Will Schumacher's Race Win and WDC records be broken?

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Are Schumacher's WDC and Win records under threat of being eclipsed?

Will the 7 WDC record be broken?
6
3%
Will the 91 Victory record be broken?
44
26%
Neither record will be broken.
20
12%
Both records will be broken.
102
59%
 
Total votes: 172

Just_a_fan
Just_a_fan
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Re: Will Schumacher's Race Win and WDC records be broken?

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Wass85 wrote:
Fri Sep 18, 2020 10:05 am
Just_a_fan wrote:
Fri Sep 18, 2020 9:57 am
Wass85 wrote:
Fri Sep 18, 2020 9:34 am

It's the equivalent of Hamilton retiring in 2018 and coming back with the new regulation changes and going against George Russell.
[...]
OK but you have the fact that he would be partnered alongside a young charger who would go on to win a world title.
Oh, yes, I see what you mean now. It would be an irony for that to happen when one considers Hamilton's first couple of seasons. That's why these guys should just retire once and go off and do something else. Coming back almost never goes well. A single season, maybe, as Prost did although he did jump back in to the class car of the field.
Turbo says "Dumpster sounds so much more classy. It's the diamond of the cesspools." oh, and "The Dutch fans are drunk. Maybe"

Wass85
Wass85
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Re: Will Schumacher's Race Win and WDC records be broken?

Post

Just_a_fan wrote:
Fri Sep 18, 2020 10:09 am
Wass85 wrote:
Fri Sep 18, 2020 10:05 am
Just_a_fan wrote:
Fri Sep 18, 2020 9:57 am

[...]
OK but you have the fact that he would be partnered alongside a young charger who would go on to win a world title.
Oh, yes, I see what you mean now. It would be an irony for that to happen when one considers Hamilton's first couple of seasons. That's why these guys should just retire once and go off and do something else. Coming back almost never goes well. A single season, maybe, as Prost did although he did jump back in to the class car of the field.
I agree, you retire for a reason and that reason is usually because you have lost the fire inside or because you have declined.

e30ernest
e30ernest
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Joined: Wed Feb 29, 2012 7:47 am

Re: Will Schumacher's Race Win and WDC records be broken?

Post

Just_a_fan wrote:
Fri Sep 18, 2020 10:09 am
Wass85 wrote:
Fri Sep 18, 2020 10:05 am
Just_a_fan wrote:
Fri Sep 18, 2020 9:57 am

[...]
OK but you have the fact that he would be partnered alongside a young charger who would go on to win a world title.
Oh, yes, I see what you mean now. It would be an irony for that to happen when one considers Hamilton's first couple of seasons. That's why these guys should just retire once and go off and do something else. Coming back almost never goes well. A single season, maybe, as Prost did although he did jump back in to the class car of the field.
I do think Prost also came back to a different era of drivers though. When he left and came back, most of the top runners were the same people though?

Jolle
Jolle
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Location: Dordrecht

Re: Will Schumacher's Race Win and WDC records be broken?

Post

e30ernest wrote:
Fri Sep 18, 2020 10:21 am
Just_a_fan wrote:
Fri Sep 18, 2020 10:09 am
Wass85 wrote:
Fri Sep 18, 2020 10:05 am


OK but you have the fact that he would be partnered alongside a young charger who would go on to win a world title.
Oh, yes, I see what you mean now. It would be an irony for that to happen when one considers Hamilton's first couple of seasons. That's why these guys should just retire once and go off and do something else. Coming back almost never goes well. A single season, maybe, as Prost did although he did jump back in to the class car of the field.
I do think Prost also came back to a different era of drivers though. When he left and came back, most of the top runners were the same people though?
Niki and Kimi were quite fast at their return.

Schumacher was maybe more like Vettel, or Vettel more than Schumacher then we are aware :P. He was super in the refuelling “doing Q laps every stint” kind of racing, combined with a very strong pit wall that alway put him in the right spot. When the formula changed, the people around him just were faster. Three years is a lot in F1.
With the unlimited testing, bespoke tires etc, they were able to match the car ant tires to his strong points, instead of him adapting his driving style to the strong points of the car/formula. This is an area where Hamilton clearly has a special ability. He won races/championships in several totally different ways of racing. Schumacher/Ferrari were Caught out in 2005 for instance.

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Moore77
23
Joined: Mon Apr 29, 2019 11:03 am

Re: Will Schumacher's Race Win and WDC records be broken?

