2017 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team - Ferrari

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mika vs michael
mika vs michael
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Joined: Sat Jan 27, 2007 12:35 am

Re: 2017 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team - Ferrari

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The problem after Ross Brawn departure from Ferrari is that the old Ferrari would have capitalised from the cooperation with Haas. Haas had the privilege to run full time and not be restricted by regulations since it was not officially in F1 before 2016. Ferrari needs a man like Brawn to put the pieces of the puzzle together. Ferrari indeed looks like the Berger-Alesi years. Completely lost in translation. Unfortunately they are too stubborn to understand that they need more people from outside italy in order to compete against MErcedes and Redbull. Or maybe they don't have the cash anymore to build and organisation on the same level like Mercedes.
"It is necessary to relax your muscles when you can. Relaxing your brain is fatal." Stirling Moss

I tried this and I had understeer, I tried that and I had oversteer, at the end of the corner I just run out of talent

Manoah2u
Manoah2u
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Re: 2017 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team - Ferrari

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Fer.Fan wrote:http://en.f1i.com/news/83795-erasing-ga ... rrari.html

Ferrari admitting problems with aero and chassis. Let`s hope they can improve for 2017.
lol, with that comment, 2017 is already lost.
If any people doubted Alonso's move to leave Ferrari?

Imagine if he'd still be there.

I'll just throw a Enzo Ferrari quote up in the air
Aerodynamics are for people who can't build engines.
Dumpster sounds so much more classy. It's the diamond of the cesspools.

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Big Mangalhit
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Re: 2017 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team - Ferrari

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Manoah2u wrote:
Fer.Fan wrote:http://en.f1i.com/news/83795-erasing-ga ... rrari.html

Ferrari admitting problems with aero and chassis. Let`s hope they can improve for 2017.
lol, with that comment, 2017 is already lost.
If any people doubted Alonso's move to leave Ferrari?

Imagine if he'd still be there.

I'll just throw a Enzo Ferrari quote up in the air
Aerodynamics are for people who can't build engines.
Maybe if alonso stayed 2 more year in Ferrari now he could be free for Merc I dunno? Anyway I still don't see how he is any better on McLaren sweating to get to q3 and points. And please don't answer with the usual he wanted a WDC so anything less than that is the same, cause I pretty sure driving a "GP2" engine is not as enjoyable nor there is any thing that points for McLaren to be a top contender for 2017, albeit neither does Ferrari.

As for that quote (Ferrari admitting problems with aero and chassis. Let`s hope they can improve for 2017), it just says that ferrari knows where the problem lies so I don't see it's a bad thing. What I think is a terrible thing is james allison fleeing the (sinking?) ship, indeed that doesn't look good before rule changes. But that quote itself is too generic, I bet you can find a similar one in McLaren or Williams or Renault

Manoah2u
Manoah2u
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Re: 2017 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team - Ferrari

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Staying with Ferrari would have terminated his career prospects and only would have made people look at him with a view that he is a sad being who cannot leave Ferrari and doesn't do anything about his future. Instead, he decided that he needs to do something and took an opportunity with Mclaren instead.

This actually did good for his career as people now can see clearly Ferrari is the cause of the struggle as they are in the same situation with Vettel right now. Whilst Vettel is getting frustrated,
Alonso is all smiles.
Dumpster sounds so much more classy. It's the diamond of the cesspools.

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GPR-A duplicate2
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Re: 2017 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team - Ferrari

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Big Mangalhit wrote:And please don't answer with the usual he wanted a WDC so anything less than that is the same,
You like to hear it or not, that is a FACT. He grew tired of coming second every year and dragging a car and a team that were uncompetitive. He gave his best fives years of his life to Ferrari.
Big Mangalhit wrote:What I think is a terrible thing is james allison fleeing the (sinking?) ship, indeed that doesn't look good before rule changes.
This is what Ferrari fans do. It seems like one cannot have life outside at all, if they ever work for Ferrari. You can't leave them, it's cheating, back stabbing, grossly unfair. Lauda, Prost, Alonso and now Allison. The kind of send off that Ferrari gave to Alonso shows a substandard and mediocre organizational behavior. Their management coming out and saying, they in fact laid off Alonso as they had hit a deal with Vettel. And fans saying, Alonso misled them in development and that is why they couldn't make competitive cars. What's happening now?

Why is it so hard to admit that the atmosphere at Maranello doesn't allow anyone to do their job. Can't they fix that first? Why can't they have good succession planning? With all their budgets and might, why can't they have foresight into their working procedure? Everything is shocking, new and unforeseen for them. People are getting ready with excuses for 2017 that, "Oh, Ferrari failed because Allison left".

f1316
f1316
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Re: 2017 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team - Ferrari

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Dear God, will it ever end?! You don't like Ferrari - we get it!

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Gerhardsa
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Location: Canada 'eh!

Re: 2017 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team - Ferrari

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f1316 wrote:Dear God, will it ever end?! You don't like Ferrari - we get it!
Think you are missing the point.
The posts doesn't say anywhere, I think Ferrari is s!@#t, I don't like them bla bla bla. (maybe he doesn't, but the posts I read doesn't say that directly)

We all in some way have a connection, respect and liking towards Ferrari.
Its more it think out of frustration, that people post the "ah, here we go again. I don't expect much from them" posts.

