2019 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

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Scorpaguy
4
Joined: Thu Mar 04, 2010 4:05 am

Re: 2019 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

Post by Scorpaguy » Sat Jan 12, 2019 2:37 am

Arrivabene deserved another year...he did a good job.

Merc had a better car than did Ferrari for more than 3/4 of the races...not the other way around.

Vet made a few mistakes...not many. Ham made none.

Kimi was at least least as good a wingman as was Bot...for God's sake, Bot almost cried when Toto first used the word.

If Arri had stayed, Ferrari would at least have a decent 2019, top 3...maybe top 2...maybe tops. With this new guy, pretty much same thing. The Big Red is a BIG organization...about as maneuverable as the Titanic. Domination by them in the current aero/hybrid environment is not going to happen.

Capharol
4
Joined: Sun Nov 04, 2018 4:06 pm

Re: 2019 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

Post by Capharol » Sat Jan 12, 2019 2:45 pm

Manoah2u wrote:
Sat Jan 12, 2019 2:02 am
https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/ferr ... o/4322508/
Ferrari made the "wrong decision" picking Mattia Binotto to replace Maurizio Arrivabene as its Formula 1 team principal, says former technical director Gary Anderson.
Anderson said: "I don't really see why you would take your best technical person…and put him in a management, political position which is not his forte. Why would you do that?"

Binotto is someone who has been very good at being a technical manager. You've got to allow him to be a technical manager.
"That is a full-time job, seven days a week. It's not a part-time thing. That is going to dilute their technical effort for sure.
it will not matter if Ferrari's team works better, if Binotto's move means the car is slower."

"Anderson also warned that could ultimately cost itself a prize technical asset with its policy of kicking underperforming team bosses out.
He said: "What happens at the end of 2019 if Red Bull steps between them and suddenly Ferrari are third or fourth in the championship?
It could happen. [Then] his head's gonna roll.

"They might lose a very good asset because they put him in a position he shouldn't be in."
reasonable words from a reasonable man.

Gonna be some explainin' to do if Raikkonen beats Vettel in a Sauber.

Personally, i think Gary is right on it. I expect nothing short of all-out war from the side of RedBull with their Honda powerplant. They have put all their eggs in the Verstappen-basket,
and the 2019 contender. RB was surpremely strong even last season especially at the end, if the Honda engine is up for it, they're gonna be the team to take the challenge to Mercedes.

Mercedes is stable af, Hamilton is strong af, nothing's changed there. nothing changed at Mercedes at all.
RedBull has been aiming for this for a while, Verstappen is getting stronger and stronger, the team is fast, Newey is all-out on the '19 contender, AND the team is stable AF.

Ferrari on the other hand, has Vettel whom has been spiraling downwards, has lost super-experienced last ferrari-champion Kimi and replaced it with arguably a rookie, Leclerc,
who will be thrown 'into the deep'. in a team, that is still in the aftermath of the sudden death of Sergio Marchionne, in an environment where EVERYTHING is changing lately,
and i repeat, a team, where for 3 or 4 years Arrivabene was 'the man' and obviously people bonded, and now last season there was a 'camp' and 'war' and 'power struggle' between
-let's be honest here a FRIGGIN TECH GUY- and now Ferrari has put THAT MAN in charge, because he threatened to leave, and leave the team with that man.
which man took who's side last year and how will that influence the team morale?

funny how it's claimed by a sky pundit that there's a blame environment at Ferrari and that Arrivabene was to blame, whilst Arrivabene has dumped NOBODY.
Not even after the painful issues of power problems in 2017 where cars couldn't even start at the grid were people punished. I think everybody expected hefty things to happen
after that, but no. and who was in charge? not binotto, Arrivabene, and Marchionne, etc.

Now, everybody may worry about what's gonna happen under the 'new reign', imagine what will happen, like gary says, if they are at best 3rd in the standings, and in worst-case scenario get even beaten by Renault?

Like gary says, this is handled bad and has all the elements in place for failure.

