WEC 2020 Tech Regulations - Hypercar Regulations

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SiLo
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Re: WEC 2020 Tech Regulations - Hypercar Regulations

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jjn9128 wrote:
Wed Aug 25, 2021 3:39 pm
SiLo wrote:
Wed Aug 25, 2021 3:23 pm
I'm still confused about the regs for the hypercar category to be honest, but at least they look nice!
There's 2 different regs is why. LMH is the ACO/FIA version, and LMDh is the IMSA version (Le Mans Daytona hybrid). BOP'd to equity so they can race in both series'. LMH is designed from scratch, while LMDh is based on a LMP2 chassis like the current IMSA prototypes but with some small styling tweaks to differentiate them. Then there's the whole mess of the Alpine entry, which is a LMP2 with a different engine and some BOP tweaks but was allowed this season only (though probably next season also) basically to fill out the entry list.

So far the only confirmed LMH are Toyota, Glickenhaus, Peugeot and Ferrari (byKolles technically also but that may never actually happen). The rest of the confirmed entries are LMDh - Audi, Cadilac...etc.
For LMH - how do they differentiate from the older LMP1 cars? They all end up looking the same... Do they need to produce X amount of road cars to homologate these ones?
Felipe Baby!

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jjn9128
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Re: WEC 2020 Tech Regulations - Hypercar Regulations

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SiLo wrote:
Wed Aug 25, 2021 4:13 pm
For LMH - how do they differentiate from the older LMP1 cars? They all end up looking the same... Do they need to produce X amount of road cars to homologate these ones?
That's a great question. Not by much is the answer. The LMH rulebook actually has sections with slightly different rules for prototypes vs production based models. Basically I think they didn't get enough OEMs signed up and Glickenhaus and byKolles queried why independent teams were being frozen out - so it's still really a prototype series. Toyota might do a production run of 300 cars which I think is the minimum.

The LMH rules though have some very strict BOP measures. A minimum weight like most series, plus length, width, height. There's a strict power curve for the engine. Then downforce, drag, and aero-efficiency are regulated - which allows the geometric rules to be relaxed.

So compared to LMP1 the LMH are heavier, less aerodynamically efficient, and power limited. But not necessarily based on production models as originally intended.
#aerogandalf
"There is one big friend. It is downforce. And once you have this it’s a big mate and it’s helping a lot." Robert Kubica

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SiLo
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Re: WEC 2020 Tech Regulations - Hypercar Regulations

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jjn9128 wrote:
Wed Aug 25, 2021 5:05 pm
SiLo wrote:
Wed Aug 25, 2021 4:13 pm
For LMH - how do they differentiate from the older LMP1 cars? They all end up looking the same... Do they need to produce X amount of road cars to homologate these ones?
That's a great question. Not by much is the answer. The LMH rulebook actually has sections with slightly different rules for prototypes vs production based models. Basically I think they didn't get enough OEMs signed up and Glickenhaus and byKolles queried why independent teams were being frozen out - so it's still really a prototype series. Toyota might do a production run of 300 cars which I think is the minimum.

The LMH rules though have some very strict BOP measures. A minimum weight like most series, plus length, width, height. There's a strict power curve for the engine. Then downforce, drag, and aero-efficiency are regulated - which allows the geometric rules to be relaxed.

So compared to LMP1 the LMH are heavier, less aerodynamically efficient, and power limited. But not necessarily based on production models as originally intended.
So sounds like they are trying to not create a spec series as much as possible, but don't want a spending war so use BoP heavily to keep the cars close together. Will see if that works out I guess.
Felipe Baby!

NL_Fer
NL_Fer
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Re: WEC 2020 Tech Regulations - Hypercar Regulations

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SiLo wrote:
Wed Aug 25, 2021 4:13 pm
jjn9128 wrote:
Wed Aug 25, 2021 3:39 pm
SiLo wrote:
Wed Aug 25, 2021 3:23 pm
I'm still confused about the regs for the hypercar category to be honest, but at least they look nice!
There's 2 different regs is why. LMH is the ACO/FIA version, and LMDh is the IMSA version (Le Mans Daytona hybrid). BOP'd to equity so they can race in both series'. LMH is designed from scratch, while LMDh is based on a LMP2 chassis like the current IMSA prototypes but with some small styling tweaks to differentiate them. Then there's the whole mess of the Alpine entry, which is a LMP2 with a different engine and some BOP tweaks but was allowed this season only (though probably next season also) basically to fill out the entry list.