The thing that makes people (and me as well) so mad about the modern day Scuderia is that they seem not to be able to stop hitting their heads like donkeys against the same tree, or learn from mistakes, on and off the track.

Not much has changed at Ferrari in the last 2-3 years, and 10 years since the dream team left the pitwall. Since then its all been this "only Italian culture and values" thing . The last couple of years, they are just "moving furniture around on the Titanic" by making hits guy from Marking the F1 Team principle, promoting that guy from aero to Chief Aero, moving this one to that role etc. The ship is still sinking.

They really do need better,fresh blood, new ideas, out the box thinking to get back in that tech department. The same with the team management culture.

Me, I would have made Flav Briatore Team principle 2 years ago and told him to do everything and anything he thinks will get the team back on track. But Ferrari being Ferrari.....

Explain insanity:---- "Doing the same thing over and over again, expecting different results."

And I love this team, but they suck ass

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GPR-A duplicate2
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Re: 2017 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team - Ferrari

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Gerhardsa wrote:
f1316 wrote:Dear God, will it ever end?! You don't like Ferrari - we get it!
Think you are missing the point.
The posts doesn't say anywhere, I think Ferrari is s!@#t, I don't like them bla bla bla. (maybe he doesn't, but the posts I read doesn't say that directly)

We all in some way have a connection, respect and liking towards Ferrari.
Its more it think out of frustration, that people post the "ah, here we go again. I don't expect much from them" posts.

The thing that makes people (and me as well) so mad about the modern day Scuderia is that they seem not to be able to stop hitting their heads like donkeys against the same tree, or learn from mistakes, on and off the track.

Not much has changed at Ferrari in the last 2-3 years, and 10 years since the dream team left the pitwall. Since then its all been this "only Italian culture and values" thing . The last couple of years, they are just "moving furniture around on the Titanic" by making hits guy from Marking the F1 Team principle, promoting that guy from aero to Chief Aero, moving this one to that role etc. The ship is still sinking.

They really do need better,fresh blood, new ideas, out the box thinking to get back in that tech department. The same with the team management culture.

Me, I would have made Flav Briatore Team principle 2 years ago and told him to do everything and anything he thinks will get the team back on track. But Ferrari being Ferrari.....

Explain insanity:---- "Doing the same thing over and over again, expecting different results."

And I love this team, but they suck ass
The problem of putting posts in Ferrari team thread is, YOU ARE EITHER WITH FERRARI OR AGAINST IT! No matter how one puts it, whether in eloquent way or in a brute way, the reality is that there are problems with Ferrari that hasn't gone away in the last decade.

Explain insanity:---- "Doing the same thing over and over again, expecting different results."

This is the truth and my posts are no different. Being a Ferrari supporter doesn't mean that their mediocrity is way of life and we continue cheering them.

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Vasconia
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Location: Basque Country

Re: 2017 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team - Ferrari

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Fer.Fan wrote:http://en.f1i.com/news/83795-erasing-ga ... rrari.html

Ferrari admitting problems with aero and chassis. Let`s hope they can improve for 2017.
On the other hand I read that the recent changes brought some improvements which already began in the last races of 2016´s season. At least its true that the car looked better in the last races.

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Vasconia
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Re: 2017 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team - Ferrari

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can wrote:The recent Ferrari situation is a shame.

I cant even remotely imagine, that they could surprise us (in a positive way).
To be fair I was pleasantly surprised with Ferrari´s improvement and peformance in 2015.

Manoah2u
Manoah2u
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Re: 2017 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team - Ferrari

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Vasconia wrote:
Fer.Fan wrote:http://en.f1i.com/news/83795-erasing-ga ... rrari.html

Ferrari admitting problems with aero and chassis. Let`s hope they can improve for 2017.
On the other hand I read that the recent changes brought some improvements which already began in the last races of 2016´s season. At least its true that the car looked better in the last races.
sorry to disagree there.
Ferrari was in magnificient shape at the start of the season, really. Not as good as 2015, but still respectable.
The speed was there, and both Vettel and Raikkonen were 'in form'. The only thing that was NOT in form, and has NOT
been in form ALL YEAR, is Ferrari's pit wall decisions and pit crew. They managed to scr*w the great performance the car and drivers put in into worthless results due to pure and undeniable and painfully visible incompetence. And it lasted, boy did it last throughout the year, bar some occasoinal 'less mismanagement' in some races.
It took it's toll on Seb, clearly, who got frustrated and vocal about it all.

The only reason Ferrari seemed 'better' in the 'end' was not because the car worked better - it was because they scr*wed their races less into mud and dirt.

Also, if THEORETICALLY it was true that 'improvements' occured in the end of 2016 performance wise, then that's actually bad news - it means that in stead of focusing fully on 2017, they kept hammering in on this year - probably because they 'demanded' good results no matter what....typical italian. and yes, i have worked 10 years in an intalian company, and had to deal with dozens of italian businesses, which all are exactly the same. emotional.
it ALSO means, that they were so stubborn on keeping on that path and 'making it work' that they did everything for squad zero because next year the cars are completely different. So way to go, you've managed to make the 'package' work after 20 races. back to square one.

that is the problem of Ferrari.