I don't think Vettel is going to even want to stay in an environment that - to me - sounds as hostile and critical as it is seemingly is turning out to become right now, if performance is going to lack.
this was a post i can support to 99%
the Leclerc thing, not sure what to think about that, he did a damn good job at Sauber, bt can he preform that well at Ferrari.
I think this we will know after 3-4 races

GrandAxe
6
Joined: Thu Aug 01, 2013 4:06 pm

Re: 2019 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

Post by GrandAxe » Sat Jan 12, 2019 4:44 pm

Capharol wrote:
Fri Jan 11, 2019 12:39 pm
Manoah2u wrote:
Fri Jan 11, 2019 2:13 am
brundle talking always seems like a kicking a ball into an open goal less then 1 feet in front of the line.
it's never insightful, it's never new or refreshing, just the exact same you can read in any article, by any person.
atleast he's not an annoying tool like eddie jordan and co. still, it'd be nice to see some refreshing insight instead of
the same same-old, same-old.

#endofrant

that said, i really do wonder about binotto though.

Since Arrivabene arrived, Ferrari has turned into a much better position. It seemed the team did rather well with him.
Also, all the accusations that Arrivabene supposedly didn't handle things well is first of all really low and easy to do.
They all seem to forget that like said before, he DID get Ferrari into a great position, and i would like to remind everybody that
the atmosphere at Ferrari turned into a much more positive environment, and even more, i'd like to remind people about the
FACT that despite VETTEL having made seriously bad actions, like straight driving into Hamilton in Baku, and his badmouting
charlie whiting, MANY, MANY clumsy, foolish, unneccesary moves this year wich saw him spinning MANY times,
which was ACTUALLY what cost him, and thus Ferrari, the title, went totally 'forgiven'.

If any, Vettel should have been dumped.

ON TOP of that, the only actual internal 'struggles' or 'warfare' was with the arrival of the EGO of Binotto, which he has plenty.
Binotto is a really over-the top ego, where Arrivabene has been nothing but a calm, respectable, and honest man, despite being
Italian, 'known' for being 'feisty' by nature. The turmoil came from BINOTTO, not Arrivabene, and the moment poor Marchionne
passed, he immediately stepped up his game, and being befriended with the right people, Arrivabene got stabbed in the back.

So I for one, am completely NOT positive about Binotto's appointment as leader.
Quite frankly, i can see a huge spat coming up between Vettel and Binotto, and I can also see Ferrari personel getting fed up fast.

It's fun and game people mentioning a 'blame culture', but the truth is, that was exactly which did NOT happen with Arrivabene.
Mauricio was actually the guy that TOOK blame.

Ferrari coming season is going to be a mess, guaranteed, and i predict an absolute EXODUS of important Ferrari staff,
which will go straight towards either Mclaren or Renault, or perhaps Sauber first. Maybe even HAAS will be smart and take them aboard.
sorry to say but the way you talk about Vettel ain't quiet nice, I myself ain't no fan of Vettel but you can't put it all on Vettel, Ferrari made some bad calls during races, didn't use Raikkönnen when they had to as a buffer to Hamilton, stratigically they have made some bad calls aswell.

Yes Vettel made some mistakes, but it wasn't all his fault.

about the fight between Arrivibene and Binotto I can't say that much but it sounds to me as if you where there in person (which i doubt highly)
Arrivibene is/was a stubborn man, didn't open up to the press much and of what i have seen kept mostly for himself .... but this is just my personal view and opinion as a F1 fan

Why should the truth be nice? Also, why should external/peripheral stuff like Arrivibene's relationship with the press be used to judge his management of the Ferrari team?

Several of Kimi's races in the first 70% of the season were sacrificed to help Vettel. It was only at the tail end that Kimi was freed from that role - perhaps to maximise Ferrari's chances with the constructors. No need killing a perfectly capable drivers race by relegating him to the role of wingman if the lead driver has a high chance of chucking it all in the trash.

I'd thought Ferrari would build for the future by pairing Kimi (as an unflappable older hand with bags of experience) with Leclerc - a young steed raring to go, with bags of speed, but near zero experience.

LM10
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Joined: Tue Mar 06, 2018 11:07 pm

Re: 2019 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

Post by LM10 » Sat Jan 12, 2019 8:13 pm

GrandAxe wrote:
Sat Jan 12, 2019 4:44 pm
Capharol wrote:
Fri Jan 11, 2019 12:39 pm
Manoah2u wrote:
Fri Jan 11, 2019 2:13 am
brundle talking always seems like a kicking a ball into an open goal less then 1 feet in front of the line.
it's never insightful, it's never new or refreshing, just the exact same you can read in any article, by any person.
atleast he's not an annoying tool like eddie jordan and co. still, it'd be nice to see some refreshing insight instead of
the same same-old, same-old.