So far the only confirmed LMH are Toyota, Glickenhaus, Peugeot and Ferrari (byKolles technically also but that may never actually happen). The rest of the confirmed entries are LMDh - Audi, Cadilac...etc.
For LMH - how do they differentiate from the older LMP1 cars? They all end up looking the same... Do they need to produce X amount of road cars to homologate these ones?
They look the same at first, but in reality a hypercar is bigger (longer, wider, higher) than an LMP. Size is now compatible with the GT’s and other street cars. Also so weight is increased from 870 to 1030kg. Maximum combined power used to be almost 1000bhp, hypercar only has 680bhp. Electric drive is front axle only now, instead of both axles or one axle + exhaust heat recovery.

In short, a hypercar is bigger, heavier, less powerfull less downforce than an LMP1 used to be.

Cold Fussion
Cold Fussion
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Re: WEC 2020 Tech Regulations - Hypercar Regulations

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NL_Fer wrote:
Thu Aug 26, 2021 9:55 pm
They look the same at first, but in reality a hypercar is bigger (longer, wider, higher) than an LMP. Size is now compatible with the GT’s and other street cars. Also so weight is increased from 870 to 1030kg. Maximum combined power used to be almost 1000bhp, hypercar only has 680bhp. Electric drive is front axle only now, instead of both axles or one axle + exhaust heat recovery.

In short, a hypercar is bigger, heavier, less powerfull less downforce than an LMP1 used to be.
Wasn't that 1000 hp limit only specifically at Le Mans in the old LMP1 regulations?

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Morteza
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Re: WEC 2020 Tech Regulations - Hypercar Regulations

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"A fool thinks himself to be wise, but a wise man knows himself to be a fool."~William Shakespeare

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jjn9128
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Re: WEC 2020 Tech Regulations - Hypercar Regulations

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That's even more tragic.
#aerogandalf
"There is one big friend. It is downforce. And once you have this it’s a big mate and it’s helping a lot." Robert Kubica

NL_Fer
NL_Fer
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Re: WEC 2020 Tech Regulations - Hypercar Regulations

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Cold Fussion wrote:
Fri Aug 27, 2021 6:24 am
NL_Fer wrote:
Thu Aug 26, 2021 9:55 pm
They look the same at first, but in reality a hypercar is bigger (longer, wider, higher) than an LMP. Size is now compatible with the GT’s and other street cars. Also so weight is increased from 870 to 1030kg. Maximum combined power used to be almost 1000bhp, hypercar only has 680bhp. Electric drive is front axle only now, instead of both axles or one axle + exhaust heat recovery.

In short, a hypercar is bigger, heavier, less powerfull less downforce than an LMP1 used to be.
Wasn't that 1000 hp limit only specifically at Le Mans in the old LMP1 regulations?
Yeah it wasn’t a real limit, both all the hybrid lmp1’s would output about that amount of total horsepower.

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Morteza
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Re: WEC 2020 Tech Regulations - Hypercar Regulations

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"A fool thinks himself to be wise, but a wise man knows himself to be a fool."~William Shakespeare

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Stu
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Re: WEC 2020 Tech Regulations - Hypercar Regulations

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A sensible progression for them, their current entry is ‘grandfathered’ from the old regs, but is based on an LMP2 chassis.
Common sense is not as common as stupidity, but it is better to be uninformed than to be mis-informed...

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Morteza
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Re: WEC 2020 Tech Regulations - Hypercar Regulations

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"A fool thinks himself to be wise, but a wise man knows himself to be a fool."~William Shakespeare

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Morteza
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Re: WEC 2020 Tech Regulations - Hypercar Regulations

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"A fool thinks himself to be wise, but a wise man knows himself to be a fool."~William Shakespeare

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Scorpaguy
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Re: WEC 2020 Tech Regulations - Hypercar Regulations

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Rahal and a BMW Hypercar in WEC...things are looking bright =D>

wogx
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Re: WEC 2020 Tech Regulations - Hypercar Regulations

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In IMSA, not WEC

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Stu
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Re: WEC 2020 Tech Regulations - Hypercar Regulations

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No information on which chassis they are using (LMDh category), art work has a very skinny canopy & should be taken with a pinch of salt!

Edit: chassis provision is from Dallara, as is the new Cadillac LMDh.

Rumour also has it that for all of the noise about “we MUST build our own car” by Ferrari, their Hypercar entry will have a chassis by….

….Dallara!

(Just like they did for the beautiful 333SP back in the 90’s).
Common sense is not as common as stupidity, but it is better to be uninformed than to be mis-informed...