2019 Brazilian Grand Prix - Interlagos, 15-17 November

For ease of use, there is one thread per grand prix where you can discuss everything during that specific GP weekend. You can find these threads here.
Espresso
Espresso
40
Joined: Wed Dec 13, 2017 2:03 pm

Re: 2019 Brazilian Grand Prix - Interlagos, 15-17 November

Post

maxxer wrote:
Mon Nov 18, 2019 12:09 am
one of the ferrari drivers need to get 2 points on their license too
The other one too for his move on Sainz in round 1.😉
Guess karma intervened and settled the bill.
Do you feel the need to post, comment or criticize in this forum?
Please substantiate (why, how, what) your reply!
This is no twitter or chatbox but a forum.

Stay friendly and keep away bashing, trolling & baiting from our wonderful technical forum. --> Forum Guide

zeph
zeph
71
Joined: Sat Aug 07, 2010 10:54 am
Location: Los Angeles

Re: 2019 Brazilian Grand Prix - Interlagos, 15-17 November

Post

Man, what a circus today!

That was very entertaining, lol.


I feel sorry for Albon, but there seems to be a whiff of poetic justice for Gasly, to get his first podium before Albon does.

User avatar
TAG
118
Joined: Tue Dec 09, 2014 3:18 pm
Location: in a good place

Re: 2019 Brazilian Grand Prix - Interlagos, 15-17 November

Post

langedweil wrote:
Mon Nov 18, 2019 1:02 am
That's always where the errors come from. Max has been fighting these guys with up to know inferior material, so pushing at least at 110%.
But now the tables are turning, or at least equalizing, everybody needs to do more racing, and in racing more errors are made .. at least more then when one's driving way up front with clean air and a 12sec buffer.
Most of the guys in the current pack are prone to the same errors when they need to race for it ..
I'm hoping that Red Bull start 2020 the way they're ending 2019. Seeing Max in a year long championship race, wondering if he'll race the way he does when there's a championship to lose.
माकडाच्या हाती कोलीत

User avatar
Andres125sx
362
Joined: Tue Aug 13, 2013 9:15 am
Location: Madrid, Spain

Re: 2019 Brazilian Grand Prix - Interlagos, 15-17 November

Post

What a race!!!

First of all, congratulations to Gasly and Sainz for their very first podiums, even if the FIA didn´t allow Sainz to enjoy it live (it was pretty obvious Lewis would be penalized). And from last grid position! :wtf: simply amazing =D>

Then Ferrari... #-o At the spanish broadcast they said, specially Toni Cuquerella, the guilty part is Ferrari because of allowing teammate battles. Normally I would agree, but when there´s a champion and the title is not in play I think it´s ok if they can fight. If we assume they were free to fight, then it´s Vettel fault 100%, there´s no reason to move to the left where his teammate was placed. Lecrerc did nothing wrong, he was perfectly straight and did nothing to cause the collision, nor had any chance to avoid it

I feel sad for Albon, when he finally make a good race improving his standard 6th position with 3rd best car, Hamilton ruins it. Ouch!

A great race overall
Last edited by turbof1 on Mon Nov 18, 2019 7:57 am, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: removed foul language

User avatar
siskue2005
194
Joined: Fri May 11, 2007 8:50 pm

Re: 2019 Brazilian Grand Prix - Interlagos, 15-17 November

Post

TAG wrote:
Mon Nov 18, 2019 2:24 am
langedweil wrote:
Mon Nov 18, 2019 1:02 am
That's always where the errors come from. Max has been fighting these guys with up to know inferior material, so pushing at least at 110%.
But now the tables are turning, or at least equalizing, everybody needs to do more racing, and in racing more errors are made .. at least more then when one's driving way up front with clean air and a 12sec buffer.
Most of the guys in the current pack are prone to the same errors when they need to race for it ..
I'm hoping that Red Bull start 2020 the way they're ending 2019. Seeing Max in a year long championship race, wondering if he'll race the way he does when there's a championship to lose.
The red bull was the fastest car at the end of 2018 season aswell, but I think their pace is somewhat flattered due to their new engines, other teams stopping their development and track factors

User avatar
turbof1
Moderator
Joined: Thu Jul 19, 2012 8:36 pm
Location: MountDoom CFD Matrix

Re: 2019 Brazilian Grand Prix - Interlagos, 15-17 November

Post

Andres125sx wrote:
Mon Nov 18, 2019 7:55 am
What a race!!!

