F1 innovations and inventions

A place to discuss the characteristics of the cars in Formula One, both current as well as historical. Laptimes, driver worshipping and team chatter does not belong here.
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Imp
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F1 innovations and inventions

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What has F1 done for road car technology, specifically which cars, and does F1 still need to be relevant to the road car industry?

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mclaren111
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I say NO !!!!!!!!!!!!

Greg Locock
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Imp wrote:
Sun Apr 02, 2017 9:17 am
What has F1 done for road car technology, specifically which cars, and does F1 still need to be relevant to the road car industry?
(a) Surprisingly little,directly, and (b) no. I'd say they've pushed aero analysis forward but aero is fairly unimportant for road cars.

Huntresa
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Greg Locock wrote:
Sun Apr 02, 2017 9:36 pm
Imp wrote:
Sun Apr 02, 2017 9:17 am
What has F1 done for road car technology, specifically which cars, and does F1 still need to be relevant to the road car industry?
(a) Surprisingly little,directly, and (b) no. I'd say they've pushed aero analysis forward but aero is fairly unimportant for road cars.

When it comes to the development of carbon fibre and other composite materials F1 has done a great deal for road cars and other industries.

When it comes to gearboxes/transmission the development of clutchless has also been done in F1 but ofc other racing series too.

Greg Locock
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The main use of carbon fibre in typical production cars is as a replacement for dead trees as an adornment. The most advanced carbon fibre wheels in the world were developed for, and are available for, production cars, not F1.

I'd be interested to see examples where technology has bled across from F1, but I'd be surprised if gearboxes were a good example.

roon
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Cheesy example, but paddle shifters usually got credited as "F1-style" in road car marketing & journo buzz. I don't know if F1 actually developed them though, or if they were even the first to use them.

Greg Locock
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Push button semi-automatic gearboxes? 1930s , unless you think that the flappy paddle itself is some great F1 innovation. Do I hear the sound of straws being grasped?

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SR71
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Greg Locock wrote:
Sun Apr 02, 2017 9:36 pm
Imp wrote:
Sun Apr 02, 2017 9:17 am
What has F1 done for road car technology, specifically which cars, and does F1 still need to be relevant to the road car industry?
(a) Surprisingly little,directly, and (b) no. I'd say they've pushed aero analysis forward but aero is fairly unimportant for road cars.
Aero is unimportant for road cars? Wow.

You know a Prius probably has more aero development than an F1 car right?

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godlameroso
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Indirectly you could say that the engine and chassis manufacturing developments in racing has improved the engineering that goes into production cars. But then again that could also be due to having better computers that lead to more precise manufacturing with tighter tolerances.
The height of cultivation is really nothing special. It is merely simplicity; the ability to express the utmost with the minimum. Mr.Lee

torpor
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I heard from several friends working at Mercedes-Benz in Stuttgart that there is a big technology transfer when it comes to engine, hybrid system and lubricants. Especially in the efficiency point of view. But also chassis and gearbox design, electronics and quality management.
Especially in the last three years they learned a lot during the development of the power unit.
This is an important part of their investment in Formula 1.

Greg Locock
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SR71 wrote:
Thu Apr 06, 2017 3:00 am
Greg Locock wrote:
Sun Apr 02, 2017 9:36 pm
Imp wrote:
Sun Apr 02, 2017 9:17 am
What has F1 done for road car technology, specifically which cars, and does F1 still need to be relevant to the road car industry?
(a) Surprisingly little,directly, and (b) no. I'd say they've pushed aero analysis forward but aero is fairly unimportant for road cars.
Aero is unimportant for road cars? Wow.

You know a Prius probably has more aero development than an F1 car right?
I didn't say that. I said fairly unimportant, so I struggle to assume good faith in your question. The difference that a good Cd makes in quoted mpg compared with a rubbish Cd is tiny. Go on, work it out (if you can).

torpor
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I think you can't compare aerodynamics in racing cars with aerodynamics in road cars because of different goals.

In Formula 1 principal focus lies on downforce.
In production vehicles the principal focus lies on low air resistance.

The aerodynamics of the Prius isn't that good (and not worth the ugly shape)!!

Drag coefficient:

Toyota Prius: 0,24
Mercedes-Benz CLA: 0,22

-

Dodge Ram: 0,36
McLaren P1: 0,34

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Tim.Wright
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SR71 wrote:
Thu Apr 06, 2017 3:00 am
Aero is unimportant for road cars? Wow.

You know a Prius probably has more aero development than an F1 car right?
I doubt that very much. In road cars styling has an order of magnitude precedence over drag.

Next on the list - and probably the primary development area of aerodynamics in road cars is reduction/management of wind noise.
Not the engineer at Force India

Jersey Tom
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Imp wrote:
Sun Apr 02, 2017 9:17 am
What has F1 done for road car technology
Hardly anything.

Imp wrote:
Sun Apr 02, 2017 9:17 am
Does F1 still need to be relevant to the road car industry?
Never has been, never will be. It exists for entertainment, pure and simple.
Grip is a four letter word. All opinions are my own and not those of current or previous employers.

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Tim.Wright
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Jersey Tom wrote:
Thu Apr 06, 2017 12:20 pm
Imp wrote:
Sun Apr 02, 2017 9:17 am
Does F1 still need to be relevant to the road car industry?
Never has been, never will be. It exists for entertainment, pure and simple.
I'd slightly disagree in that, commercially, the road relevance is extremely important to the OEMs involved. Given that motorsport is almost completely run on the advertising budgets of OEMs - if you take away the road relevence, a large portion of the sports bugets will walk away.

What a lot of people don't get, however, is that the road relevence is F1 copying whats on the road. Not the otherway around.
Not the engineer at Force India