2017 Force India F1 Team - Mercedes

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IamLegend
IamLegend
3
Joined: 02 Dec 2015, 17:42

Re: 2017 Force India F1 Team - Mercedes

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marmer wrote:
12 Jun 2017, 13:16
Bigger and better drivers have moved out of the way for a teammate. He showed the same ego and McLaren and that got him dropped. I suspect he worried about ocons pace showing him up and costing him a top driver but driving like he did looks worse to a Ferrari or Mercedes. While a charm and collected ocon still comes out looking good as he dealt with the situation well. Perez might miss the boat on a top drive like Roman stays too long at a midfield teams trying too hard to look good all the time

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Ocon is the future out with this nut bag Sergio. I can only hope we can get Kubica to replace Checo that way we can expect some concessions from Mercedes, pipedream but I only wish it's possible.

marmer
marmer
1
Joined: 21 Apr 2017, 06:48

Re: 2017 Force India F1 Team - Mercedes

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IamLegend wrote:
13 Jun 2017, 16:28
marmer wrote:
12 Jun 2017, 13:16
Bigger and better drivers have moved out of the way for a teammate. He showed the same ego and McLaren and that got him dropped. I suspect he worried about ocons pace showing him up and costing him a top driver but driving like he did looks worse to a Ferrari or Mercedes. While a charm and collected ocon still comes out looking good as he dealt with the situation well. Perez might miss the boat on a top drive like Roman stays too long at a midfield teams trying too hard to look good all the time

Sent from my HUAWEI VNS-L31 using Tapatalk
Ocon is the future out with this nut bag Sergio. I can only hope we can get Kubica to replace Checo that way we can expect some concessions from Mercedes, pipedream but I only wish it's possible.
perez seems to have an attitude problem this season at the start he was pulling an Alonso "i am driving the wheels off the car." now ocon is matching him suddenly he seems quite stressed, maybe he felt he had Hulk in the bag and he thought Ocon would be easy to dominate. combined with the end of this season there being a big seat ready for someone having missed out on the merc drive last year when he actually out scored Bottas

Raleigh
Raleigh
29
Joined: 29 Jul 2014, 15:36

Re: 2017 Force India F1 Team - Mercedes

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I don't think there is any chance Perez will get the Mercedes seat, Bottas has shown he can win races and is willing to play the team game which is exactly what Mercedes wants and needs.

Same deal with Ferrari, they have no patience for a driver who puts himself above the team. Red Bull isn't going to pick Checo over their own drivers even if Danial or Max leaves. McLaren might have a seat if Alonso leaves, but Alonso is only going to leave if McLaren don't have a competitive engine for 2018.

Perez potentially could be a champion one day, but there is no clear path forward for him and this behavior is closing doors rather than opening them.

IamLegend
IamLegend
3
Joined: 02 Dec 2015, 17:42

Re: 2017 Force India F1 Team - Mercedes

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marmer wrote:
13 Jun 2017, 17:24
IamLegend wrote:
13 Jun 2017, 16:28
marmer wrote:
12 Jun 2017, 13:16
Bigger and better drivers have moved out of the way for a teammate. He showed the same ego and McLaren and that got him dropped. I suspect he worried about ocons pace showing him up and costing him a top driver but driving like he did looks worse to a Ferrari or Mercedes. While a charm and collected ocon still comes out looking good as he dealt with the situation well. Perez might miss the boat on a top drive like Roman stays too long at a midfield teams trying too hard to look good all the time

Sent from my HUAWEI VNS-L31 using Tapatalk
Ocon is the future out with this nut bag Sergio. I can only hope we can get Kubica to replace Checo that way we can expect some concessions from Mercedes, pipedream but I only wish it's possible.
perez seems to have an attitude problem this season at the start he was pulling an Alonso "i am driving the wheels off the car." now ocon is matching him suddenly he seems quite stressed, maybe he felt he had Hulk in the bag and he thought Ocon would be easy to dominate. combined with the end of this season there being a big seat ready for someone having missed out on the merc drive last year when he actually out scored Bottas
Spot on! This ass-hat is making me mad now even more after reading this, he was radioed 5 times to move over:
https://www.jamesallenonf1.com/2017/06/ ... you-think/

But on the other hand SFi should have called Sergio into the pits, that way it could have led to this scenario, oh well another lesson learnt. Hindsight is 20/20 they say.

drriapg
drriapg
0
Joined: 13 Jun 2017, 22:46

Re: 2017 Force India F1 Team - Mercedes

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Congratulations IamLegend, your non sense comments finally motivated me to register so I can comment.
What you are stating is childish and immature, It almost makes me think you must be ignorant and racist. Because there is no other way to explain it.
Force India can thank Checo for all the good drives, podiums, points and development that along with the team have been achieved.
Perez has real racer's blood in his veins and that's why he behaves this way, I can only picture you cheering for Max Verstapen if it would have been him not letting the team mate pass.
Bob Freely has stated that there were no ORDERS given, so no orders were ignored here.
Anyways, next time just give real arguments, your comments only pollutes this nice forum.