Post

Jolle wrote:
Fri Sep 18, 2020 11:14 am
e30ernest wrote:
Fri Sep 18, 2020 10:21 am
Just_a_fan wrote:
Fri Sep 18, 2020 10:09 am


Oh, yes, I see what you mean now. It would be an irony for that to happen when one considers Hamilton's first couple of seasons. That's why these guys should just retire once and go off and do something else. Coming back almost never goes well. A single season, maybe, as Prost did although he did jump back in to the class car of the field.
I do think Prost also came back to a different era of drivers though. When he left and came back, most of the top runners were the same people though?
Niki and Kimi were quite fast at their return.

Schumacher was maybe more like Vettel, or Vettel more than Schumacher then we are aware :P. He was super in the refuelling “doing Q laps every stint” kind of racing, combined with a very strong pit wall that alway put him in the right spot. When the formula changed, the people around him just were faster. Three years is a lot in F1.
With the unlimited testing, bespoke tires etc, they were able to match the car ant tires to his strong points, instead of him adapting his driving style to the strong points of the car/formula. This is an area where Hamilton clearly has a special ability. He won races/championships in several totally different ways of racing. Schumacher/Ferrari were Caught out in 2005 for instance.
Did Hamilton not struggle in 2013 with Pirellis, while Vettel was brilliant? Same tires. Hamilton also struggled in 2009 when all that aero was gone and again, Vettel was brilliant then too.
Gangdom: Pom, Tom, Loverboy, Boomer.

Jolle
Jolle
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Location: Dordrecht

Re: Will Schumacher's Race Win and WDC records be broken?

Post

Moore77 wrote:
Fri Sep 18, 2020 11:59 am
Jolle wrote:
Fri Sep 18, 2020 11:14 am
e30ernest wrote:
Fri Sep 18, 2020 10:21 am


I do think Prost also came back to a different era of drivers though. When he left and came back, most of the top runners were the same people though?
Niki and Kimi were quite fast at their return.

Schumacher was maybe more like Vettel, or Vettel more than Schumacher then we are aware :P. He was super in the refuelling “doing Q laps every stint” kind of racing, combined with a very strong pit wall that alway put him in the right spot. When the formula changed, the people around him just were faster. Three years is a lot in F1.
With the unlimited testing, bespoke tires etc, they were able to match the car ant tires to his strong points, instead of him adapting his driving style to the strong points of the car/formula. This is an area where Hamilton clearly has a special ability. He won races/championships in several totally different ways of racing. Schumacher/Ferrari were Caught out in 2005 for instance.
Did Hamilton not struggle in 2013 with Pirellis, while Vettel was brilliant? Same tires. Hamilton also struggled in 2009 when all that aero was gone and again, Vettel was brilliant then too.
Lol, if there is an better example of a team and driver turning a dog of a car that makes the F1000 look like a solid winner, into something that won races, it’s Hamilton and McLaren in 2009.

Hammer44
Hammer44
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Joined: Fri Dec 12, 2014 4:10 pm

Re: Will Schumacher's Race Win and WDC records be broken?

Post

Moore77 wrote:
Fri Sep 18, 2020 11:59 am
Jolle wrote:
Fri Sep 18, 2020 11:14 am
e30ernest wrote:
Fri Sep 18, 2020 10:21 am


I do think Prost also came back to a different era of drivers though. When he left and came back, most of the top runners were the same people though?
Niki and Kimi were quite fast at their return.

Schumacher was maybe more like Vettel, or Vettel more than Schumacher then we are aware :P. He was super in the refuelling “doing Q laps every stint” kind of racing, combined with a very strong pit wall that alway put him in the right spot. When the formula changed, the people around him just were faster. Three years is a lot in F1.
With the unlimited testing, bespoke tires etc, they were able to match the car ant tires to his strong points, instead of him adapting his driving style to the strong points of the car/formula. This is an area where Hamilton clearly has a special ability. He won races/championships in several totally different ways of racing. Schumacher/Ferrari were Caught out in 2005 for instance.
Did Hamilton not struggle in 2013 with Pirellis, while Vettel was brilliant? Same tires. Hamilton also struggled in 2009 when all that aero was gone and again, Vettel was brilliant then too.
Yes Vettel was at his brilliant best in 2009 :lol: especially in crashing and making plenty of mistakes like he usually does despite RedBull being the best car for the majority of that season.

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Moore77
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Re: Will Schumacher's Race Win and WDC records be broken?

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Jolle wrote:
Fri Sep 18, 2020 12:15 pm
Moore77 wrote:
Fri Sep 18, 2020 11:59 am
Jolle wrote:
Fri Sep 18, 2020 11:14 am


Niki and Kimi were quite fast at their return.