#endofrant

that said, i really do wonder about binotto though.

Since Arrivabene arrived, Ferrari has turned into a much better position. It seemed the team did rather well with him.
Also, all the accusations that Arrivabene supposedly didn't handle things well is first of all really low and easy to do.
They all seem to forget that like said before, he DID get Ferrari into a great position, and i would like to remind everybody that
the atmosphere at Ferrari turned into a much more positive environment, and even more, i'd like to remind people about the
FACT that despite VETTEL having made seriously bad actions, like straight driving into Hamilton in Baku, and his badmouting
charlie whiting, MANY, MANY clumsy, foolish, unneccesary moves this year wich saw him spinning MANY times,
which was ACTUALLY what cost him, and thus Ferrari, the title, went totally 'forgiven'.

If any, Vettel should have been dumped.

ON TOP of that, the only actual internal 'struggles' or 'warfare' was with the arrival of the EGO of Binotto, which he has plenty.
Binotto is a really over-the top ego, where Arrivabene has been nothing but a calm, respectable, and honest man, despite being
Italian, 'known' for being 'feisty' by nature. The turmoil came from BINOTTO, not Arrivabene, and the moment poor Marchionne
passed, he immediately stepped up his game, and being befriended with the right people, Arrivabene got stabbed in the back.

So I for one, am completely NOT positive about Binotto's appointment as leader.
Quite frankly, i can see a huge spat coming up between Vettel and Binotto, and I can also see Ferrari personel getting fed up fast.

It's fun and game people mentioning a 'blame culture', but the truth is, that was exactly which did NOT happen with Arrivabene.
Mauricio was actually the guy that TOOK blame.

Ferrari coming season is going to be a mess, guaranteed, and i predict an absolute EXODUS of important Ferrari staff,
which will go straight towards either Mclaren or Renault, or perhaps Sauber first. Maybe even HAAS will be smart and take them aboard.
sorry to say but the way you talk about Vettel ain't quiet nice, I myself ain't no fan of Vettel but you can't put it all on Vettel, Ferrari made some bad calls during races, didn't use Raikkönnen when they had to as a buffer to Hamilton, stratigically they have made some bad calls aswell.

Yes Vettel made some mistakes, but it wasn't all his fault.

about the fight between Arrivibene and Binotto I can't say that much but it sounds to me as if you where there in person (which i doubt highly)
Arrivibene is/was a stubborn man, didn't open up to the press much and of what i have seen kept mostly for himself .... but this is just my personal view and opinion as a F1 fan

Why should the truth be nice? Also, why should external/peripheral stuff like Arrivibene's relationship with the press be used to judge his management of the Ferrari team?

Several of Kimi's races in the first 70% of the season were sacrificed to help Vettel. It was only at the tail end that Kimi was freed from that role - perhaps to maximise Ferrari's chances with the constructors. No need killing a perfectly capable drivers race by relegating him to the role of wingman if the lead driver has a high chance of chucking it all in the trash.

I'd thought Ferrari would build for the future by pairing Kimi (as an unflappable older hand with bags of experience) with Leclerc - a young steed raring to go, with bags of speed, but near zero experience.
Well, it doesn’t help that Ferrari tried to use Kimi as a wingman when he wasn’t even capable of getting himself in a position to be a wingman. This is what actually was the case in many races in the first half of the season because he failed in Qualifying or race starts.

As for the part with Kimi being Leclerc’s teammate - no one in their right mind would have done that.

Manoah2u
335
Joined: Sun Feb 24, 2013 1:07 pm

Re: 2019 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

Post by Manoah2u » Sun Jan 13, 2019 2:17 am

I think Vettel-LeClerc isn't a bad combo to be honest. matter of fact, i think it's very interesting and very potential.

The problem, as mentioned above, is that things have changed, and the situation that that combo has now found itself into is very sensitive, fragile, and potentially harmful for both drivers, and the team. It would have been absolutely fine if Sergio Marchionne had not passed away, and as such, surely would have been able to manage things much better in regards to the escalations between Binotto and Arrivabene, i'm pretty sure that Arrivabene would still be at the helm, Binotto at the same position, but that things would heve been steered into a much more fruitful manner. It surely would not have turned into what atleast seems to be, and smells to be, a lion's den right now.

I think Kimi has found himself in the best position right now, trouble-free @ Sauber.

