WEC 2025

Please discuss here all your remarks and pose your questions about all racing series, except Formula One. Both technical and other questions about GP2, Touring cars, IRL, LMS, ...
Farnborough
Farnborough
124
Joined: 18 Mar 2023, 14:15

Re: WEC 2025

Post

AR3-GP wrote:
18 Jun 2025, 03:02
It's a technical forum. I thought it would be interesting to show how one can prove that it was a performance advantage, despite what Ferrari has claimed.
“The subsequent loss of the remaining bolts during the final 37 minutes of the race provided no advantage in terms of performance or the final standings.

“The top speed of the number 50 499P reported by the Stewards in their decision was recorded during the car’s final seven laps while it was running in the slipstream of its sister car, the number 51 499P.

“With full confidence in those same regulations, even though the incident in question offered no competitive advantage to the crew, nor did it compromise the safety of our drivers or that of other competitors, Ferrari is already at work ahead of the next rounds of a season that resumes under the global spotlight in July, in Brazil.”
https://sportscar365.com/lemans/wec/fer ... ification/
Good data analysis AR3-GP.

That statement should be seen for what it is, a smokescreen in all it's finest delivery :D

A statement of the obvious would be .... well those bolts aren't there for nothing, and in a sport where all components are analysed for function over weight, performance etc, etc they're important in both the aspect the team say they are not offering advantage.

Scrutineering was rightly suspicious and acted accordingly.

Tvetovnato
Tvetovnato
2
Joined: 12 Mar 2021, 16:03

Re: WEC 2025

Post

So, time for Porsche and Toyota to drive with the pit lane speed limiter on for the remaining races while Ferrari secures the championship, so they will weigh 90 kgs less and with 150 more BHP in the first races next year.

dialtone
dialtone
123
Joined: 25 Feb 2019, 01:31

Re: WEC 2025

Post

Image

Well now it happened, Ferrari has the worst BoP, by some margin. Heaviest, low on stint energy, lowest power before 250.

No more excuses by other teams. If Ferrari still wins Sao Paolo, which I find impossible looking at this, every team loses the ability to complain, in fact if Toyota doesn’t just straight up gap Ferrari here they are clowns.

Tvetovnato
Tvetovnato
2
Joined: 12 Mar 2021, 16:03

Re: WEC 2025

Post

So, Cadillac on pole then and with the best pace overall. Good to know. Maybe they should wait to announce the BoP until after hyperpole so it becomes worth watching. Too much can happen in an 8 hour race for the result to be predictable in the end, but I’m more and more convinced that they need to scrap this format and put a cost cap in place with one set of technical regulations.

User avatar
AR3-GP
383
Joined: 06 Jul 2021, 01:22

Re: WEC 2025

Post

Tvetovnato wrote:
08 Jul 2025, 08:28
So, Cadillac on pole then and with the best pace overall. Good to know. Maybe they should wait to announce the BoP until after hyperpole so it becomes worth watching. Too much can happen in an 8 hour race for the result to be predictable in the end, but I’m more and more convinced that they need to scrap this format and put a cost cap in place with one set of technical regulations.
I don't think Cadillac will have it their way. They have said they expect a difficult weekend. The car does not suit a low-medium speed track like Sao Paolo. They need high speed corners to be quick. Sao Paolo eats tires and they have too much tire deg.

I think we are finally seeing the right balance between the LMDh cars and the LMH cars of Ferrari and Toyota. Ferrari and Toyota should always be heavier and with less power.
It doesn't turn.

Tvetovnato
Tvetovnato
2
Joined: 12 Mar 2021, 16:03

Re: WEC 2025

Post

I agree that on balance this seems good overall for now. But Cadillac has been fast since 2023 without getting things together, and don’t need additional help. They need to get their races together, that is all.

The problem now is that Porsche might win and have a strong end to the year, and create an illusion for the BoP setters that they need to be pegged back for the start of next year, and then we are restarting what we saw this year. Which means there is no reason for Porsche or any other LMDh to push that hard for the rest of the year so they can set themselves up for next year to maximise championship chances, as this year is already over. You can only lose by being too quick from now on.

dialtone
dialtone
123
Joined: 25 Feb 2019, 01:31

Re: WEC 2025

Post

AR3-GP wrote:
08 Jul 2025, 23:53
I think we are finally seeing the right balance between the LMDh cars and the LMH cars of Ferrari and Toyota. Ferrari and Toyota should always be heavier and with less power.
To still have this opinion after Porsche #6 finished 2nd in Lemans a few seconds off is just incomprehensible for me.

dialtone
dialtone
123
Joined: 25 Feb 2019, 01:31

Re: WEC 2025

Post

After 3 practice sessions it's really looking like Porsche is going to lap the field and Ferrari maybe can get a top 5 finish if they are absolutely perfect but in all likelihood they'll struggle to be in the top 10.