Schumacher was maybe more like Vettel, or Vettel more than Schumacher then we are aware :P. He was super in the refuelling “doing Q laps every stint” kind of racing, combined with a very strong pit wall that alway put him in the right spot. When the formula changed, the people around him just were faster. Three years is a lot in F1.
With the unlimited testing, bespoke tires etc, they were able to match the car ant tires to his strong points, instead of him adapting his driving style to the strong points of the car/formula. This is an area where Hamilton clearly has a special ability. He won races/championships in several totally different ways of racing. Schumacher/Ferrari were Caught out in 2005 for instance.
Did Hamilton not struggle in 2013 with Pirellis, while Vettel was brilliant? Same tires. Hamilton also struggled in 2009 when all that aero was gone and again, Vettel was brilliant then too.
Lol, if there is an better example of a team and driver turning a dog of a car that makes the F1000 look like a solid winner, into something that won races, it’s Hamilton and McLaren in 2009.
Lol. What exactly did Hamilton achieve in 2009? Can you be objective?
Gangdom: Pom, Tom, Loverboy, Boomer.

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Moore77
23
Joined: Mon Apr 29, 2019 11:03 am

Re: Will Schumacher's Race Win and WDC records be broken?

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Hammer44 wrote:
Fri Sep 18, 2020 12:25 pm
Moore77 wrote:
Fri Sep 18, 2020 11:59 am
Jolle wrote:
Fri Sep 18, 2020 11:14 am


Niki and Kimi were quite fast at their return.

Schumacher was maybe more like Vettel, or Vettel more than Schumacher then we are aware :P. He was super in the refuelling “doing Q laps every stint” kind of racing, combined with a very strong pit wall that alway put him in the right spot. When the formula changed, the people around him just were faster. Three years is a lot in F1.
With the unlimited testing, bespoke tires etc, they were able to match the car ant tires to his strong points, instead of him adapting his driving style to the strong points of the car/formula. This is an area where Hamilton clearly has a special ability. He won races/championships in several totally different ways of racing. Schumacher/Ferrari were Caught out in 2005 for instance.
Did Hamilton not struggle in 2013 with Pirellis, while Vettel was brilliant? Same tires. Hamilton also struggled in 2009 when all that aero was gone and again, Vettel was brilliant then too.
Yes Vettel was at his brilliant best in 2009 :lol: especially in crashing and making plenty of mistakes like he usually does despite RedBull being the best car for the majority of that season.
So if the driver does well, then it's car when it is about other drivers. But when the results are bad in Hamilton's case, then it's car. Great logic! The guy is driving history's most dominant cars and raking up wins and championships. That is how it is going to be read at the end of it.
Last edited by Moore77 on Fri Sep 18, 2020 12:38 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Gangdom: Pom, Tom, Loverboy, Boomer.

Jolle
Jolle
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Location: Dordrecht

Re: Will Schumacher's Race Win and WDC records be broken?

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Moore77 wrote:
Fri Sep 18, 2020 12:28 pm
Jolle wrote:
Fri Sep 18, 2020 12:15 pm
Moore77 wrote:
Fri Sep 18, 2020 11:59 am
Did Hamilton not struggle in 2013 with Pirellis, while Vettel was brilliant? Same tires. Hamilton also struggled in 2009 when all that aero was gone and again, Vettel was brilliant then too.
Lol, if there is an better example of a team and driver turning a dog of a car that makes the F1000 look like a solid winner, into something that won races, it’s Hamilton and McLaren in 2009.
Lol. What exactly did Hamilton achieve in 2009? Can you be objective?
Two race wins in a car that was more then 2 seconds off the pace in winter testing. So bad that they stuck on the 2008 wing because the 2009 was so unstable that it crashed a couple of times.
He, with the team dragged that car from a Williams today to a race winner by half season.

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Moore77
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Re: Will Schumacher's Race Win and WDC records be broken?