First of all, congratulations to Gasly and Sainz for their very first podiums, even if the FIA didn´t allow Sainz to enjoy it live (it was pretty obvious Lewis would be penalized). And from last grid position! :wtf: simply amazing =D>

Then Ferrari... #-o At the spanish broadcast they said, specially Toni Cuquerella, the guilty part is Ferrari because of allowing teammate battles. Normally I would agree, but when there´s a champion and the title is not in play I think it´s ok if they can fight. If we assume they were free to fight, then it´s Vettel fault 100%, there´s no reason to move to the left where his teammate was placed. Lecrerc did nothing wrong, he was perfectly straight and did nothing to cause the collision, nor had any chance to avoid it

I feel sad for Albon, when he finally make a good race improving his standard 6th position with 3rd best car, Hamilton ruins it. Ouch!

A great race overall
First of all, the FIA has nothing to do with the stewards deciding.

Second, I'd argue it is better to have a late decision then a wrong decision. I think the major hold up was that they took explanations from Vettel and Leclerc first, and those 2 had to forfill their press obligations first. Yes, there is certainly a case to be made to have the Sainz case decided on first, but he would have missed the podium anyway even if they fasttracked his case. Because Hamilton had to forfill his press duties as well.

It is very unfortunate that Sainz couldn't get on the physical podium, or even the press conference. That being said, justice is done properly.
#AeroFrodo

User avatar
Andres125sx
362
Joined: Tue Aug 13, 2013 9:15 am
Location: Madrid, Spain

Re: 2019 Brazilian Grand Prix - Interlagos, 15-17 November

Post

Sorry, it was the stewards not FIA, true. But it was obvious and they could have make the decision much faster to allow Sainz enjoy his first podium ever properly

User avatar
NathanOlder
164
Joined: Fri Mar 02, 2012 9:05 am
Location: Kent

Re: 2019 Brazilian Grand Prix - Interlagos, 15-17 November

Post

Espresso wrote:
Mon Nov 18, 2019 1:24 am
maxxer wrote:
Mon Nov 18, 2019 12:09 am
one of the ferrari drivers need to get 2 points on their license too
The other one too for his move on Sainz in round 1.😉
Guess karma intervened and settled the bill.
Lando.
GoLandoGo
Lewis v2.0
King George has arrived.

New found love for GT racing with Assetto Corsa Competizione on PS5 & PC

User avatar
turbof1
Moderator
Joined: Thu Jul 19, 2012 8:36 pm
Location: MountDoom CFD Matrix

Re: 2019 Brazilian Grand Prix - Interlagos, 15-17 November

Post

Andres125sx wrote:
Mon Nov 18, 2019 8:06 am
Sorry, it was the stewards not FIA, true. But it was obvious and they could have make the decision much faster to allow Sainz enjoy his first podium ever properly
The stewards have to wait for the drivers to forfill their media commitments. Sainz was never going to enjoy that podium. Again, it is unfortunate, but you can't blame the stewards for that. Sainz his own case was pretty straightforward: look at the telemetry and decide; they don't need the driver for an explanation for that I think. But in Hamilton's case, they had to wait for his explanation. And since he had to go through the podium ceremony, press conference and post race interviews, the stewards had to wait.

If you want to blame something, blame the procedure. I just don't think you can blame the stewards for that unless you want to argue they didn't have to hear Hamilton first. I'd argue they had to do their job properly, and they did so by hearing out Hamilton first
#AeroFrodo

User avatar
NathanOlder
164
Joined: Fri Mar 02, 2012 9:05 am
Location: Kent

Re: 2019 Brazilian Grand Prix - Interlagos, 15-17 November

Post

Andres125sx wrote:
Mon Nov 18, 2019 7:55 am
What a race!!!

First of all, congratulations to Gasly and Sainz for their very first podiums, even if the FIA didn´t allow Sainz to enjoy it live (it was pretty obvious Lewis would be penalized). And from last grid position! :wtf: simply amazing =D>

Then Ferrari... #-o At the spanish broadcast they said, specially Toni Cuquerella, the guilty part is Ferrari because of allowing teammate battles. Normally I would agree, but when there´s a champion and the title is not in play I think it´s ok if they can fight. If we assume they were free to fight, then it´s Vettel fault 100%, there´s no reason to move to the left where his teammate was placed. Lecrerc did nothing wrong, he was perfectly straight and did nothing to cause the collision, nor had any chance to avoid it

I feel sad for Albon, when he finally make a good race improving his standard 6th position with 3rd best car, Hamilton ruins it. Ouch!

A great race overall
To be fair, Albon will get his podium, next season for sure. Yesterday he was unlucky to lose the podium, but was lucky to get in that position to start with really. without the 2 safety cars, Bottas breaking down and Seb taking out the 2 Ferrari's, Albon was'nt really in contention for a podium. No one did more than 30 laps on the mediums, and Albon would have had to do nearly 50. So he would have pitted and returned to the track in P6, so a podium was not on the cards.

