Formula 2 plans to change engine brand supplier + all-new engine layout and sustainable fuels from 2024-2026

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theriusDR3
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Formula 2 plans to change engine brand supplier + all-new engine layout and sustainable fuels from 2024-2026

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The current Dallara F2 2018 machine

Formula 2 to totally revamp the machinery for the 2024-2026 seasons cycle.

FIA plans new Formula 2 engine to run on sustainable fuel from 2024

Formula 2

Posted on 10th August 2022, 12:50 | Written by Ida Wood

The FIA has issued an invitation for engine manufacturers to tender for a contract to supply new power units to the Formula 2 championship from 2024 to 2026.

Formula 1’s leading support series uses 3.4-litre V6 engines which are limited to 8,750rpm. These have been supplied by French manufacturer Mecachrome since the current formula was introduced in 2018, when the series also adopted its current Dallara F2 2018 chassis.
Both chassis and engine had their use extended from their initial three-year cycle for another three seasons. However reliability problems have dogged the current iteration of cars during the first four-and-a-half years of use. Some drivers have gone through more than six engines in a season.

F1 intends to run its cars on sustainable fuel from 2026. Prior to that the product will be tested in F2’s current engine and introduced to the championship in 2024 as a 55% mix.

The new engine must be developed to not only run on that fuel but also be capable of running 100% sustainable fuel in later seasons. The tender specifications further state the engine should be able to accept F1’s current 10% ethanol E10 fuel in case it is needed as a “fall-back solution”.

The FIA’s tender document for the new F2 engine also specifies a lifespan of 10,000 kilometres, which should include dyno hours. A target weight of less than 150 kilograms has been set, meaning the new engine could end up being heavier than the current 132kg unit, albeit with a 10bhp power increase, giving drivers up to 630bhp.

The invitation to tender indicates the successful bidder will either be contracted for a three-year cycle or signed to six seasons with an option triggered by F2’s promoter Formula Motorsport Limited and the FIA. All interested engine builders “are invited to confirm that they would be prepared to accept such term/extension if required” by the submission deadline of September 2nd.

Other requirements for interested builders include having the ability to “obtain the FIA Environmental Accreditation at least at a 2-star level” during the years of the contract, although the FIA “will evaluate offers even if not meeting all requirements” it has set out.

It is not mentioned in the invitation to tender when F2 will introduce a new chassis, but the dimensions specified for the new engine indicate it would need to fit into the current chassis for testing.

Source: RaceFans.net


So it means current Formula 2 engine supply with Mecachrome brand will concluded after 2023 season if in case Mecachrome does not renew their engine supply contract. Who will replace Mecachrome as an official standard Formula 2 engine supplier from 2024-2026?

johnny comelately
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Re: Formula 2 plans to change engine brand supplier + all-new engine layout and sustainable fuels from 2024-2026

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Well, we have to pray to the god Benzeno this type of prescription does not become de rigueur for Formula One.
It would stifle innovation, which suffers enough under the current over-regulated formula.
IMHO.

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coaster
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Re: Formula 2 plans to change engine brand supplier + all-new engine layout and sustainable fuels from 2024-2026

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These F2 cars were the test bed for the tire rim diameter changes on the same chassis with subtle changes, im suprised no thread emerged contemplating the finer design changes and adjustments.

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Honda Porsche fan
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Re: Formula 2 plans to change engine brand supplier + all-new engine layout and sustainable fuels from 2024-2026

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2.0 liter V4 engines similar to Porsche's 2017 919 Hybrid.

I think V4's are the future just like MotoGP.

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FW17
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Re: Formula 2 plans to change engine brand supplier + all-new engine layout and sustainable fuels from 2024-2026

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I would have thought they would have gone the Dakar hybrid way. A range extender engine which dives a generator and battery while motor generator and battery would drive the rear wheels.

Could be expensive but they could have shared technology with FE on the motor and battery bits.

The engine could have been made incredible light being a non load bearing member and designed to run at a constant speed, something like 40kgs as seen in a Nissan.

Tommy Cookers
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Re: Formula 2 plans to change engine brand supplier + all-new engine layout and sustainable fuels from 2024-2026

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FW17 wrote:
Sat Jan 21, 2023 4:38 am
I would have thought they would have gone the Dakar hybrid way. A range extender engine which dives a generator and battery while motor generator and battery would drive the rear wheels.
Could be expensive but they could have shared technology with FE on the motor and battery bits.
The engine could have been made incredible light being a non load bearing member and designed to run at a constant speed, something like 40kgs as seen in a Nissan.
in essence F1 has the 8 speed gearbox to run both ICE and importantly MGU-K at rather constant speed and torque

the scheme quoted would pay an electrical cost for not having a gearbox

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FW17
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Re: Formula 2 plans to change engine brand supplier + all-new engine layout and sustainable fuels from 2024-2026

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=P~
Tommy Cookers wrote:
Sat Jan 21, 2023 12:23 pm
FW17 wrote:
Sat Jan 21, 2023 4:38 am
I would have thought they would have gone the Dakar hybrid way. A range extender engine which dives a generator and battery while motor generator and battery would drive the rear wheels.
Could be expensive but they could have shared technology with FE on the motor and battery bits.
The engine could have been made incredible light being a non load bearing member and designed to run at a constant speed, something like 40kgs as seen in a Nissan.
in essence F1 has the 8 speed gearbox to run both ICE and importantly MGU-K at rather constant speed and torque

the scheme quoted would pay an electrical cost for not having a gearbox

You totally lost me

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JordanMugen
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Re: Formula 2 plans to change engine brand supplier + all-new engine layout and sustainable fuels from 2024-2026

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FW17 wrote:
Sat Jan 21, 2023 4:38 am
I would have thought they would have gone the Dakar hybrid way. A range extender engine which dives a generator and battery while motor generator and battery would drive the rear wheels.
I would like the opposite.

