2014 Belgian GP - Spa-Francorchamps

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turbof1
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Re: 2014 Belgian GP - Spa-Francorchamps

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I'm currently locking the thread to get some of the snide remarks removed. Offenders that made their posts after my first warning will be penalised. Thread will continue in a little while. Everybody should take some fresh air in the meanwhile to cool a bit down.

edit: reopened. Also reiterating this message: http://www.f1technical.net/forum/viewto ... 97#p529597
#AeroFrodo

kptaylor
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Re: 2014 Belgian GP - Spa-Francorchamps

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Racing incident. Could Nico have run wide to avoid contact? Yes. Did he have to? No. Was he trying to make a point that he can be as aggressive as Lewis? Probably what he meant. Who knows for sure. If it was as egregious as some are making it out to be, wouldn't the stewards have investigated? I don't remember seeing any graphic regarding that.

Also not sure why Lauda seems to imply it's okay to attack in the last few laps, but not okay in the first few. Isn't the team risk the same?

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turbof1
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Re: 2014 Belgian GP - Spa-Francorchamps

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Toto Wolf comments on the whether-or-not-deliberate issue:

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/115558

Obviously this is just an attempt to downsize the weight of the comment. Very important is that he confirms Rosberg intentionally kept his car there. So Rosberg was fully aware that he should have moved out of the way. I don't think he intended the contact, but this isn't a racing incident anymore since intent got mixed in it.

Hamilton's word also might have been twisted a bit: Hamilton said he did "it" on purpose. He never said Rosberg crashed into him deliberately, he said "he allowed himself to do so" as in Rosberg put himself intentionally into a position that could end up with a collision. The collision isn't intentional in its own right. It's a piece that journalism is very trigger happy to change its context that little bit to make seem much worse. It's still a very grave issue, there's no denying to that, but it's more like a unjustified "stand-my-ground" then "I ran intentionally into him".
#AeroFrodo

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Andres125sx
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Re: 2014 Belgian GP - Spa-Francorchamps

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NTS wrote:In karting we have a few guys in our team that tend to drive "elbows out", which is a style you choose. HAM does the same thing, he chooses to turn left there instead of leaving half a meter of extra space at the apex of the next corner. He has the right to do so, and it gets him an advantage if it works (which is 9 our of 10 times), but it ends in tears 1 out of 10 times.
+1

But this does not mean it´s Hamilton fault. Drivers who choose "elbows out" style just ignore they can avoid the crash too. They prefer to assume it´s the other one who will give up.

The situation is like if you close your eyes and ignore the danger (ignore there´s a car next to you and continue driving like if you´re alone at the track). Sometimes you´ll be safe (if the rival slows down), sometimes you don´t. Some people will say that´s brave, some will say thats dangerous and/or crazy

But this time Rosberg was not close enough to say Hamilton should have let him more space. "Elbows out" style is notorious in situations like Alonso-Magnusen fight, when Alonso was side to side with Kevin and he pushed Alonso out of the track. But Rosberg was not side to side, so here Hamilton didn´t use the "elbows out" style, he just kept his leading position and did not open any door


Rosberg fault, but racing incident, he just failed judging front wing-rear tyre distance and broke his wing and Lewis tyre, bad luck but don´t think that´s enough to ask for punishment

TheGkbrk
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Re: 2014 Belgian GP - Spa-Francorchamps

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What if we see a repeat of 2007 and see Ricciardo win the title against an in-team battle? That would be great I'd say.

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SectorOne
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Re: 2014 Belgian GP - Spa-Francorchamps

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It´s a very strange reaction from Rosberg to even begin to think like that.
He´s been in Hamilton´s position in Canada at the start and did not budge one bit and yet now he feels Hamilton should move aside when the roles are reversed.

People also like to point fingers at Hamilton when in fact all the big names does this and has done this for year and years.
"If the only thing keeping a person decent is the expectation of divine reward, then brother that person is a piece of sh*t"

radosav
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Re: 2014 Belgian GP - Spa-Francorchamps

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What would Ricciardo do with Red Bull cars from last four years?
Great driver! Great!

DaveKillens
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Re: 2014 Belgian GP - Spa-Francorchamps

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I really enjoyed the race. Although the incident is an unhappy chapter, it does not take away from the fact that it was a very interesting race with some spectacular action. Two laps to go, four cars fighting for fifth, wow. Alonso making some crazy outside passes, wow. Kimi finding redemption, wow. Ricciardo winning his third race of this season, double WOW. Bottas once again finding the podium and confirming that Williams are finally going in the right direction.

