The Greatest "Rainmaster"?

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Pyrone89
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Re: The Greatest "Rainmaster"?

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ENGINE TUNER wrote:
Sun Jul 12, 2020 3:14 am
Pyrone89 wrote:
Sun Jul 12, 2020 2:53 am
ENGINE TUNER wrote:
Sun Jul 12, 2020 2:44 am

There was like a 5 year period where Senna dominanted every wet race until his engine let go while leading by far in Canada, then he went on winning the wet races again for another couple years.

Senna and Hamilton, best I've ever seen do it in the rain.
Apparently you missed a certain M. Schumacher period. https://www.youtube.com/results?search_ ... schumacher Enjoy
Where was all that speed when Senna was dominating him in the wet like back in 93?
Where was Hamilton when Verstappen was dominating him in Germany 2019? When Vettel was dominating him in 2008 Monza. When Vettel was dominating him early 2010’s.

...

ENGINE TUNER
ENGINE TUNER
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Re: The Greatest "Rainmaster"?

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Pyrone89 wrote:
Sun Jul 12, 2020 3:25 am
ENGINE TUNER wrote:
Sun Jul 12, 2020 3:14 am
Pyrone89 wrote:
Sun Jul 12, 2020 2:53 am


Apparently you missed a certain M. Schumacher period. https://www.youtube.com/results?search_ ... schumacher Enjoy
Where was all that speed when Senna was dominating him in the wet like back in 93?
Where was Hamilton when Verstappen was dominating him in Germany 2019? When Vettel was dominating him in 2008 Monza. When Vettel was dominating him early 2010’s.

See how easy it is to take things out of context?
...

Verstappen couldn't even keep up with Bottas in Germany 19 until the safety car shook everything up. Verstappen spun on slicks in sector 3 like everyone else.

Senna dominated Schumacher every time they raced against each other in the wet.

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hollus
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Re: The Greatest "Rainmaster"?

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Lots of posts gone away again.
Please, don't make things personal. If the only point of a post is to say that other poster's opinion is worthless, don't post it!
¡Puxa Esportin!

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Sieper
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Re: The Greatest "Rainmaster"?

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ENGINE TUNER wrote:
Sun Jul 12, 2020 4:40 am
Pyrone89 wrote:
Sun Jul 12, 2020 3:25 am
ENGINE TUNER wrote:
Sun Jul 12, 2020 3:14 am


Where was all that speed when Senna was dominating him in the wet like back in 93?
Where was Hamilton when Verstappen was dominating him in Germany 2019? When Vettel was dominating him in 2008 Monza. When Vettel was dominating him early 2010’s.

See how easy it is to take things out of context?
...

Verstappen couldn't even keep up with Bottas in Germany 19 until the safety car shook everything up. Verstappen spun on slicks in sector 3 like everyone else.

Senna dominated Schumacher every time they raced against each other in the wet.
Verstappen pulled a gap of +10 seconds on Bottas everytime (thrice I believe) in no time at all. He was, much, much faster then Bottas. Can I please ask you where this statement is based on?
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holeindalip
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Re: The Greatest "Rainmaster"?

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Sieper wrote:
Sun Jul 12, 2020 12:04 pm
ENGINE TUNER wrote:
Sun Jul 12, 2020 4:40 am
Pyrone89 wrote:
Sun Jul 12, 2020 3:25 am

Where was Hamilton when Verstappen was dominating him in Germany 2019? When Vettel was dominating him in 2008 Monza. When Vettel was dominating him early 2010’s.

See how easy it is to take things out of context?
...

Verstappen couldn't even keep up with Bottas in Germany 19 until the safety car shook everything up. Verstappen spun on slicks in sector 3 like everyone else.

Senna dominated Schumacher every time they raced against each other in the wet.
Verstappen pulled a gap of +10 seconds on Bottas everytime (thrice I believe) in no time at all. He was, much, much faster then Bottas. Can I please ask you where this statement is based on?
He’s right you know, Mercedes had that race in the bag until changing conditions shook the race up, watch it again and you’ll see.....

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Sieper
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Re: The Greatest "Rainmaster"?

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Here you can see what happened. first stint Max first had to overtake kimi, after a poor start and the gap then does increase from 3 to 6 seconds. After that Max was keeping up and after every restart Max did pull a gap on Bottas.



The statement was that Max was not even keeping up with Bottas, which he was (After the first stint which also included overtaking kimi after a poor start from the right hand side of the track) and once he passed him he put a big gap to Bottas after every Safety car situation.
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PlatinumZealot
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Re: The Greatest "Rainmaster"?

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So the RedBull was faster in the wet then.. Interesting..

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Sieper
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Re: The Greatest "Rainmaster"?