In this situation, Vettel can't even be used to be a 'mentor' or 'example' for Leclerc, as he's guaranteed to be in a situation that he has to prove his own worth. Again, not just because Arrivabene is gone and binotto is on the helm, but the mothership maranello base has a whole new leadership, putting much more pressure on the 4-time world champion.
And now, instead of entering a stable Ferrari, LeClerc now is in a situation where it's all down to only himself and he can't make no mistake.

Remember, it was all thanks to Marchionne, and Arrivabene added to that too, that LeClerc has gotten into the Ferrari seat. That has been mentioned by Ferrari themselves after Marchionne's passing that they'd atleast 'respect' that decision.
Reading that a bit different; the management NOW in place did NOT effectively make that decision, and it could very easily be that that same management isn't too supportive of that lineup. Especially with the change undergoing right now, LeClerc has without a single doubt, a huge load more of pressure on him, than he would have had if Marchionne was still alive, and nothing would have changed as hefty as it has now.

Which is exactly what makes me rather negative about all that has happened recently.
Ferrari did absolutely GREAT the last 2 seasons, they have made huge steps forward in regards to the power plant and car itself.
2017 saw far worse setbacks for the title challenge compared to 2018, so there was a lot more improvement.
It's too bad for them that 2018 saw them failing short especially after the second half of the season,
but in no way did that demand to have everything smacked to bits and turn everything around again.

I would love to see Ferrari challenge again, i think it would be great to see Vettel cling his 5th title and be neck-on-neck with Hamilton,
but i'm doubtfull that'll happen now.

Additionally, apart from the disrespect that Arrivabene gets right now, it's going to be worse IF Ferrari performs great despite the odds in 2019;
Binotto will be given all hail, will without a SINGLE DOUBT take all the glory and praise to himself, gloat and stroke his huge ego,
and not a single dime of respect or appreciation will be given to Arrivabene, totally forgetting that Arrivabene is the one that laid the foundations to
in which shape Ferrari is in right now, INCLUDING how Binotto has been able to operate. I think it's backstabbing behaviour, but well, i've said enough about that.
Dumpster sounds so much more classy. It's the diamond of the cesspools.

NathanOlder
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Location: Kent

Re: 2019 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

Post by NathanOlder » Sun Jan 13, 2019 10:54 am

LM10 wrote:
Sat Jan 12, 2019 8:13 pm

As for the part with Kimi being Leclerc’s teammate - no one in their right mind would have done that.
Very true, but I think the Vettel Leclerc partnership won't be a good move unless Leclerc blows Vettel away.


I see 1 of 3 things happening.

1. Vettel is way quicker than Leclerc, So like when Kimi was way off the pace he will be no use to Ferrari as a tactical piece.

2. They are similarly matched. So like the last few racesof 2018, The Ferrari drivers take points off each other and don't get a decent run at the WDC. And as the nature of the team mate battle gets heated, they end up harming each others races like Mclarenin 07.

3. Leclerc is better and faster, I just cannot see Vettel supporting Charles to win a title. Vettel would rather neither win the WDC. Leclerc will need help to take on a supported Lewis or a supported Max.

So in some ways, Kimi and Leclerc could be just as effective or ineffective as Vet/Lec.
GoLandoGo
Lewis v2.0

timbo
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Joined: Mon Oct 22, 2007 9:14 am

Re: 2019 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

Post by timbo » Sun Jan 13, 2019 11:17 am


Capharol
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Re: 2019 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

Post by Capharol » Sun Jan 13, 2019 1:08 pm

the Vettel-Leclerc team will be, in my opinion, the strongest driver pair 2019.
as it was with Ricciardo-Verstappen in the last few years, but the Gasly-Verstappen pairing won't be as strong as the Ferrari-Team.
Hamitlon-Bottas was always a pairing to give Hamilton the position he needs to be WC, Bottas is just to sweet

Big Tea
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Re: 2019 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

Post by Big Tea » Sun Jan 13, 2019 4:12 pm

I see the Vettel Leclerc 'partnership' getting very political very early into the season. And not just driver/driver political
One test is worth a thousand expert opinions

LM10
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Re: 2019 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

Post by LM10 » Sun Jan 13, 2019 5:01 pm

Manoah2u wrote:
Sat Jan 12, 2019 2:02 am
https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/ferr ... o/4322508/
Ferrari made the "wrong decision" picking Mattia Binotto to replace Maurizio Arrivabene as its Formula 1 team principal, says former technical director Gary Anderson.
Anderson said: "I don't really see why you would take your best technical person…and put him in a management, political position which is not his forte. Why would you do that?"

