Honda Power Unit Hardware & Software

All that has to do with the power train, gearbox, clutch, fuels and lubricants, etc. Generally the mechanical side of Formula One.
etusch
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Re: Honda Power Unit Hardware & Software

Post by etusch » Thu Jun 20, 2019 11:53 am

This is a realistic number

Wouter
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Re: Honda Power Unit Hardware & Software

Post by Wouter » Thu Jun 20, 2019 12:02 pm

etusch wrote:
Thu Jun 20, 2019 11:53 am
This is a realistic number
I don't think this is a realistic number. When it is only 10HP Honda never would introduce a new engine .
I think it is more 15-20 hp and better drivability and more often and longer use the batteries.

Stef
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Re: Honda Power Unit Hardware & Software

Post by Stef » Thu Jun 20, 2019 12:09 pm

Depends if it's peak power, average power,...

godlameroso
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Re: Honda Power Unit Hardware & Software

Post by godlameroso » Thu Jun 20, 2019 12:52 pm

That's a 20hp boost since Aus PU.
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loner
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Re: Honda Power Unit Hardware & Software

Post by loner » Thu Jun 20, 2019 12:59 pm

Wouter wrote:
Thu Jun 20, 2019 12:02 pm
etusch wrote:
Thu Jun 20, 2019 11:53 am
This is a realistic number
I don't think this is a realistic number. When it is only 10HP Honda never would introduce a new engine .
I think it is more 15-20 hp and better drivability and more often and longer use the batteries.
imagine honda racing boss to say .. oh look our collaboration with the Aero engine department with all their knowledge and technology in the area of aerodynamic design, working alongside turbocharger manufacturer IHI.
lead to 10 hp increase :lol: :lol:
so my guess from Fabrega tweet will be this update is in 2 parts one will debut in France and the other part the (major) one will be some where before summer end.. how this can be regarding the spec 4 in September update i have no clue.. will they go with 5 PU?!!
It Tolls for Thee.

Stef
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Re: Honda Power Unit Hardware & Software

Post by Stef » Thu Jun 20, 2019 1:09 pm

That's what Marko said at the start of the season, no, 5 PUs ?

bosyber
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Re: Honda Power Unit Hardware & Software

Post by bosyber » Thu Jun 20, 2019 1:18 pm

Well, if that brings them to winning pace, why not? Red Bull are solidly in third, and not likely to move down, or sufficiently up to fight Mercedes for the WDC,WCC. Currently they can, with nothing else going wrong, already bank on getting 5-6th even if they start from far down; while STR will suffer a race from penalties, they then have a chance of regularly fighting for 4th team in the race, netting the 'semi-big' points that can easily put them near the front of the midfield, since it is still so tight (and soo far behind the top three too).

Bill
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Re: Honda Power Unit Hardware & Software

Post by Bill » Thu Jun 20, 2019 1:48 pm

10hp figure looks suspect why do all this numbers always multiple of ten. Febregga is getting his news from this thread that number was first suggested here ,Mercedes according to Lewis their update only brought realibity not additional power so they is nothing to laugh at.

etusch
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Re: Honda Power Unit Hardware & Software

Post by etusch » Thu Jun 20, 2019 1:57 pm

Stef wrote:
Thu Jun 20, 2019 1:09 pm
That's what Marko said at the start of the season, no, 5 PUs ?
What I think about their pre season plan is it is changed because of big dominance of Merc. I think they now not thinks about how many engine used but how much power gained.

loner
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Re: Honda Power Unit Hardware & Software

Post by loner » Thu Jun 20, 2019 2:14 pm

Stef wrote:
Thu Jun 20, 2019 1:09 pm
That's what Marko said at the start of the season, no, 5 PUs ?
iam not aware but seems so after googled it
if we take the current pattern an update after 4 races you still have 2 updates one at Hungary and finally in Russia
however i highly doubt an update will occur in Hungary since its a winnable race.
It Tolls for Thee.

maguetox
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Re: Honda Power Unit Hardware & Software

Post by maguetox » Thu Jun 20, 2019 3:18 pm

loner wrote:
Thu Jun 20, 2019 12:59 pm
Wouter wrote:
Thu Jun 20, 2019 12:02 pm
etusch wrote:
Thu Jun 20, 2019 11:53 am
This is a realistic number
I don't think this is a realistic number. When it is only 10HP Honda never would introduce a new engine .
I think it is more 15-20 hp and better drivability and more often and longer use the batteries.
imagine honda racing boss to say .. oh look our collaboration with the Aero engine department with all their knowledge and technology in the area of aerodynamic design, working alongside turbocharger manufacturer IHI.
lead to 10 hp increase :lol: :lol:
so my guess from Fabrega tweet will be this update is in 2 parts one will debut in France and the other part the (major) one will be some where before summer end.. how this can be regarding the spec 4 in September update i have no clue.. will they go with 5 PU?!!
It looks really strange that only 10HP, it looks to me they rushed this upgrade in order to evaluate something else, and here I´m interconnecting with what Max just recently said:

......."Of course we all know that we need to do better but I believe in the project we are in together with Honda.

"So, we are just working hard now to of course step up the performance and we'll see in the upcoming races where we will be.

"If you get a bit more power, a bit more balance in the car, then suddenly it looks a lot different."

So I buy the idea that this PU upgrade is in two stages, the first one, this one, is to help evaluate something that Red Bull needs in their aero or mechanical side, the second one will be the real upgrade.

etusch
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Re: Honda Power Unit Hardware & Software

Post by etusch » Thu Jun 20, 2019 4:01 pm

It can be just 10 hp as peak power but more mgu-h gain for longer mgu-k support during race. Maybe..

godlameroso
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Re: Honda Power Unit Hardware & Software

Post by godlameroso » Thu Jun 20, 2019 4:05 pm

I'm excited at the possibility because numbers alone don't tell the whole picture. There are many ways to get tangible gains without substantially more power.

To me that they use the Honda Aero program means they are treating the unit not primarily as a reciprocating combustion engine, but as a hybrid turbine/reciprocating piston engine. It's almost like a turbo/prop, but instead of a propeller it's a pair of wheels. I feel the electrical and fuel system sophistication allow one to treat the ICE as the combustor in a traditional turbine engine, and it is the turbo that is running the show. The ERS allows one to have the turbine run independently of the ICE, thus it is not the turbine that becomes dependent on the ICE for power but rather the ICE becomes dependent on the turbo for power.

So just the change in philosophy itself can bring gains, not just peak power, but shape of power band, ability to extract more work from the ERS, make improvements to efficiency for more harvesting, etc. True all these things can be altered by reducing or increasing power, but to get these gains while both increasing power and reliability is much more difficult to do. The fact that they're doing it on such a consistent basis should give one hope.
The height of cultivation is really nothing special. It is merely simplicity; the ability to express the utmost with the minimum. Mr.Lee

NL_Fer
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Re: Honda Power Unit Hardware & Software

Post by NL_Fer » Thu Jun 20, 2019 5:59 pm

10hp more on the crank and more MGU-H recovery, to allow for longer MGU-K deployment or longer open-wastegate mode.

McMika98
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Re: Honda Power Unit Hardware & Software

Post by McMika98 » Thu Jun 20, 2019 6:16 pm

https://unendinginsight.wordpress.com/2 ... #more-1180

Honda losing 2 tenths to Renault on straight. No point in speculating random horsepower numbers. Pure factual data here to back my claims which i guess no one wants to know.
So spec 3 Honda will still be weaker than Spec 2 Renault and the rest of the field, this is from Max's mouth and not me. Spec 4.0 in 5 races now.