2021 Red Bull Racing F1 Team

This forum contains threads to discuss teams themselves. Anything not technical about the cars, including restructuring, performances etc belongs here.
PhillipM
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Re: 2021 Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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Revs84 wrote:
Thu Apr 08, 2021 10:46 am

In any case, they are saying there are rumours (and again, they could be just that), that Red Bull is set to implement some sort of solution that mimicks rear wheel steering without going against the regulations - since we all know that rear wheel steering is not allowed.
This rumour is something that goes around about the fastest team every year by clueless press trying to bait clicks. Literally, every, single, year. By the same dubious sources.

Every single team on the grid uses passive rear wheel steering. Every one of them. They have for longer than this site has been around.

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godlameroso
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Re: 2021 Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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dren wrote:
Fri Apr 09, 2021 1:51 pm
godlameroso wrote:
Wed Apr 07, 2021 8:38 pm
The engine was stiff enough, the installation between transmission and engine was not.
Attachment is standardized via regulations. Perhaps the transmission was the issue. Isn't this where tokens were spent? I still recon it was something to do with their aero, maybe nose/cape design? I read it was an easy fix once they figured it out. I don't know, but that's my guess.

godlameroso wrote:
Wed Apr 07, 2021 8:38 pm
Increasing internal volume increases the pressure because pressure is a function of flow times velocity. The higher the mass flow and the lower the velocity the higher the pressure. This is how the turbo compressor creates boost pressure. The air gets sucked in through the blades at high speed, then the snail slows it down, raising it's static pressure.
This makes my head hurt.

godlameroso wrote:
Wed Apr 07, 2021 8:38 pm
If the surface on top of the body has airflow going faster than through it, then that airflow has lower pressure. The ambient air pressure around that moving low pressure air presses down against it, since it's slower and has higher static pressure. That's how the Coanda effect works.
Coanda effect does not require a pressure difference between sides of a body. It requires pressure difference on sides of a flow stream.
Must have too much air pressure in your head.

The flow stream going inside the bodywork is the same flow stream going over the car, unless the body work gets its airflow from a different place than the rest of the body work. It's the same parcel of air being displaced by the moving car. The rear end of the car affects the front wing, and vise versa for a reason.
Last edited by godlameroso on Fri Apr 09, 2021 3:32 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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godlameroso
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Re: 2021 Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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PhillipM wrote:
Fri Apr 09, 2021 2:18 pm
Revs84 wrote:
Thu Apr 08, 2021 10:46 am

In any case, they are saying there are rumours (and again, they could be just that), that Red Bull is set to implement some sort of solution that mimicks rear wheel steering without going against the regulations - since we all know that rear wheel steering is not allowed.
This rumour is something that goes around about the fastest team every year by clueless press trying to bait clicks. Literally, every, single, year. By the same dubious sources.

Every single team on the grid uses passive rear wheel steering. Every one of them. They have for longer than this site has been around.
Rear wheel steering is just the toe curve. Have toe out at high rake, then toe in at low rake, as the suspension unloads you get toe out, as it compresses you get toe in. This isn't new, as you say, all double wishbone/multi-link setups work this way.
The height of cultivation is really nothing special. It is merely simplicity; the ability to express the utmost with the minimum. Mr.Lee

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godlameroso
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Re: 2021 Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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Zynerji wrote:
Thu Apr 08, 2021 10:51 pm
This seems silly?!

The reservoir on the master cylinder is there to fill the space for the receding pads.
Right, but it's a closed system, so if the resevoir has air in it, both fluid and air are entering the system as the pad wears, which is why you tend to bleed brakes during a brake service. Do me a favor, open the cap on your brake master cylinder reservoir, tell me if the rubber seal looks like it's been sucked in, which is what it should do if there's zero air in the system.

Related pro tip: if you REALLY wanna get all the air out of the system, pull the fuse on your brake lights, and pin the brake pedal to the floor with a piece of wood or something overnight. Then replace the fuse, and enjoy your rock hard brake pedal as you have now pushed every molecule of air back into the reservoir.
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godlameroso
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Re: 2021 Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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A final nail on this discussion, air pressure, or lack of it, is why your brake pedal works at all. The vacuum booster helps with the mashing of the brakes. The lack of air pressure in the vacuum booster is helping you overcome the hydraulic resistance of the system. Without it, you'd need body builder legs to make the brakes work. Or have 5G's of deceleration helping you :)
Last edited by godlameroso on Fri Apr 09, 2021 3:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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PhillipM
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Re: 2021 Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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godlameroso wrote:
Fri Apr 09, 2021 3:40 pm
Right, but it's a closed system, so if the resevoir has air in it, both fluid and air are entering the system as the pad wears, which is why you tend to bleed brakes during a brake service.
No, there's no air in the hydraulic side, you bleed brakes to get the old, cooked, moisture infused fluid out in a service. You only bleed brakes to get the air out after the system has been opened.
Also, F1 doesn't use air pressure brake servos, at all, like most race cars.
Brakes on a race car would work completely fine even if you were running in a vacuum.

