Aston Martin AMR21

A place to discuss the characteristics of the cars in Formula One, both current as well as historical. Laptimes, driver worshipping and team chatter do not belong here.
gridwalker
gridwalker
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Re: Aston Martin AMR21

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Notched floor confirmed on sky.

Any pics would be appreciated :)
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MtthsMlw
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Re: Aston Martin AMR21

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Image
via @rosf1design

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jagunx51
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Re: Aston Martin AMR21

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MtthsMlw wrote:
26 Mar 2021, 14:21
https://i.imgur.com/ocaMZhY.jpg
via @rosf1design
I thought the floor should be angled :?:
............!!!!

gridwalker
gridwalker
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Re: Aston Martin AMR21

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jagunx51 wrote:
26 Mar 2021, 14:48
MtthsMlw wrote:
26 Mar 2021, 14:21
https://i.imgur.com/ocaMZhY.jpg
via @rosf1design
I thought the floor should be angled :?:
Those are just the maximum dimensions.

You can always have a smaller floor, if you find it advantageous.
"Change is inevitable, except from a vending machine ..."

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MtthsMlw
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Re: Aston Martin AMR21

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Here is a better pic. Similar to Mercs solution.
Image
via @NicolasF1i

aerofoilf1
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Re: Aston Martin AMR21

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Some other angles

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Image

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JordanMugen
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Re: Aston Martin AMR21

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So they want whatever vortex is generated by those series of vanes to interact with the cutout in the floor? :?:

The requirement for there to be a gap in the floor behind the vanes is somehow important, but I wonder how and why!? :?:

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JordanMugen
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Re: Aston Martin AMR21

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jjn9128 wrote:
26 Mar 2021, 14:10
A lot of teams have this - Alpha Tauri were the first to show it in their render - I think it sheds the edge vortex outboard rather than following the edge of the floor and hurting diffuser performance.
If you don't mind me asking, the edge vortex from what? :oops:

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jjn9128
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Re: Aston Martin AMR21

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JordanMugen wrote:
26 Mar 2021, 22:38
jjn9128 wrote:
26 Mar 2021, 14:10
A lot of teams have this - Alpha Tauri were the first to show it in their render - I think it sheds the edge vortex outboard rather than following the edge of the floor and hurting diffuser performance.
If you don't mind me asking, the edge vortex from what? :oops:
The edge vortex of the floor. The low pressure underneath causes higher pressure air from above to roll around the edge- which increases the pressure under the car and costs downforce.

How I see this working is that because front half of the floor has a lower pressure than the mid-rear, especially talking under the scroll at the outboard edge which is being worked hard thanks to the bagerboards and venetian blind flaps, the edge vortex being formed is quite strong - and obviously unwanted. This break in the edge surface forces the vortex to shed, it is then pushed outboard with the aid of the outwash and vortex from the VGs on the top surface, which is rotating in the opposite direction. Then there will be a second, weaker, vortex forming at the edge of the floor downstream which does not pull so much higher pressure air under the car. It costs surface area but if the mean pressure under the car as a result is lower it's a benefit.
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JordanMugen
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Re: Aston Martin AMR21

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jjn9128 wrote:
26 Mar 2021, 22:57
JordanMugen wrote:
26 Mar 2021, 22:38
jjn9128 wrote:
26 Mar 2021, 14:10
A lot of teams have this - Alpha Tauri were the first to show it in their render - I think it sheds the edge vortex outboard rather than following the edge of the floor and hurting diffuser performance.
If you don't mind me asking, the edge vortex from what? :oops:
The edge vortex of the floor. The low pressure underneath causes higher pressure air from above to roll around the edge- which increases the pressure under the car and costs downforce.

How I see this working is that because front half of the floor has a lower pressure than the mid-rear, especially talking under the scroll at the outboard edge which is being worked hard thanks to the bagerboards and venetian blind flaps, the edge vortex being formed is quite strong - and obviously unwanted. This break in the edge surface forces the vortex to shed, it is then pushed outboard with the aid of the outwash and vortex from the VGs on the top surface, which is rotating in the opposite direction. Then there will be a second, weaker, vortex forming at the edge of the floor downstream which does not pull so much higher pressure air under the car. It costs surface area but if the mean pressure under the car as a result is lower it's a benefit.
=D> =D> =D> Wonderful analysis!

It's terribly clever by Aston Martin.

101FlyingDutchman
101FlyingDutchman
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Re: Aston Martin AMR21

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Not that clever. Quite easily visualised in a wind tunnel or CFD. As you know, air behaves much like water/liquid so you’ll be able to see the disturbances generated. It’s not like they have to dream the vortices up with pen and paper! Nontheless, good explanation

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godlameroso
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Re: Aston Martin AMR21

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jjn9128 wrote:
26 Mar 2021, 22:57
JordanMugen wrote:
26 Mar 2021, 22:38
jjn9128 wrote:
26 Mar 2021, 14:10
A lot of teams have this - Alpha Tauri were the first to show it in their render - I think it sheds the edge vortex outboard rather than following the edge of the floor and hurting diffuser performance.
If you don't mind me asking, the edge vortex from what? :oops:
The edge vortex of the floor. The low pressure underneath causes higher pressure air from above to roll around the edge- which increases the pressure under the car and costs downforce.

How I see this working is that because front half of the floor has a lower pressure than the mid-rear, especially talking under the scroll at the outboard edge which is being worked hard thanks to the bagerboards and venetian blind flaps, the edge vortex being formed is quite strong - and obviously unwanted. This break in the edge surface forces the vortex to shed, it is then pushed outboard with the aid of the outwash and vortex from the VGs on the top surface, which is rotating in the opposite direction. Then there will be a second, weaker, vortex forming at the edge of the floor downstream which does not pull so much higher pressure air under the car. It costs surface area but if the mean pressure under the car as a result is lower it's a benefit.
I think this is why they're struggling, I don't have the CFD to prove it, but I think they're increasing the pressure on the face of the rear tire. This increases tire squirt, because you're aiming air directly at the face of the tire where the pressure is highest increasing it further. When the edge vortex from the floor smashes into the tire it dissipates and increases the pressure on the face. Since air will always flow towards the path of least resistance that high pressure air will seek the lowest pressure gradient, which is under the car.

I believe under yaw the low pressure tire squirt goes outboard and steals airflow going to the diffuser. The fix is aiming the tip vortex from the floor slightly more inbound so it doesn't migrate so far outboard during yaw.
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Morteza
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Re: Aston Martin AMR21

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And another angle :D
Image
Via @NicolasF1i
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raymondu999
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Re: Aston Martin AMR21

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Are they basically just making it a straighter (albeit smaller) floor so they can then direct a straight vortex into the edge? As opposed to having a vortex along the edge, then where the floor tapers it has no vortex seal?

Ironically, would the last season RP20 sidepods (with the downwash) not then be a stronger package? Feeding downwash air through the triangle slot between the taper and the vortex?
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Morteza
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Re: Aston Martin AMR21

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Image

Image

Image
Last edited by Morteza on 15 Apr 2021, 22:39, edited 2 times in total.
"A fool thinks himself to be wise, but a wise man knows himself to be a fool."~William Shakespeare