A lot more good things happened than bad things. And if you want to dwell on something that is done and dried, welcome to Bernie's world. No doubt TV viewership will be up for the next race, and he's got to make up what he paid out lately.
Racing should be decided on the track, not the court room.

radosav
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Re: 2014 Belgian GP - Spa-Francorchamps

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MMagnussen needs to look more in his car mirrors ! If there was Massa on Alonso's place, they both wouldn't finish the race!

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SiLo
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Re: 2014 Belgian GP - Spa-Francorchamps

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Not too sure what to make of it. Racing incident I think really, but Toto made the best point so far of saying "It was lap 2 of a long race."

Don't go half poking your nose in there on lap 2, go when the space is there to make a pass. In my book it's more Rosbergs fault but just poor decision making. Problem is it sounds like he exacerbated the issue by saying that he could have avoided the contact.
Felipe Baby!

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Andres125sx
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Re: 2014 Belgian GP - Spa-Francorchamps

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Meanwhile...

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Awesome race for Ricciardo... again. Almost feel sad for Vettel :twisted:

The aussie is proving to be really good, don´t know if Vettel deserves four tittles, but he´s a WDC anycase and Ricciardo is beating him fair and square, and constantly.

Imagine Ricciardo would have NOT been excluded from Australia results because of the fuel flow meter when he was second... he´d be fighting with Lewis for the second, and only 46 points from Rosberg :shock:
Last edited by Andres125sx on 24 Aug 2014, 20:16, edited 1 time in total.

Raleigh
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Re: 2014 Belgian GP - Spa-Francorchamps

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NTS wrote:
Raleigh wrote:Nico hacked the wheel left, away from Hamilton, then turned hard back into him to increase the force of the impact.
You're mis-quoting and exaggerating. He did not say "I ran deliberately into Lewis", according to Hamilton, Rosberg said he didn't avoid the accident to prove a point. Which is totally different from trying to "increase the force" when running into somebody.
I'm not quoting anybody there, just telling you what I saw. Nico turned hard left away from Hamilton and then hard right into him, almost full lock in both cases.

NTS
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Re: 2014 Belgian GP - Spa-Francorchamps

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SectorOne wrote:It´s a very strange reaction from Rosberg to even begin to think like that.
He´s been in Hamilton´s position in Canada at the start and did not budge one bit and yet now he feels Hamilton should move aside when the roles are reversed.
I think (but I'm just guessing) that Rosberg was having the last laps of the Hungarian GP in mind. Hamilton didn't let him through (which in my opinion was correct, why let someone through who is so far behind). But that caused him to stop a few laps late (which explain the "Rosberg was angry at team bosses" quote), which meant Rosberg caught Hamilton at the very end of the race. Then he failed to overtake due to a very elbows-out move of Hamilton, who basically pushed him onto the grass on exit (which is allowed, but it was a bit on the edge)

With that moment, where he avoided an accident and lost his single chance of overtaking, in mind I can imagine he decided not to avoid any more accidents for the rest of the season. Stupid choice for an F1 driver, because he has a lot of points to loose in accidents as well. But I can understand the emotion if he feels like he lost to Hamilton due to Hamilton's ruthless driving style.

ss.vamsikrishna
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Re: 2014 Belgian GP - Spa-Francorchamps

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Great to see Kimi rock finally it was good to see him do well :)
Would like to see more from him [-o< [-o< [-o< ...just missed the podium
Great job Riccardo !!!

Waywardism
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Re: 2014 Belgian GP - Spa-Francorchamps

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NTS wrote:
SectorOne wrote:It´s a very strange reaction from Rosberg to even begin to think like that.
He´s been in Hamilton´s position in Canada at the start and did not budge one bit and yet now he feels Hamilton should move aside when the roles are reversed.
I think (but I'm just guessing) that Rosberg was having the last laps of the Hungarian GP in mind. Hamilton didn't let him through (which in my opinion was correct, why let someone through who is so far behind). But that caused him to stop a few laps late (which explain the "Rosberg was angry at team bosses" quote), which meant Rosberg caught Hamilton at the very end of the race. Then he failed to overtake due to a very elbows-out move of Hamilton, who basically pushed him onto the grass on exit (which is allowed, but it was a bit on the edge)

With that moment, where he avoided an accident and lost his single chance of overtaking, in mind I can imagine he decided not to avoid any more accidents for the rest of the season. Stupid choice for an F1 driver, because he has a lot of points to loose in accidents as well. But I can understand the emotion if he feels like he lost to Hamilton due to Hamilton's ruthless driving style.
I think you're spot on there. You'd think Nico would've learned from Bahrain that Lewis will never let him round the outside of him.