I used to make brake calipers, master cylinders and discs for for a living, if you want the credentials on that side, the vast majority of the work in that is on the seal, groove shape and seal retraction, followed by materials and system stiffness - nothing to do with air pressure.
Last edited by PhillipM on Fri Apr 09, 2021 3:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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godlameroso
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Re: 2021 Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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PhillipM wrote:
Fri Apr 09, 2021 3:56 pm
godlameroso wrote:
Fri Apr 09, 2021 3:40 pm
Right, but it's a closed system, so if the resevoir has air in it, both fluid and air are entering the system as the pad wears, which is why you tend to bleed brakes during a brake service.
No, there's no air in the hydraulic side, you bleed brakes to get the old, cooked, moisture infused fluid out in a service. You only bleed brakes to get the air out after the system has been opened.
Also, F1 doesn't use air pressure brake servos, at all, like most race cars.
Whenever I do a brake service, I always open the bleeder to help me retract the piston(s), and there's always a little air that comes out. Nothing much, but enough for a good driver to notice. I do this so that crud doesn't go back up the brake lines, it just comes out the bleeder instead, and makes flushing brake fluid faster.

Also, yes F1 is unassisted brakes, so it takes considerable force to push the brake pedal, like 120kg IIRC. You have a lot of deceleration G's helping you though, so it kind of balances out. A nice stiff brake pedal makes it easier to have fine brake control to get your weight transfer perfect.
Last edited by godlameroso on Fri Apr 09, 2021 4:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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PhillipM
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Re: 2021 Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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Then you have a leak, or your fluid wasn't degassed properly.

Either way it's off topic nonsense now.
Last edited by PhillipM on Fri Apr 09, 2021 4:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Wouter
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Re: 2021 Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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On this edition of Talking Bull we chat to Max's Performance Coach Brad Scanes, who provides an in-depth insight into the hard work put in this pre-season to get Max fighting fit for the longest season in F1 history. We also catch up with Christian Horner and hear how the whole team are pushing full tilt to try and take the fight to Mercedes this season.
https://www.redbull.com/int-en/podcast- ... ce-podcast

dans79
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Re: 2021 Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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PhillipM wrote:
Fri Apr 09, 2021 4:00 pm
Then you have a leak, or your fluid wasn't degassed properly.
I'd concur. When I was taught, you kept bleeding till no air came out.
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Wouter
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Re: 2021 Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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Red Bull ohne ,geheimnisvolle‘ Radaufhängung

Gleichzeitig räumt Marko bei F1-Insider.com mit Gerüchten auf. In Imola würde Red Bull mit einer neuen geheimnisvollen Radaufhängung fahren, wurde da spekuliert. Marko: „Das ist völliger Blödsinn. Diese ,geheimnisvolle‘ Radaufhängung sind wir schon beim Auftakt in Bahrain gefahren. Sie ist auch nichts Besonderes, sondern wir mussten sie konstruieren, weil wir eine Aufhängung brauchten, die optimal zum extrem schmalen und engen Heck passt, das wir in dieser Saison um den neuen, kleineren und kompakteren Honda-Motor gebaut haben.“

Red Bull without the mysterious ‘wheel suspension

At the same time, Marko clears up rumors at F1-Insider.com. In Imola, Red Bull would drive with a new, mysterious wheel suspension, it was speculated. Marko: “That is complete nonsense. We already rode this mysterious ‘wheel suspension at the start in Bahrain. It's nothing special either, we had to design it because we needed a suspension that would fit the extremely narrow and narrow rear end that we built around the new, smaller and more compact Honda engine this season. "

https://f1-insider.com/formel-1-red-bul ... zweikampf/

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Wouter
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Re: 2021 Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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@Sparky68 is an employee of RBR and occasionally provides inside information on the Autosport forum.
This was also the case last night about the rumor that Franco Nugnes once again made up.
He responded to reports about Franco Nugnes' gossip.
Image

DarthPlagueisTheVise
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Re: 2021 Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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Wouter wrote:
Sat Apr 10, 2021 9:33 am
@Sparky68 is an employee of RBR and occasionally provides inside information on the Autosport forum.
This was also the case last night about the rumor that Franco Nugnes once again made up.
He responded to reports about Franco Nugnes' gossip.
https://i.imgur.com/SYcupGp.gif
Sounds something like a rbr employee would say :lol:
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Re: 2021 Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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Ah, the serial liar and fantasist Nugnes, remember when he said he had uncovered Honda had been using spies to copy Ferarri's engine? :lol:

I think it was around the US GP when the FIA first clamped down on Ferrari's rocket engine.

He should pen an F1 spy thriller because as a reporter he's useless.

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Wouter
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Re: 2021 Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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Go behind the scenes for exclusive access to the Team as we follow Max and Checo from Testing
to a thrilling opening race of the season in Bahrain.