it had no bearing on the championship, but we saw another tyre failure today. Suzuka is a notoriously fast circuit and we all know what happened a couple of years back. The entire grid, world champions even have said clearly that the wet tyres are not good enough. Every year there are these tyre failures and in my opinion this is a major quality issue for a series that's so big. May be we only learn when someone loses their life! It's just a bloody disgrace!

Stroll you mean? looked more like a rim failure to me.... But tires are rubber balloons with air inside them rubbing against tarmac with bits of carbon flying around (all at great speed). 100% safety is impossible and the only other issues we had were at Silverstone, where the Ferrari's had a very very long run on them plus I think one of them was a normal puncture.

If you want to make tires safer, they will come with mandatory max laps. Teams will always stretch just before failure. How much risk you want to take. In general in motorsport it is: the closer you come to failure, the better it is.

Paddy Lowe, Williams CTO: "Very early on, Lance [Stroll] suspected he had a puncture, so we stopped to put on another set of tyres. This committed him to a two-stop race, which he executed with good pace, but very near the end he had a car failure which caused a puncture in the Esses and threw him off the circuit."

[Jolle]

Just a note, finally we saw the VSC (I think since Spain?Could be mistaken). It seemed to me like they had forgotten it, or they were using usual SC for fake drama.

Yeah in some of the races with incidents it looked really suspicious, many people including me felt that they were interfering with the race WWE style. Remember that 'muricans own F1 now I hope for the sake of the sport that that's not what happened and does not repeat.

I think you hope that they didn't do their homework....

Well... To be honest, has anyone ended a season with no component related penalties in the current formula ?

Apart from Hamilton last year, I think more or less all Mercedes-PU drivers over the last 4 seasons?

[Shrieker]

Apart from Hamilton last year, I think more or less all Mercedes-PU drivers over the last 4 seasons?

Really ?!? I would've thought otherwise... And this from F1Fanatic:

No Mercedes-powered drivers have taken any grid penalties for power unit component changes so far this year.

Must say I'm surprised and impressed.