Who still hates the halo?

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turbof1
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Re: Who still hates the halo?

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I wouldn't treat F1 and other open cockpit series as different in this regard. They have very similar risks regarding head injuries (of course the speed the car has also influences the risk, but the exposure to the risk is the same). What happened to Surtees could just as well have happened to a F1 driver, because both cars at the time had very similar exposure, while a Halo would have bounced the tyre off without putting pressure on the driver's neck.

Shrieker did make a good comment. Yes, Maria was really a freak accident and you can the truck being there with loading door open as a big contributor to it. However, your original statement is that it would not have saved anyone, while in Maria's case it would have. In massa's case it would have not helped of course (but, the new helmets and a cockpit individually would have).

Even if it did not help anyone in the past, are we really saying no to increased head protection? Yes, it can be described as ugly (although I can certainly come up with much better examples of ugly bodywork we all got used to eventually), yes they could have done a better job with aesthetics or have gone all the way with closed cockpit with an integrated halo. At the end of the day, if we want to combine high speed cars with risk reduction for drivers, we shouldn't play down the safety benefit.
#AeroFrodo

LM10
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Re: Who still hates the halo?

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By now, I’ve got used to the halo and think that the cars look even better with it. The halo makes the car look somewhat more aggressive.
Last edited by LM10 on Sat Feb 16, 2019 12:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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SiLo
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Re: Who still hates the halo?

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I still hate it and think it looks ugly, but I've gotten used to it. I do however understand the benefits of it for safety reasons.
Felipe Baby!

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Andres125sx
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Re: Who still hates the halo?

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NtsParadize wrote:
Thu Feb 14, 2019 4:56 pm
Shrieker wrote:
Thu Feb 14, 2019 4:52 pm
NtsParadize wrote:
Thu Feb 14, 2019 4:50 pm

Even it wouldn't have saved anyone in between 1978 and 2018.
Maybe Maria's family would like to have a word with you ?
Maybe the truck should never have been there?
Maybe, but that´s like saying accidents should never happen :roll:

There´s a reason for safety measures, specially passive safety devices like HALO, HANS, 6 points belts, etc. wich is no matter how safe you make it, s*** will happen, and when it does happen, you can be prepared for the consequences or not, it´s up to you.

The reason in these days a driver´s death is so rare is because of active and passive safety. Even if it´s true that something should have been done different to prevent the accident, if you think you can prevent any accident sorry but you´re just too arrogant. We can´t, plain and simple, there will always be situations nobody can even imagine before they happen, so we must be prepared to minimize cosequences when that does happen. That´s the reason for active and passive safety. HALO is just one more layer in passive safety.

And yes, it would have saved Maria, period, so your claims was simply wrong, don´t try to make it up

NtsParadize
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Re: Who still hates the halo?

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Andres125sx wrote:
Fri Feb 15, 2019 12:02 pm
NtsParadize wrote:
Thu Feb 14, 2019 4:56 pm
Shrieker wrote:
Thu Feb 14, 2019 4:52 pm


Maybe Maria's family would like to have a word with you ?
Maybe the truck should never have been there?
Maybe, but that´s like saying accidents should never happen :roll:

There´s a reason for safety measures, specially passive safety devices like HALO, HANS, 6 points belts, etc. wich is no matter how safe you make it, s*** will happen, and when it does happen, you can be prepared for the consequences or not, it´s up to you.

The reason in these days a driver´s death is so rare is because of active and passive safety. Even if it´s true that something should have been done different to prevent the accident, if you think you can prevent any accident sorry but you´re just too arrogant. We can´t, plain and simple, there will always be situations nobody can even imagine before they happen, so we must be prepared to minimize cosequences when that does happen. That´s the reason for active and passive safety. HALO is just one more layer in passive safety.

And yes, it would have saved Maria, period, so your claims was simply wrong, don´t try to make it up
Your comment sounds like a truck being on a track is a normal thing

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Re: Who still hates the halo?

