ICE/Motors Made of Plastic/Ceramic

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Carlos
Carlos
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Joined: Sat Sep 02, 2006 6:43 pm
Location: Canada

ICE/Motors Made of Plastic/Ceramic

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I remember someone asked about engines made of plastic or ceramic; but no one had any info,I ran a search but couldn't find the thread, I'm cleaning out my computer and found a link to a forum thread on the subject, on the the ICE Polimotor:

http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=2165621
http://www.lolaheritage.co.uk/scrapbook/004/004.htm

"Designed and developed by Polimotor founder and president Matty Holzberg, the engine, based on a Cosworth BDA, tipped the scales at 168 lbs - half the weight of its metal counterpart. Plastic parts included the engine block, cam cover, air intake trumpets, intake valve stems, piston skirts and wrist pins, connecting rods, oil scraper piston rings, tappets, valve spring retainers and timing gears."

Belatti
Belatti
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Joined: Tue Jul 10, 2007 8:48 pm
Location: Argentina

Re: ICE/Motors Made of Plastic/Ceramic

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Very interesting reading! Thats something I have wondered sometime but didn´t know that it was tried (and in the 80´s :shock: )
I think that know it would be more feasible to achieve, costs and knowledge about plastic/fiber composites are extended (the polimotor was created a couple of years after the first F1 carbon fiber chassis!!!)

PD: wrong forum #-o
"You need great passion, because everything you do with great pleasure, you do well." -Juan Manuel Fangio

"I have no idols. I admire work, dedication and competence." -Ayrton Senna

Carlos
Carlos
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Joined: Sat Sep 02, 2006 6:43 pm
Location: Canada

Re: ICE/Motors Made of Plastic/Ceramic

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A couple of other Forum threads/sites on the Polimotor's materials, specifications and construction & 1 on ceramics:

http://www.tamparacing.com/forums/archi ... 58437.html
http://patterico.com/2005/06/02/the-wis ... ng-part-2/
http://forums.autosport.com/showthread. ... =polimotor

Wrong Forum? :oops:

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ackzsel
0
Joined: Tue Nov 15, 2005 2:40 pm
Location: Alkmaar, NED

Re: ICE/Motors Made of Plastic/Ceramic

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Carlos wrote:Wrong Forum? :oops:
I think he means "wrong section". This thread would do better in "Engine, transmission and controls".

Conceptual
Conceptual
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Joined: Thu Nov 15, 2007 2:33 am

Re: ICE/Motors Made of Plastic/Ceramic

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This is by FAR the best plastic motor on the planet!

http://youtube.com/watch?v=PFGiWiXMHn0

http://youtube.com/watch?v=uHh5AqQ4_xw

The emissions are zero, as is fuel consumption. As my friend pointed out, it get a Zillion MPG!

Chris

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Ciro Pabón
106
Joined: Tue May 10, 2005 11:31 pm

Re: ICE/Motors Made of Plastic/Ceramic

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Thanks, Conceptual, I've forgotten about the Perendev engine. AFAIK, it was touted four or five years ago as the best invention since ice cream, but the site went dead and the american associates of Mr. Brady (?) "disassociated" from him. I've already expressed my views about perpetual motion machines, but, hey, they had the American Antigravitation Society (if I remember well) behind them... ;)

Trying to stay on thread, ceramic engines were tried by Toyota in the 80's. They were able to run so hot that, if I remember well, did not need cooling systems, which is a strong advantage. Also, the Carnot cycle works better the higher the difference of temperature between the engine and the environment. Unfortunately, they were the devil to manufacture and the gains were small: a sizable part of what you "won", in heat conserved in the combustion chamber, you lost to the oil. I believe Toyota used the experience to develop ceramic spark plugs and brake pads that are able to work at higher temperatures, but I'm not sure: all I know is that they appeared a few years after.

I think Isuzu also tried to build another ceramic engine. I also remember an old drawing in the 80's about a rotary Mazda engine made with ceramics.

Ford did something similar in the same epoch, using zirconium based ceramics. They have very low heat transfer rates and good shock properties.

If someone is interested in low heat rejection engines, you can read here a SAE paper on the subject:

http://personalwebs.oakland.edu/~leidel ... 1-0405.pdf

I think that most modern F1 engines have a lot of parts made of carbon fiber, which makes hard to find a better material from the point of view of strength/weight.
Ciro

Carlos
Carlos
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Joined: Sat Sep 02, 2006 6:43 pm
Location: Canada

Re: ICE/Motors Made of Plastic/Ceramic

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Ceramic Rotary Engine Company expects to feature a prototype this month according to this article.

http://www.ceramicrotaryengines.com/

Conceptual
Conceptual
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Joined: Thu Nov 15, 2007 2:33 am

Re: ICE/Motors Made of Plastic/Ceramic

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I had always wondered if they could use carbon fibre sheets, laser cut shapes, and then laminate them into an engine block. I have seen a few small blocks in my time (my family owned a junkyard when I was in elementary school, so I did ALOT of car stripping in my summers....:P), and I can realistically say that I think the stack lamination could actually work. Even if you had to ceramically sleeve the combustion chamber.

And Carlos, if you like the Perendev, give me your email, and I'll send you some AutoCAD renders of my "improved" Perendev concept. The best part is that it is different enough that it wont violate their patents and actually produces electricity without placing a mechanical load on the crankshaft, but it does use the same basic principles to produce constant motion.

Chris

Belatti
Belatti
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Joined: Tue Jul 10, 2007 8:48 pm
Location: Argentina

Re: ICE/Motors Made of Plastic/Ceramic

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ackzsel wrote:
Carlos wrote:Wrong Forum? :oops:
I think he means "wrong section". This thread would do better in "Engine, transmission and controls".
Yep, sorry pals, my english sometimes fails :oops:

Ciro Pabón wrote:They were able to run so hot that, if I remember well, did not need cooling systems, which is a strong advantage. Also, the Carnot cycle works better the higher the difference of temperature between the engine and the environment. Unfortunately, they were the devil to manufacture and the gains were small: a sizable part of what you "won", in heat conserved in the combustion chamber, you lost to the oil
Why using oil, then?

We are talking about plastic and ceramic parts rubing eachother (that sounds at least weird :? )
"You need great passion, because everything you do with great pleasure, you do well." -Juan Manuel Fangio

"I have no idols. I admire work, dedication and competence." -Ayrton Senna

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Ciro Pabón
106
Joined: Tue May 10, 2005 11:31 pm

Re: ICE/Motors Made of Plastic/Ceramic

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AFAIK, ceramic engines did not have plastic parts. Lubrication is needed no matter what material you choose.
Ciro

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HKS
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Joined: Mon Mar 05, 2007 5:37 am

Re: ICE/Motors Made of Plastic/Ceramic

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Hey Carlos,
Someone in Jaguar was/is working on a project where the crankshaft was made of a certain plastic material.

I have no clue about his name, designation or which material was he using.

I would enquire about it and let you know
Racing cars are neither beautiful nor ugly, they are beautiful only when you win races.

jakkspar
jakkspar
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Joined: Sat Jul 18, 2009 4:40 pm

Re: ICE/Motors Made of Plastic/Ceramic

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Carlos wrote:Ceramic Rotary Engine Company expects to feature a prototype this month according to this article.

http://www.ceramicrotaryengines.com/
I actually seen some of there works , very unique..



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