Fifty
Fifty
0
Joined: 28 Feb 2016, 17:19

Re: 2017 Force India F1 Team - Mercedes

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Holy ---. Where did the racist part come from driaapg?
You must be from America to throw that argument into the bag.

Dazed1
Dazed1
0
Joined: 20 Mar 2016, 18:53

Re: 2017 Force India F1 Team - Mercedes

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drriapg wrote:
13 Jun 2017, 22:56
Congratulations IamLegend, your non sense comments finally motivated me to register so I can comment.
What you are stating is childish and immature, It almost makes me think you must be ignorant and racist. Because there is no other way to explain it.
Force India can thank Checo for all the good drives, podiums, points and development that along with the team have been achieved.
Perez has real racer's blood in his veins and that's why he behaves this way, I can only picture you cheering for Max
Ocon drove well and was clearly quicker in the last stint. The fact he did not try a kamikaze pass is a feather in his hat. One wonders what Perez would have done if the situation was reversed. ;)

Cannonballer
Cannonballer
2
Joined: 29 Apr 2015, 03:12

Re: 2017 Force India F1 Team - Mercedes

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Fifty wrote:
14 Jun 2017, 01:38
Holy ---. Where did the racist part come from driaapg?
You must be from America to throw that argument into the bag.
I am from America and also thought (and previously posted) that it was maddening that Perez would not Ocon past, especially when he would have given the place back if he failed to pass Ricciardo. The JA article highlights just how badly he screwed his team and makes Perez look AT LEAST 5x worse. So don't blame America, or at least not the blue states...
Wazari wrote: There's a saying in Japan, He might be higher than testicles on a giraffe...........

Fifty
Fifty
0
Joined: 28 Feb 2016, 17:19

Re: 2017 Force India F1 Team - Mercedes

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Amen.....

marmer
marmer
1
Joined: 21 Apr 2017, 06:48

Re: 2017 Force India F1 Team - Mercedes

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drriapg wrote:
13 Jun 2017, 22:56
Congratulations IamLegend, your non sense comments finally motivated me to register so I can comment.
What you are stating is childish and immature, It almost makes me think you must be ignorant and racist. Because there is no other way to explain it.
Force India can thank Checo for all the good drives, podiums, points and development that along with the team have been achieved.
Perez has real racer's blood in his veins and that's why he behaves this way, I can only picture you cheering for Max Verstapen if it would have been him not letting the team mate pass.
Bob Freely has stated that there were no ORDERS given, so no orders were ignored here.
Anyways, next time just give real arguments, your comments only pollutes this nice forum.
Image

Fulcrum
Fulcrum
15
Joined: 25 Aug 2014, 18:05

Re: 2017 Force India F1 Team - Mercedes

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Firstly, I think Perez is a fast driver. However, you don't need to do much browsing before you find people with slightly less than complimentary things to say about Perez - the person.

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/rami ... -attitude/

I think most, if not all, F1 drivers have a selfish streak, and that's fine. They probably need it to be who they are. Where this becomes less defensible is in relation to the team. If you put yourself before the team's objectives, you should anticipate criticism, and Perez's actions in Canada definitely merit criticism.

That being said, Force India could have prevented this situation, either by being unequivocal in their communications to both drivers - you WILL let Ocon pass, etc... - or by pitting Perez, as per the ideas suggested by the James Allen analysis post here:
https://www.jamesallenonf1.com/2017/06/ ... you-think/

As I mentioned in the race thread, Force India, and Perez, have set a bad precedent for the remainder of the season. It will be interesting to see how they handle the next such driver interaction.

i70q7m7ghw
i70q7m7ghw
49
Joined: 12 Mar 2006, 00:27
Location: ...

Re: 2017 Force India F1 Team - Mercedes

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Also, if Perez was eyeing up a Ferrari drive, he could probably forget about it after Canada, they won't have tolerated anything like that.

IamLegend
IamLegend
3
Joined: 02 Dec 2015, 17:42

Re: 2017 Force India F1 Team - Mercedes

Post

marmer wrote:
14 Jun 2017, 06:57
drriapg wrote:
13 Jun 2017, 22:56
Congratulations IamLegend, your non sense comments finally motivated me to register so I can comment.
What you are stating is childish and immature, It almost makes me think you must be ignorant and racist. Because there is no other way to explain it.
Force India can thank Checo for all the good drives, podiums, points and development that along with the team have been achieved.
Perez has real racer's blood in his veins and that's why he behaves this way, I can only picture you cheering for Max Verstapen if it would have been him not letting the team mate pass.
Bob Freely has stated that there were no ORDERS given, so no orders were ignored here.
Anyways, next time just give real arguments, your comments only pollutes this nice forum.
http://s2.quickmeme.com/img/5b/5b7e0fdd ... 9c4ce1.jpg
Wow, first time an Indian living in the US is called a racist, oh well there's a first time for everything. Okay here's why I think SFi need to really let Perez know that he has to get his act together:

From the start of the season he's been a bit too vocal from last year about how inept the car has been and even though SFi have improved and are the best in the midfield currently, he's saying he's been driving the wheels off the car to get a good result. Someone in this conversation thread pointed out brilliantly that in the Canadian GP Ocon one up'ed him, had great race pace, strategy and tire conservation to have a fair go at a rival and if you noticed throughout the season, he first struggled in qualifying but he's taken care of that aspect and with his race craft been doing so well thus far with the same machinery. I'm really impressed by this rookie and expect great things for him.