It's Formula 2, can't we just put a simple, reliable, nice sounding naturally aspirated V8 in them?

The Formula 3 cars sound good because they are naturally aspirated and raspy (and they are reliable AFAIK), so why not make at least two of the three FIA Formula categories (F3 & F2) naturally aspirated and pleasing to the fans' ears?

What did F2 gain by going from the naturally aspirated V8 to the turbo V6? Nothing (expect for unreliability). The F2 V6 even has turbo lag which was not relevant to drivers making the step to lag-free hybridised F1 power units.

So don't be too proud, just change it back to the good old 10,000rpm V8s I say (whether the supplier is Mechachrome or AER or Judd or Cosworth or whoever, perhaps not Gibson as their LMP2 control engine sounds terrible for whatever reason!).

As much as a generator running constantly at the optimal rpm would be efficient, it would probably put a lot of spectators off (a lot of which are not ready to move on from traditional ICEs with rising and falling rpm) as similar "CVT drone" is already disliked by many.

Honda Porsche fan wrote:
Fri Jan 20, 2023 11:01 pm
2.0 liter V4 engines similar to Porsche's 2017 919 Hybrid.

I think V4's are the future just like MotoGP.
If a one litre naturally aspirated engine should be a V4 (possibly only used as one litre V5s were used and then banned on the move to 800cc and not reinstated on the move back to 1000cc, and V6 four strokes were never allowed by the rules in first place), then surely a two litre naturally aspirated engine should be a V8? ;)

Granted F1's last V8s were actually 2.4L, while F2 used a destressed 4.0L, up from the original 3.0L of F3000.

NL_Fer
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Re: Formula 2 plans to change engine brand supplier + all-new engine layout and sustainable fuels from 2024-2026

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How about that Audi i4 2.0 they build for the former DTM class?

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FW17
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Re: Formula 2 plans to change engine brand supplier + all-new engine layout and sustainable fuels from 2024-2026

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NL_Fer wrote:
Sat Jan 21, 2023 4:16 pm
How about that Audi i4 2.0 they build for the former DTM class?
Because FIA wants the whole song and dance of a tender.

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Honda Porsche fan
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Re: Formula 2 plans to change engine brand supplier + all-new engine layout and sustainable fuels from 2024-2026

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JordanMugen wrote:
Sat Jan 21, 2023 3:55 pm

Honda Porsche fan wrote:
Fri Jan 20, 2023 11:01 pm
2.0 liter V4 engines similar to Porsche's 2017 919 Hybrid.

I think V4's are the future just like MotoGP.
If a one litre naturally aspirated engine should be a V4 (possibly only used as one litre V5s were used and then banned on the move to 800cc and not reinstated on the move back to 1000cc, and V6 four strokes were never allowed by the rules in first place), then surely a two litre naturally aspirated engine should be a V8? ;)

Granted F1's last V8s were actually 2.4L, while F2 used a destressed 4.0L, up from the original 3.0L of F3000.
I personally like V8's like the 2.65 liter V8's used in CART/Champ Car in the 1990's and early 2000's. They were turbo and ran on methanol.

I just think automakers should progress with trying to get as much power and efficiency as possible from the smallest engine within reason. I was really impressed with Porsche's 919 Hybrid and MotoGP V4's.

I think 1 liter or 2 liter V4's would be cool in F1, F2, Indycar and Super Formula Japan.

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coaster
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Re: Formula 2 plans to change engine brand supplier + all-new engine layout and sustainable fuels from 2024-2026

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The short stroke, narrow valve angle was the zenith of design perfected in the 1990's.
Trouble is, what else is left to design?
Were just going in circles with redesigning the winning design.

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Honda Porsche fan
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coaster wrote:
Mon Jan 23, 2023 3:37 am
The short stroke, narrow valve angle was the zenith of design perfected in the 1990's.
Trouble is, what else is left to design?
Were just going in circles with redesigning the winning design.
I think there is more to discover in the internal combustion engine...

Combustion and self ignition - Honda High Speed Combustion and Self Ignition.
Secondary controlled combustion (bangs under braking)
Anti-lag (2019-2020 Honda MGU-H)
Charge Air Cooler - CAC Bypass 2 - Honda RA621H.

Variable valve lift and exhaust valve timing.

Fuel technology - Fully synthetic fuels.

toraabe
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Re: Formula 2 plans to change engine brand supplier + all-new engine layout and sustainable fuels from 2024-2026

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Ok. Why not electro pneumatic valves instead of camshaft. Then you can map the duration and opening perfectly to throttle, rpm, and turbo boost..

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toraabe wrote:
Tue Jan 24, 2023 4:37 pm
Ok. Why not electro pneumatic valves instead of camshaft. Then you can map the duration and opening perfectly to throttle, rpm, and turbo boost..
I like that idea, but don't electro pneumatic valves have a rev ceiling of around 7.000 rpm?