If Albon had passed Lewis and Seb to get up to 2nd, then yeah, hard luck. He took it very well though, and even took some of the blame for the incident. Fair play to him, he's a nice guy.
GoLandoGo
Lewis v2.0
King George has arrived.

New found love for GT racing with Assetto Corsa Competizione on PS5 & PC

User avatar
search
9
Joined: Sat Jul 19, 2014 8:20 pm

Re: 2019 Brazilian Grand Prix - Interlagos, 15-17 November

Post

NathanOlder wrote:
Mon Nov 18, 2019 8:29 am
To be fair, Albon will get his podium, next season for sure. Yesterday he was unlucky to lose the podium, but was lucky to get in that position to start with really. without the 2 safety cars, Bottas breaking down and Seb taking out the 2 Ferrari's, Albon was'nt really in contention for a podium. No one did more than 30 laps on the mediums, and Albon would have had to do nearly 50. So he would have pitted and returned to the track in P6, so a podium was not on the cards.
Albon surely wouldn't have fighted for the podium without the safety car indeed, but he already was ahead of the two Ferrari at that point (and able to defend the position, by the look of it).

By the way... does anyone know if Sainz (apart from the start) overtook a single other driver yesterday on his way from 20th to 3rd?

User avatar
Vettel165
5
Joined: Fri Apr 06, 2018 7:46 pm
Location: Maribor/Slovenia

Re: 2019 Brazilian Grand Prix - Interlagos, 15-17 November

Post

Both were guilty. Charles and Seb. Charles being an jerk pushing Seb so to the right while having tons of space to the left. And Seb while already ahead going left a little bit.

But you can see the Charles steering wheel. He was rotating also the the right unnecesarilly. It was racing accident.

Image

User avatar
Andres125sx
362
Joined: Tue Aug 13, 2013 9:15 am
Location: Madrid, Spain

Re: 2019 Brazilian Grand Prix - Interlagos, 15-17 November

Post

turbof1 wrote:
Mon Nov 18, 2019 8:25 am
Andres125sx wrote:
Mon Nov 18, 2019 8:06 am
Sorry, it was the stewards not FIA, true. But it was obvious and they could have make the decision much faster to allow Sainz enjoy his first podium ever properly
The stewards have to wait for the drivers to forfill their media commitments. Sainz was never going to enjoy that podium. Again, it is unfortunate, but you can't blame the stewards for that. Sainz his own case was pretty straightforward: look at the telemetry and decide; they don't need the driver for an explanation for that I think. But in Hamilton's case, they had to wait for his explanation. And since he had to go through the podium ceremony, press conference and post race interviews, the stewards had to wait.

If you want to blame something, blame the procedure. I just don't think you can blame the stewards for that unless you want to argue they didn't have to hear Hamilton first. I'd argue they had to do their job properly, and they did so by hearing out Hamilton first
Obviously they didn't have to hear Lewis first, as they didn't with Ricciardo some laps before, even when Ricciardo move wasn't as much of a divebomb as it was in Lewis case

Or they were not fair with Ric not waiting for his explanation, or they didn't need to wait for Lewis explanation, but the procedure should be the same in both scenarios, and it wasn't, which is not acceptable in any steward

I don't usually blame stewards for lack of consistency between different incidents as they're different on each GP, but in this case both accidents were in same GP so same Stewards, and same Stewards should never change their standards during the race

sosic2121
sosic2121
17
Joined: Wed Jun 08, 2016 11:14 am

Re: 2019 Brazilian Grand Prix - Interlagos, 15-17 November

Post

I have to say, as a Ferrari fan, I'm hugely disappointed with both Ferrari drivers.
IMO team should come first, but they are behaving like spoiled children, and it's not the first time. It seems it doesn't matter where they finish as long as they beat their team mate #-o #-o
Of course, team has it's share of blame by not having clear rules and better management of their drivers.

It's a shame Lewis made that mistake and ruined his and Albon's race.

Max had incredible race today, he defeated Lewis fair and square today. And more importantly, he made no stupid mistakes =D>

Wass85
Wass85
-19
Joined: Wed Mar 01, 2017 9:11 pm

Re: 2019 Brazilian Grand Prix - Interlagos, 15-17 November

Post

Vettel165 wrote:
Mon Nov 18, 2019 9:27 am
Both were guilty. Charles and Seb. Charles being an jerk pushing Seb so to the right while having tons of space to the left. And Seb while already ahead going left a little bit.

But you can see the Charles steering wheel. He was rotating also the the right unnecesarilly. It was racing accident.

https://postimages.org/
This was Turkey 2010 0.25 version. 😂

A simple racing incident, both parties wanted that podium so it's inevitable these things will happen sometimes. At least Ferrari are showing they will allow them to race each other, they unfairly get flack for team orders when other teams are exactly the same.