The engine mode includes power unit, including ERS deployment and recovery
please correct me if i am wrong
I’m afraid you’re wrong.
The engine is the ICE.
1.23 Engine
The internal combustion engine including ancillaries and actuator systems necessary for its proper function.
Thanks for clearing it up
These are the things the so-called ICE mode to be the definition of the following parameters in engine management:
Fuel flow rate
Air volume
Boost pressure
Combustion phasing
Injection times
Switching speed
Fuel temperature
Pressure in the pneumatic valve system, crankcase
oil pressure
Wastegate valve timing and MGU-H working time
Control of the power measured on the output shaft https://www.auto-motor-und-sport.de/for ... direktive/
I don’t understand the last item in that list. Unless they mean feedback from the output shaft SS it is used to ensure things like the new part throttle fuel usage constraint.
I think Wastegate valve timing and MGU-H working time probably refers to anti lag operation. That is MGU-H operation in relation to the ICE rather than the ERS. But I could be completely wrong.
There are 3 other things that are referred to a modes:
ERS modes:
Charge
Neutral
Discharge
PU operation modes, mixing ICE and ERS components, ICE, MGU-K, MGU-H and ES to achieve different power levels ERS energy flows.
For example.
E-boost
Self sustain plus
Self sustain
ICE only
Hot charge
Strategy mode. Selecting which of the PU modes is used at what point on a lap to match the ERS mode and prior to this weekend the overall power level.
I am not sure how all this will knit together under the new rules regime. I would expect attack and defend operations will be softer, since the ICE power variation is now constrained. But what effect this will have on other operations of the PU is difficult to forecast.
Re: FIA wants to ban qualifying modes in 2021
Posted: 05 Sep 2020, 00:02
by 1158
I'm not sure if this was mentioned when the AMuS article was posted (assuming that article is correct). This means all teams running the same PU must run the same mode, despite each team having differences in effectiveness of their cooling. Did I misread the article or is that what the FIA are saying? Doesn't seem prudent to me.
The most extreme example would be Merc and Williams. Merc's optimized cooling must be well ahead of Williams. Not a knock on Williams, just comparing 2 teams with vastly different resources.
Merc is either going to have to detune the Merc PU to work with Williams cooling or Williams is going to have reliability issues.
I realize this is just the ICE modes being fixed, but ICE still generates heat...
I'm not sure if this was mentioned when the AMuS article was posted (assuming that article is correct). This means all teams running the same PU must run the same mode, despite each team having differences in effectiveness of their cooling. Did I misread the article or is that what the FIA are saying? Doesn't seem prudent to me.
The most extreme example would be Merc and Williams. Merc's optimized cooling must be well ahead of Williams. Not a knock on Williams, just comparing 2 teams with vastly different resources.
Merc is either going to have to detune the Merc PU to work with Williams cooling or Williams is going to have reliability issues.
I realize this is just the ICE modes being fixed, but ICE still generates heat...
Surely this can't be right? I'm quite certain that all teams can choose the engine mode they use for quali and the race.
I'm not sure if this was mentioned when the AMuS article was posted (assuming that article is correct). This means all teams running the same PU must run the same mode, despite each team having differences in effectiveness of their cooling. Did I misread the article or is that what the FIA are saying? Doesn't seem prudent to me.
The most extreme example would be Merc and Williams. Merc's optimized cooling must be well ahead of Williams. Not a knock on Williams, just comparing 2 teams with vastly different resources.
Merc is either going to have to detune the Merc PU to work with Williams cooling or Williams is going to have reliability issues.
I realize this is just the ICE modes being fixed, but ICE still generates heat...
Surely this can't be right? I'm quite certain that all teams can choose the engine mode they use for quali and the race.
Personally I think this is just a journalist who did a crap job.
Re: FIA wants to ban qualifying modes in 2021
Posted: 05 Sep 2020, 03:18
by cooken
Merc will absolutely not have to detune their mode to suit inferior cooling. Rather the cooling design will have to be revised to accommodate the increased heat output, surely. The engine from Merc will arrive to customers with a new specified heat output and cooling requirements. Up to the customer how they achieve it.
I'm not sure if this was mentioned when the AMuS article was posted (assuming that article is correct). This means all teams running the same PU must run the same mode, despite each team having differences in effectiveness of their cooling. Did I misread the article or is that what the FIA are saying? Doesn't seem prudent to me.
The most extreme example would be Merc and Williams. Merc's optimized cooling must be well ahead of Williams. Not a knock on Williams, just comparing 2 teams with vastly different resources.
Merc is either going to have to detune the Merc PU to work with Williams cooling or Williams is going to have reliability issues.
I realize this is just the ICE modes being fixed, but ICE still generates heat...
Williams has been running the PU to the maximum in qualifyings so far and even in races, probably much harder than Mercedes themselves due to their relative track positions in races. Their cooling isn't as aerodynamically efficient as Mercedes, hence their packaging is also not as great. But their cooling package does its job of keeping the PU as cool as required. So, I don't think Mercedes need to detune the PU for Williams' sake.
Re: FIA wants to ban qualifying modes in 2021
Posted: 05 Sep 2020, 11:14
by Mchamilton
Re: FIA wants to ban qualifying modes in 2021
Posted: 05 Sep 2020, 13:30
by djones
I really hope FOM get a nice close up on Horner if/when the Honda cars relatively drop back with the new rule.
Re: FIA wants to ban qualifying modes in 2021
Posted: 05 Sep 2020, 14:11
by PhillipM
Horner is gonna realise how much he screwed up very shortly. Honda had a decent qualifying mode.
Re: FIA wants to ban qualifying modes in 2021
Posted: 05 Sep 2020, 14:43
by nevill3
Jensen has stated on Sky that Honda don't have a great qualifying mode, I wonder if that is based on jis experience of them from when he drove their engines?
Jensen has stated on Sky that Honda don't have a great qualifying mode, I wonder if that is based on jis experience of them from when he drove their engines?
I think that was a very different Honda. The new engine is a different beast altogether.
Re: FIA wants to ban qualifying modes in 2021
Posted: 05 Sep 2020, 15:14
by djones
Well.... It's certainly not looking good for Redbull at the moment.
0.65 slower and on the softer tyre.
Re: FIA wants to ban qualifying modes in 2021
Posted: 05 Sep 2020, 16:01
by Sevach
Honda didn't make any great progress with the no party mode rule.
Renault is solid number 2 now.
Re: FIA wants to ban qualifying modes in 2021
Posted: 05 Sep 2020, 16:07
by djones
Honda (Redbull) were the ones pushing for the rule and the FIA also thought it would be good for the show in the form of slowing Mercedes down.
Total backfire. And if what people like Russell have said is true then Mercedes will have an even bigger advantage than normal all race duration.
Perfect really. I love it when people try improve by slowing the competition down rather than looking how THEY can improve and it actually makes the competition faster. Karma.