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NtsParadize wrote:
Thu Feb 14, 2019 4:09 pm
The halo is horrible, it doesn't belong in F1 in my opinion. It wouldn't have saved Leclerc, nor Bianchi, and it trapped Hulkenberg.
I've just seen a totally random "#F*CKHALO" comment from you in the comment section of a video of Autosport. Come on, man! Get over it. :roll: :)

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Andres125sx
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Re: Who still hates the halo?

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NtsParadize wrote:
Fri Feb 15, 2019 8:26 pm
Andres125sx wrote:
Fri Feb 15, 2019 12:02 pm
NtsParadize wrote:
Thu Feb 14, 2019 4:56 pm

Maybe the truck should never have been there?
Maybe, but that´s like saying accidents should never happen :roll:

There´s a reason for safety measures, specially passive safety devices like HALO, HANS, 6 points belts, etc. wich is no matter how safe you make it, s*** will happen, and when it does happen, you can be prepared for the consequences or not, it´s up to you.

The reason in these days a driver´s death is so rare is because of active and passive safety. Even if it´s true that something should have been done different to prevent the accident, if you think you can prevent any accident sorry but you´re just too arrogant. We can´t, plain and simple, there will always be situations nobody can even imagine before they happen, so we must be prepared to minimize cosequences when that does happen. That´s the reason for active and passive safety. HALO is just one more layer in passive safety.

And yes, it would have saved Maria, period, so your claims was simply wrong, don´t try to make it up
Your comment sounds like a truck being on a track is a normal thing
On a testing/filming day? Yes, it is


Your comment OTOH sounds like many others from past eras when any change in F1 or F1 cars was implemented...

F1 cars have always had the engine in the front!
F1 cars have never had a rool hoop!
Seatbelts? That has never been part of F1 cars, you´re a coward!
F1 cars have never had wings!
And so on...

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Re: Who still hates the halo?

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The Halo makes no difference to me come race day, I don’t teally notice it at all

Some teams have done a better job at hiding it than others with a good paint job, hats off to Ferrari, where as McLaren could do with a re-think on how the incorporate theirs

http://f1i.com/news/330009-f1i-poll-vot ... esign.html
(A good comparison guide)

I think it’s a definite plus on the safety side, nobody wants to see ny drivers head crushed and whether it Would it wouldn’t save anyone’s life in the past is irrelevant

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strad
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Re: Who still hates the halo?

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Say what you will there are those that agree with Max's statement.
To achieve anything, you must be prepared to dabble on the boundary of disaster.”
Sir Stirling Moss

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Andres125sx
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Re: Who still hates the halo?

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Agree, there will always be some people who think they know better than the official investigators :roll:

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strad
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Re: Who still hates the halo?

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And there will always be someone who thinks they're the smartest one in the room. :wink:
To achieve anything, you must be prepared to dabble on the boundary of disaster.”
Sir Stirling Moss

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Andres125sx
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Re: Who still hates the halo?

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Exactly, that´s what I said :wink:

NtsParadize
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Re: Who still hates the halo?

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Andres125sx wrote:
Sun Feb 17, 2019 10:33 am
Agree, there will always be some people who think they know better than the official investigators :roll:
Argument from authority. The Williams mechanics were qualified mechanics, Adrian Newey is a brillant engineer and the steering column still failed.

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Re: Who still hates the halo?

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It would save Henry Surtees…

People that are against the halo, must be the ones that drive without seatbelt, and talking on the cellphone.

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Andres125sx
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Re: Who still hates the halo?

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NtsParadize wrote:
Wed Feb 20, 2019 2:48 pm
Andres125sx wrote:
Sun Feb 17, 2019 10:33 am
Agree, there will always be some people who think they know better than the official investigators :roll:
Argument from authority. The Williams mechanics were qualified mechanics, Adrian Newey is a brillant engineer and the steering column still failed.
I´d say argument from knownledge. We outsiders have no data at all about the accident, while the official investigators had access to all available information, from track traces, all camera angles and even telemetry.

Any outsider thinking he knows better with no info at all than the investigators who had access to all available info, IMHO has a serious arrogance problem