Not a Ferrari strong track to begin with and the BoP for this race has been quite a hit.

Even on a 1 lap pace Ferrari hasn't gone below 1:24 all weekend so far while while Porsche was in the 1:23.5s with BMW, Cadillac and today Toyota all set 1:23s. Aston Martin set a 1:24.0 in FP2, also faster than the Ferraris in any practice.

Hopefully Ferrari finds something for qualifying but it's looking pretty grim.

This analyzes FP1 and FP2:
https://www.onlyendurance.com/interlago ... its-close/

Fakepivot
Fakepivot
1
Joined: 13 Jul 2023, 10:19

Re: WEC 2025

Post

i think cota will be good for 499p, long Stright, high speed direction change.. but for once i would like fia to set similar bop for Toyota and ferrari and see which comes out on top..

dialtone
dialtone
123
Joined: 25 Feb 2019, 01:31

Re: WEC 2025

Post

Fakepivot wrote:i think cota will be good for 499p, long Stright, high speed direction change.. but for once i would like fia to set similar bop for Toyota and ferrari and see which comes out on top..
Doesn’t sound realistic with the heaviest and least powerful car on the grid with also the least stint energy available.

.poz
.poz
51
Joined: 08 Mar 2012, 16:44

Re: WEC 2025

Post

Image

dialtone
dialtone
123
Joined: 25 Feb 2019, 01:31

Re: WEC 2025

Post

Lmao 1s back. They’ll get lapped 3 or 4 times and all to satisfy Toyota that is still in the gutter, bunch of clowns.

Tvetovnato
Tvetovnato
2
Joined: 12 Mar 2021, 16:03

Re: WEC 2025

Post

Tvetovnato wrote:
08 Jul 2025, 08:28
So, Cadillac on pole then and with the best pace overall. Good to know. Maybe they should wait to announce the BoP until after hyperpole so it becomes worth watching. Too much can happen in an 8 hour race for the result to be predictable in the end, but I’m more and more convinced that they need to scrap this format and put a cost cap in place with one set of technical regulations.
And I was right, even a 1-2. What a failure of a BoP process.

Seanspeed
Seanspeed
6
Joined: 20 Feb 2019, 20:12

Re: WEC 2025

Post

Not like they haven't also been beneficiaries of the BoP nonsense at times.

Whole sport is an utter joke, at least by people who care about genuine sporting competition. But I get their dilemma - making it a more true competition would basically mean the death of the sport, or at least the top category(which is what 90% people actually care about).

dialtone
dialtone
123
Joined: 25 Feb 2019, 01:31

Re: WEC 2025

Post

Tvetovnato wrote:
Tvetovnato wrote:
08 Jul 2025, 08:28
So, Cadillac on pole then and with the best pace overall. Good to know. Maybe they should wait to announce the BoP until after hyperpole so it becomes worth watching. Too much can happen in an 8 hour race for the result to be predictable in the end, but I’m more and more convinced that they need to scrap this format and put a cost cap in place with one set of technical regulations.
And I was right, even a 1-2. What a failure of a BoP process.
They will fall back as their tire management is among the worst on the grid.

This is porsche’s race to lose, easy 1-2 for them with the 3rd probably a lap behind if the times from free practice are an indication.

I most certainly don’t understand how almost every brand had a period of bad bop but porsche basically is never really punished by it despite obviously showing good pace every race.

It is what it is, I sure hope they update how the bop works for next year, creating swings like these doesn’t feel intentional.

At the moment it doesn’t seem to consider the track where they race in the equation, nor it learns anything from the most recent races even if they use them. Ironically the Lemans bop that everyone complained about was the best one for the top 3 teams relatively, and spa was good between ferrari and the rest. In season it should be possible to learn enough that you progressively get to a good place and start limit the changes amplitude, having swings like these after 4 races is crazy.