But I really felt Sergio let down the team, he was radioed 5 times and it was a fair deal, the place would have been swapped back! I didn't have that information beforehand and that's what made me mad, I read it on jamesallenf1 and they apparently looked up the radio logs to get this information. Like the article says, on any other given Sunday in the prior years SFi wouldn't have gotten so much spotlight for this gaffe but now that they are a solid mid-fielder and a potential podium finisher all eyes will be on them. So SFi should have been more assertive to give up the position temporarily or forced him to come into pits, but that's in hindsight like I mentioned already. I'm glad that Vijay Mallaya has tweeted about coming up with a strategy if such a situation does occur and the team can be more assertive.

On the other hand, just for comparison's sake, Sergio is a great talent but talent only takes you so far, but he's not a pay driver - he's paid a salary from SFi so he's a salaried employee for all intensive purposes, so if I were in his shoes I'd listen to my employer. He brings a bit of the sponsors from Mexico, so what? Tomorrow if Ocon gets it from France should he throw his weight around the team like what Sergio is doing?

Work ethic is another aspect that plays a big part in a racer's career. The one shining example I'd like to take is Michael Schumacher, remind me one time in his career he's talked negatively about the team or any actions that has shown him in that light? I think this is one of the reasons he's been so successful. I haven't seen that in Hamilton or Alonso - both were quick to talk about sabotage and team conspiring to make the driver lose a championship at one or more points in their career, but I do see a lot of Schumacher's ethic in Ocon, he's respectful and grateful of the team, good work ethic, talented and brings a lot of positive spirit to the team. I was just amazed how mature he was in his approach, "My time will come" wow, that's a winner right there.

Oh and also I'm not a Max Verstappen fan, in the previous iterations of the F1 car he might have looked spectacular with his moving under the braking stunt to block drivers, but I doubt you'll see all that tactics from cars of this generation (infact I haven't seen it all season thus far) simple reason being more downforce, grip and shorter braking distance, there's no time for all this monkey tricks.

That's my 2 cents, if Sergio wants to continue in this team, he should respect their decisions and I do sincerely hope SFi become more assertive, if he feels he's too good for the outfit, well I'd be the first to wish him good luck and be on his way. I'm very excited about Ocon and the prospect of getting either another great rookie or Kubica (wishful thinking) to take this seat, cheers!
Last edited by IamLegend on 14 Jun 2017, 16:51, edited 3 times in total.

marmer
marmer
1
Joined: 21 Apr 2017, 06:48

Re: 2017 Force India F1 Team - Mercedes

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what sergio need this year was a bad teammate. he has made it clear he wants to move to a big team. last year he missed out on the Merc drive and one has to think he was sniffing around for it.
if kimi stays on for another year i would be shocked so he must think this is his time. if he finishing 5 - 6 places above his teammate every week that would look great. if a rookie turns up and matches him why would a big team take him over the rookie.

User avatar
Big Mangalhit
27
Joined: 03 Dec 2015, 15:39

Re: 2017 Force India F1 Team - Mercedes

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IamLegend wrote:
14 Jun 2017, 16:34
...

From the start of the season he's been a bit too vocal from last year about how inept the car has been and even though SFi have improved and are the best in the midfield currently, he's saying he's been driving the wheels off the car to get a good result. Someone in this conversation thread pointed out brilliantly that in the Canadian GP Ocon one up'ed him, had great race pace, strategy and tire conservation to have a fair go at a rival and if you noticed throughout the season, he first struggled in qualifying but he's taken care of that aspect and with his race craft been doing so well thus far with the same machinery. I'm really impressed by this rookie and expect great things for him.

But I really felt Sergio let down the team, he was radioed 5 times and it was a fair deal, the place would have been swapped back! I didn't have that information beforehand and that's what made me mad, I read it on jamesallenf1 and they apparently looked up the radio logs to get this information. Like the article says, on any other given Sunday in the prior years SFi wouldn't have gotten so much spotlight for this gaffe but now that they are a solid mid-fielder and a potential podium finisher all eyes will be on them. So SFi should have been more assertive to give up the position temporarily or forced him to come into pits, but that's in hindsight like I mentioned already. I'm glad that Vijay Mallaya has tweeted about coming up with a strategy if such a situation does occur and the team can be more assertive.

...
Ocon was faster just because he had the best strategy. Perez should be ahead of him but was sacrificed for the team in order to cover kimi early stop. They ask him to let Ocon have a go but he didn't want to miss an opportunity to pass Ric that he felt was coming. I think Sergio is being amazing these last 2 years but he is a bit overconfident now. Last race in monaco he risked to much and lost the position in the points and this week he was really confident in his ability even tho he had really old tyres.

Btw here is the radio transcript so you can see what you think with more clear picture of the eng-driver talk. I'm not trying to change your opinion tho
http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2017/06/14/2 ... ranscript/