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Jolle wrote:
Fri Sep 18, 2020 12:34 pm
Moore77 wrote:
Fri Sep 18, 2020 12:28 pm
Jolle wrote:
Fri Sep 18, 2020 12:15 pm


Lol, if there is an better example of a team and driver turning a dog of a car that makes the F1000 look like a solid winner, into something that won races, it’s Hamilton and McLaren in 2009.
Lol. What exactly did Hamilton achieve in 2009? Can you be objective?
Two race wins in a car that was more then 2 seconds off the pace in winter testing. So bad that they stuck on the 2008 wing because the 2009 was so unstable that it crashed a couple of times.
He, with the team dragged that car from a Williams today to a race winner by half season.
So winter testing is the bench mark! So if that is the case, Ferrari should have been winning almost every single season in the hybrid era. Yeah, if Hamilton doesn't perform then it's car's problem. But when Schumacher or Vettel doesn't do well, it was about inability to adapt to changing tires and cars. Good. I expected this pretty much.
Gangdom: Pom, Tom, Loverboy, Boomer.

e30ernest
e30ernest
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Re: Will Schumacher's Race Win and WDC records be broken?

Post

Moore77 wrote:
Fri Sep 18, 2020 12:28 pm
Jolle wrote:
Fri Sep 18, 2020 12:15 pm
Moore77 wrote:
Fri Sep 18, 2020 11:59 am
Did Hamilton not struggle in 2013 with Pirellis, while Vettel was brilliant? Same tires. Hamilton also struggled in 2009 when all that aero was gone and again, Vettel was brilliant then too.
Lol, if there is an better example of a team and driver turning a dog of a car that makes the F1000 look like a solid winner, into something that won races, it’s Hamilton and McLaren in 2009.
Lol. What exactly did Hamilton achieve in 2009? Can you be objective?
McLaren had a horrible year there, but I guess you can say that he had a huge gap to Kovalainen in overall performance (not points because Kovalainen had lots of retirements):

Image

That he won on what looks to be a poor car speaks positively of him too.

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Moore77
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Re: Will Schumacher's Race Win and WDC records be broken?

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e30ernest wrote:
Fri Sep 18, 2020 12:40 pm
Moore77 wrote:
Fri Sep 18, 2020 12:28 pm
Jolle wrote:
Fri Sep 18, 2020 12:15 pm


Lol, if there is an better example of a team and driver turning a dog of a car that makes the F1000 look like a solid winner, into something that won races, it’s Hamilton and McLaren in 2009.
Lol. What exactly did Hamilton achieve in 2009? Can you be objective?
McLaren had a horrible year there, but I guess you can say that he had a huge gap to Kovalainen in overall performance (not points because Kovalainen had lots of retirements):

https://i.imgur.com/80qGmir.png

That he won on what looks to be a poor car speaks positively of him too.
Other than reliability issues that hampered, in the remaining races where it worked well, what exactly was so astonishing about it? No driver can win if the car isn't capable of winning. In fact looking at the trend, the car started improving and he won with an improving car. Otherwise, there wasn't anything worth noting. So basically, he struggles when the car struggles. Same with any driver.
Last edited by Moore77 on Fri Sep 18, 2020 12:45 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Gangdom: Pom, Tom, Loverboy, Boomer.

Fulcrum
Fulcrum
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Re: Will Schumacher's Race Win and WDC records be broken?

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Just_a_fan wrote:
Thu Sep 17, 2020 11:51 pm
Jolle wrote:
Thu Sep 17, 2020 10:27 pm
dans79 wrote:
Thu Sep 17, 2020 10:22 pm
Hamilton has the longer first name though! :lol: :lol: :lol:
WRONG!

Max Emilian Vs Lewis Carl.

Now apologise

(Under current forum rules made up by me only first two first names count)
First name: Max = 3 letters. Lewis = 5 letters. 5 > 3. Therefore Hamilton wins. :wink: :lol:

This is much more fun than the slagging off that happens at times. =D>
Max = 12 points in Scrabble
Lewis = 8.

Only problem for Max being Lewis will have one Scrabble point per World Title when he's done.

Just_a_fan
Just_a_fan
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Joined: Sun Jan 31, 2010 7:37 pm

Re: Will Schumacher's Race Win and WDC records be broken?

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Moore77 wrote:
Fri Sep 18, 2020 11:59 am

Did Hamilton not struggle in 2013 with Pirellis, while Vettel was brilliant? Same tires. Hamilton also struggled in 2009 when all that aero was gone and again, Vettel was brilliant then too.
In 2009, the Brawns and the RedBulls occupied 1-4 in the title table. Hamilton, in a dog of a car, was 5th well ahead of his team mate who was 12th. Hamilton was very much "best of the rest" behind the two teams that did the best job with the new aero regs. As said many times, no one wins titles in bad cars - you need to have the best / nearly best car to have a proper chance.
Turbo says "Dumpster sounds so much more classy. It's the diamond of the cesspools." oh, and "The Dutch fans are drunk. Maybe"