And people tend to forget; it was NOT Schumacher that fixed ferrari. it was the combination of the right people, and one can't deny that the Schumacher - Brawn formula worked like a charm. Vettel isn't Schumacher, and there is no other Brawn.
they're trying to repeat history without even knowing what made it work, because they aren't open to anything but their own 'heritage' and 'national heroism'. 'We're Ferrari......." and that's the issue.

Don't get me wrong, I love Ferrari but i hate to see what's happening right now, including the brand itself. I also think Marchionne is not the core problem, but he's been 'assigned' to be the solution, and quite frankly, he's definately not 'the solution'. Luca di Montezemolo did much better. Marchionne does not share the same passion, drive, focus or 'fire'. He is more like a former pizzeria-owner-turned-banker type of guy. well, that's how i feel about it.

I personally dont have the solution, or i would be there and getting rich and in automotive paradise as we speak. I do see however that they let emotion run control. and stupidity.

also;

Image

had to leave this here.
Dumpster sounds so much more classy. It's the diamond of the cesspools.

f1316
f1316
135
Joined: Wed Feb 22, 2012 5:36 pm

Re: 2017 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team - Ferrari

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GPR-A wrote:
Gerhardsa wrote:
f1316 wrote:Dear God, will it ever end?! You don't like Ferrari - we get it!
Think you are missing the point.
The posts doesn't say anywhere, I think Ferrari is s!@#t, I don't like them bla bla bla. (maybe he doesn't, but the posts I read doesn't say that directly)

We all in some way have a connection, respect and liking towards Ferrari.
Its more it think out of frustration, that people post the "ah, here we go again. I don't expect much from them" posts.

The thing that makes people (and me as well) so mad about the modern day Scuderia is that they seem not to be able to stop hitting their heads like donkeys against the same tree, or learn from mistakes, on and off the track.

Not much has changed at Ferrari in the last 2-3 years, and 10 years since the dream team left the pitwall. Since then its all been this "only Italian culture and values" thing . The last couple of years, they are just "moving furniture around on the Titanic" by making hits guy from Marking the F1 Team principle, promoting that guy from aero to Chief Aero, moving this one to that role etc. The ship is still sinking.

They really do need better,fresh blood, new ideas, out the box thinking to get back in that tech department. The same with the team management culture.

Me, I would have made Flav Briatore Team principle 2 years ago and told him to do everything and anything he thinks will get the team back on track. But Ferrari being Ferrari.....

Explain insanity:---- "Doing the same thing over and over again, expecting different results."

And I love this team, but they suck ass
The problem of putting posts in Ferrari team thread is, YOU ARE EITHER WITH FERRARI OR AGAINST IT! No matter how one puts it, whether in eloquent way or in a brute way, the reality is that there are problems with Ferrari that hasn't gone away in the last decade.

Explain insanity:---- "Doing the same thing over and over again, expecting different results."

This is the truth and my posts are no different. Being a Ferrari supporter doesn't mean that their mediocrity is way of life and we continue cheering them.
Not at all true. I'm the first to bemoan the mistakes they make and their lack of ability to capitalise on situations from which they should have derived advantage (increased emphasis on engine performance, relationship with Haas etc.).

The difference is when you fundamentally *hate* a team and want to see them do badly - it's like having a Madrid fan in a Barcelona thread, it's impossible to have a constructive conversation and pretty frustrating.

mika vs michael
mika vs michael
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Joined: Sat Jan 27, 2007 12:35 am

Re: 2017 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team - Ferrari

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Shouldn't be Ferrari going after Paddy Lowe instead of Williams?
"It is necessary to relax your muscles when you can. Relaxing your brain is fatal." Stirling Moss

I tried this and I had understeer, I tried that and I had oversteer, at the end of the corner I just run out of talent

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SR71
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Re: 2017 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team - Ferrari

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mika vs michael wrote:Shouldn't be Ferrari going after Paddy Lowe instead of Williams?

Ferrari have made their own bed. They blew their deal with newey because they couldn't keep their mouth closed.

Sure Alison had tragedy but something tells me he was on his way out anyway.

Cannot see a reason any top technical talent would goto Ferrari to work for the cigarette guy who crys on camera or marichonne - the one guy who should care (stock price) but doesn't.

Until the top is purged and the strings between race team and parent cut expect Ferrari to flounder and flail in their own failure for years.

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diffuser
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Joined: Fri Sep 07, 2012 12:55 pm
Location: Montreal

Re: 2017 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team - Ferrari

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There is a lot of pressure at Maranello but that isn 't why they don't succeed.

That is cause they're people aren't as good as the people else were. They were close to having the right people at the beginning of the year but what happened to James was out of their control. Obviously they lost a step with the James thing.

Do they have the right people in place NOW ? I don't know ..I don't think so. We will find out next year. What I do know is it is absolutely the worst time to be going through change in technical leadership. Just based on that, you got to think they're behind the 8 ball.