Binotto is someone who has been very good at being a technical manager. You've got to allow him to be a technical manager.
"That is a full-time job, seven days a week. It's not a part-time thing. That is going to dilute their technical effort for sure.
it will not matter if Ferrari's team works better, if Binotto's move means the car is slower."

"Anderson also warned that could ultimately cost itself a prize technical asset with its policy of kicking underperforming team bosses out.
He said: "What happens at the end of 2019 if Red Bull steps between them and suddenly Ferrari are third or fourth in the championship?
It could happen. [Then] his head's gonna roll.

"They might lose a very good asset because they put him in a position he shouldn't be in."
reasonable words from a reasonable man.
You mean the reasonable man who claimed after 2018 winter testings that Haas was 0.4 seconds in front of Ferrari and Williams just 0.1 second behind? :lol:

And now he tells that Ferrari might even fall back to 4th place in 2019 when there was a minimum 1 second gap between 3rd and 4th fastest car last season. #-o

marmer
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Joined: Fri Apr 21, 2017 5:48 am

Re: 2019 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

Post by marmer » Mon Jan 14, 2019 6:55 am

really wish people would stop asking gary anderson he hasn't worked for an f1 team since jordan if he had any talent he would have been kept around somwhere. he made a couple of decent jordans along with a great deal of bad ones

Capharol
4
Joined: Sun Nov 04, 2018 4:06 pm

Re: 2019 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

Post by Capharol » Mon Jan 14, 2019 11:37 am

LM10 wrote:
Sun Jan 13, 2019 5:01 pm


You mean the reasonable man who claimed after 2018 winter testings that Haas was 0.4 seconds in front of Ferrari and Williams just 0.1 second behind? :lol:

And now he tells that Ferrari might even fall back to 4th place in 2019 when there was a minimum 1 second gap between 3rd and 4th fastest car last season. #-o
well with the new regulations, it could happen at the start of the season, but i think Ferrari will get back, should they really made a mistake on the wings and bargeboards

Manoah2u
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Joined: Sun Feb 24, 2013 1:07 pm

Re: 2019 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

Post by Manoah2u » Mon Jan 14, 2019 1:23 pm

marmer wrote:
Mon Jan 14, 2019 6:55 am
really wish people would stop asking gary anderson he hasn't worked for an f1 team since jordan if he had any talent he would have been kept around somwhere. he made a couple of decent jordans along with a great deal of bad ones
maybe then they should also stop asking brundle, herbert, coulthard, and above all 90% of all f1 pundits and 'insiders'.
funny how what's being said by gary is swept aside just because of some mediocre cars in the past.
Dumpster sounds so much more classy. It's the diamond of the cesspools.

marmer
25
Joined: Fri Apr 21, 2017 5:48 am

Re: 2019 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

Post by marmer » Mon Jan 14, 2019 2:00 pm

Manoah2u wrote:
Mon Jan 14, 2019 1:23 pm
marmer wrote:
Mon Jan 14, 2019 6:55 am
really wish people would stop asking gary anderson he hasn't worked for an f1 team since jordan if he had any talent he would have been kept around somwhere. he made a couple of decent jordans along with a great deal of bad ones
maybe then they should also stop asking brundle, herbert, coulthard, and above all 90% of all f1 pundits and 'insiders'.
funny how what's being said by gary is swept aside just because of some mediocre cars in the past.
I don't mind the X drivers or engineers being asked but certain knowledge in F1 expires.

In drivers the way cars work changes as do the tracks so I take whatever brundle says with far less importance than someone like Paul Di Resta similar level of driver but one is far more up-to-date on the car and current tracks.

Although I do admit that perhaps with technical knowledge it's alittle harder as unlike drivers they don't retire before they are 40 and the money is better than doing media work.

But that means your only going to get the unwanted doing media stuff it's not that they want to do the media they don't have another role in F1 to go to.

richardn
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Re: 2019 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

Post by richardn » Mon Jan 14, 2019 2:17 pm

Nobody seems to have linked to Mark Hughes opposing viewpoint to Gary Anderson. What isn't clear is if Mark is extrapolating Arrivebene's internal relationships from the relationship with the press, or whether he has Ferrari sources that back up his position.

https://www.motorsportmagazine.com/opin ... ds-ferrari