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The Merc to me seems the better car, also in the rain. What I got was Hamilton is the rainmaster (which he is) and Max is not even better then Bottas. Yeah. So there is that.
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dans79
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Re: The Greatest "Rainmaster"?

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Sieper wrote:
Mon Jul 13, 2020 8:23 pm
The Merc to me seems the better car, also in the rain. What I got was Hamilton is the rainmaster (which he is) and Max is not even better then Bottas. Yeah. So there is that.
I think Max is a fair bit better than Bottas in the rain, however the twitchyness of the RB16 isn't going to let him show it though.
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Sieper
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Re: The Greatest "Rainmaster"?

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I think it is fair to say the W11 seemed very good (Ofcourse in the expert hands of Lewis) On the wet track, but also, Sunday in the pre race program on ziggo sport they did a comparison lap of the qualy And They took Max’ fastest lap versus Lewis. The spray from Max tires was considerably more. Max his Very last lap (when he was up on his previous lap) was lost (as/when) Vettel had to pit after his off track moment And Max went wide there and Lewis also did his last lap as one of the very last. At hat moment the track conditions were a bit better (less bad). That was very clear. In the other sessions the two were also much closer matched, with Lewis being faster.
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Wynters
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Re: The Greatest "Rainmaster"?

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Pyrone89 wrote:
Sun Jul 12, 2020 3:25 am
Where was Hamilton when Verstappen was dominating him in Germany 2019?
36 Seconds down the road in less than 29 laps (although I think Hamilton still had to pit)? To be fair, in the wet Hamilton did run wide at a corner (compared to Verstappen who span off and then back on track, luckily not hitting anything). Even with the accident, Hamilton got back into the pits before Verstappen was even close to overtaking him. It was pit crew error (one minute pitstop?), then a penalty and poor strategy that put him at the back. I suspect he still scored points though, despite all that.
Pyrone89 wrote:
Sun Jul 12, 2020 3:25 am
When Vettel was dominating him in 2008 Monza.
Starting from 15th and setting a lap nearly a second faster than Vettel's best, despite having to fight through traffic?
Pyrone89 wrote:
Sun Jul 12, 2020 3:25 am
When Vettel was dominating him early 2010’s.
Winning a race every season? Beating Vettel in 1/3 of the wet Qualifying sessions*, despite his slower car (it is all about the car, I understand).

I'm not totally convinced that I'd call any of those 'being dominated'.

There are examples of Hamilton not doing well in the wet (he's only been on Pole in 11 of the 28 wet Qualifyings since he started F1, for instance) but your inability to choose any of them as your examples (even accidentally) suggest that your bias against Hamilton is not one that is informed by data or analysis.

*Correction, I originally said 'Pole' not 'beating Vettel' and I corrected the ratio.
Last edited by Wynters on Tue Jul 14, 2020 10:43 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PlatinumZealot
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Re: The Greatest "Rainmaster"?

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Sieper wrote:
Mon Jul 13, 2020 8:23 pm
The Merc to me seems the better car, also in the rain. What I got was Hamilton is the rainmaster (which he is) and Max is not even better then Bottas. Yeah. So there is that.
I don't know how you concluded Mercedes is better in the rain? I am not a f1 veteran but I have been watching since about 2000 and, between top cars, without any obvious fish-tailing or wild hacksawing at the wheel, It is very hard to clearly say wich cars are better in the rain without being some sort of serious race car expert. Not even the sky pundits (Ant davidson, Button, Chnadok) even dared to make such a guess...

You will have to tell us where you see the Mercedes car its self being easier to drive... There are times when either driver has to do corrections and damping of the throttle... Just different driving.

What I do see is the mercedes having higher speeds on the straights about 2 to 5kph faster.

Also Hamilton release the brake at higher speeds. He does more lift and coasting. This may be due to ERS settings.. Would love to see Bottas' on-board.


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Pyrone89
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Re: The Greatest "Rainmaster"?

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Give them equal cars Toto and see what happens

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PlatinumZealot
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Re: The Greatest "Rainmaster"?

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Pyrone89 wrote:
Mon Jul 13, 2020 11:55 pm
Give them equal cars Toto and see what happens
Why put a young 23 year old against an old 36 year old. That is a bit unfair don't you think?

Why not Max join Merc when Russel is there. That should be more appropriate.

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Pyrone89
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Re: The Greatest "Rainmaster"?

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PlatinumZealot wrote:
Tue Jul 14, 2020 2:48 am
Pyrone89 wrote:
Mon Jul 13, 2020 11:55 pm
Give them equal cars Toto and see what happens
Why put a young 23 year old against an old 36 year old. That is a bit unfair don't you think?

Why not Max join Merc when Russel is there. That should be more appropriate.
Wait, according to you he is better than Max, so why should age matter? :roll: