2022 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

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Tiny73
Tiny73
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Re: 2022 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

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SiLo wrote:
Mon Jan 23, 2023 1:58 pm
mendis wrote:
Mon Jan 23, 2023 12:28 pm
Tiny73 wrote:
Mon Jan 23, 2023 11:58 am
I think you’re underestimating the power of the LH brand, that’s why they pay top dollar, same as Tom Brady, Ronald, Messi amongst others.
From a business standpoint, I don't understand how Mercedes is going to benefit out of Lewis' marketability or his brand. Mercedes is a massive brand and caters to a certain elite segment in the automobile market. I don't know if some of Mercedes' customers want Lewis to deliver their newly purchased car as he is 7 time WDC. Most brands chase successful F1 team for sponsoring. If Mercedes doesn't win for another couple of years, sponsors disappear even if Lewis is there in the team. That's how it works.

A driver's commercial viability for an F1 team is purely performance oriented. Brands did not throng at Mercedes in 2010-12, despite having a 7 time WDC driving for them. When they started winning, they started making fortune from sponsor deals that not just covered the F1 expenses, but gave profitability, despite their annual F1 spending in the range of 500 million a year.

Red Bull is back to winning ways and they started attracting mega millions sponsor deals.

I have no doubt if Mercedes creates another car with 3 to 5 tenths advantage, even Russell can win championships and the sponsors would flow in thick and fast even if Lewis disappears from the scene.

Marketability works for individual athletes. The more success they get, more marketable they become. Marketability of the driver is no reason for an F1 team to offer fortune deals. It's the speed and how long that speed is going to persist. The younger and faster, the more valuable.
I'll hazard a guess that having him with the team generates a huge amount of merchandise sales, as well as massive amounts of exposure simply by association. Mercedes won't pay him if they don't think hes worth it.
Exactly this. Lewis is a brand and (at present) that brand has a significant value attached to it. Man U paid Ronaldo an eye watering salary because they knew the off pitch merch sales would warrant it rather than on field success (which, as a Utd fan I’ll concede has been awful in the last years).

I do t think Lewis is of value to Daimler Mercedes as a brand so much but to the Merc F1 team he categorically is, for now. Good point about Schumacher’s time there but at that point the 7-time world champion was not winning and nor were the team.

mendis
mendis
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Joined: Sun Jul 03, 2022 3:12 pm

Re: 2022 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

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SiLo wrote:
Mon Jan 23, 2023 1:58 pm
mendis wrote:
Mon Jan 23, 2023 12:28 pm
Tiny73 wrote:
Mon Jan 23, 2023 11:58 am
I think you’re underestimating the power of the LH brand, that’s why they pay top dollar, same as Tom Brady, Ronald, Messi amongst others.
From a business standpoint, I don't understand how Mercedes is going to benefit out of Lewis' marketability or his brand. Mercedes is a massive brand and caters to a certain elite segment in the automobile market. I don't know if some of Mercedes' customers want Lewis to deliver their newly purchased car as he is 7 time WDC. Most brands chase successful F1 team for sponsoring. If Mercedes doesn't win for another couple of years, sponsors disappear even if Lewis is there in the team. That's how it works.

A driver's commercial viability for an F1 team is purely performance oriented. Brands did not throng at Mercedes in 2010-12, despite having a 7 time WDC driving for them. When they started winning, they started making fortune from sponsor deals that not just covered the F1 expenses, but gave profitability, despite their annual F1 spending in the range of 500 million a year.

Red Bull is back to winning ways and they started attracting mega millions sponsor deals.

I have no doubt if Mercedes creates another car with 3 to 5 tenths advantage, even Russell can win championships and the sponsors would flow in thick and fast even if Lewis disappears from the scene.

Marketability works for individual athletes. The more success they get, more marketable they become. Marketability of the driver is no reason for an F1 team to offer fortune deals. It's the speed and how long that speed is going to persist. The younger and faster, the more valuable.
I'll hazard a guess that having him with the team generates a huge amount of merchandise sales, as well as massive amounts of exposure simply by association. Mercedes won't pay him if they don't think hes worth it.
FYI. McLaren stills sells way higher merchandise than Mercedes does, on the basis of their financial statements. If you have a look at the financial statements under "Sale of Goods" section, McLaren continues to be registering higher number than Mercedes. It might also contains various other "Goods", but there is no seperate section for registering "Merchandise Sales" in the financial statement.

mendis
mendis
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Joined: Sun Jul 03, 2022 3:12 pm

Re: 2022 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

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Tiny73 wrote:
Mon Jan 23, 2023 2:24 pm
Good point about Schumacher’s time there but at that point the 7-time world champion was not winning and nor were the team.
That's the precise point. Success of the team is what draws sponsor money, not an individual per se, in a team sport. Replace the name Hamilton with Alonso or Vettel at Mercedes' success, their merchandise revenues doesn't change. Like I said, if Mercedes doesn't win titles while Lewis is still part of the team, sponsorship revenues start going down. His status as 7 time WDC will not hold back the sponsors. I am only arguing the financial aspects of a driver/team remuneration and viability of it, and not Lewis' driving skills here.

Alonso was a big star in 2007 and at the end of it, he was negotiating with many teams to quit McLaren and Red Bull was one of them. They were an aspiring team back then, but many factors, including the remuneration didn't work out for Alonso and he turned down the offer. A young, not yet a highly marketable driver stepped in and won 4 titles. Loads of money flew in to Red Bull via the sponsors. Was Red Bull at loss for losing Alonso, on the basis of cost factor?

harty71
harty71
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Re: 2022 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

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Tiny73 wrote:
Mon Jan 23, 2023 2:24 pm
SiLo wrote:
Mon Jan 23, 2023 1:58 pm
mendis wrote:
Mon Jan 23, 2023 12:28 pm
From a business standpoint, I don't understand how Mercedes is going to benefit out of Lewis' marketability or his brand. Mercedes is a massive brand and caters to a certain elite segment in the automobile market. I don't know if some of Mercedes' customers want Lewis to deliver their newly purchased car as he is 7 time WDC. Most brands chase successful F1 team for sponsoring. If Mercedes doesn't win for another couple of years, sponsors disappear even if Lewis is there in the team. That's how it works.

A driver's commercial viability for an F1 team is purely performance oriented. Brands did not throng at Mercedes in 2010-12, despite having a 7 time WDC driving for them. When they started winning, they started making fortune from sponsor deals that not just covered the F1 expenses, but gave profitability, despite their annual F1 spending in the range of 500 million a year.

Red Bull is back to winning ways and they started attracting mega millions sponsor deals.

I have no doubt if Mercedes creates another car with 3 to 5 tenths advantage, even Russell can win championships and the sponsors would flow in thick and fast even if Lewis disappears from the scene.

Marketability works for individual athletes. The more success they get, more marketable they become. Marketability of the driver is no reason for an F1 team to offer fortune deals. It's the speed and how long that speed is going to persist. The younger and faster, the more valuable.
I'll hazard a guess that having him with the team generates a huge amount of merchandise sales, as well as massive amounts of exposure simply by association. Mercedes won't pay him if they don't think hes worth it.
Exactly this. Lewis is a brand and (at present) that brand has a significant value attached to it. Man U paid Ronaldo an eye watering salary because they knew the off pitch merch sales would warrant it rather than on field success (which, as a Utd fan I’ll concede has been awful in the last years).

I do t think Lewis is of value to Daimler Mercedes as a brand so much but to the Merc F1 team he categorically is, for now. Good point about Schumacher’s time there but at that point the 7-time world champion was not winning and nor were the team.
<personal stuff removed>

As for Hamilton, I certainly wouldn't be paying the wages he demands. Russell is the future of the team and is very capable of leading it. If I were them I'd be looking to be in a youngster to partner him.

AR3-GP
AR3-GP
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Joined: Tue Jul 06, 2021 12:22 am

Re: 2022 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

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Ultimately, Hamilton's salary comes out of respect. People should realize that if Mercedes low-balled him (say 10 million a year), he would still drive for them because at the end of the day, he needs Mercedes to win more races. Ferrari and Red Bull wouldn't take him and there are no other options but to retire.

So Mercedes are the ones with all the power and the cards now that they have GR in the wings and are the only realistic seat for Hamilton. The fact that they would still be willing to pay him more, rather than low ball him just shows they respect and value him very much.

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SiLo
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Joined: Sun Jul 25, 2010 6:09 pm

Re: 2022 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

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AR3-GP wrote:
Tue Jan 24, 2023 6:18 am
Ultimately, Hamilton's salary comes out of respect. People should realize that if Mercedes low-balled him (say 10 million a year), he would still drive for them because at the end of the day, he needs Mercedes to win more races. Ferrari and Red Bull wouldn't take him and there are no other options but to retire.

So Mercedes are the ones with all the power and the cards now that they have GR in the wings and are the only realistic seat for Hamilton. The fact that they would still be willing to pay him more, rather than low ball him just shows they respect and value him very much.
Also, it's not our money, so what the hell do we care? Let the man get paid.
Felipe Baby!

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ringo
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Joined: Sun Mar 29, 2009 9:57 am

Re: 2022 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

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mendis wrote:
Mon Jan 23, 2023 12:28 pm
Tiny73 wrote:
Mon Jan 23, 2023 11:58 am
I think you’re underestimating the power of the LH brand, that’s why they pay top dollar, same as Tom Brady, Ronald, Messi amongst others.
From a business standpoint, I don't understand how Mercedes is going to benefit out of Lewis' marketability or his brand. Mercedes is a massive brand and caters to a certain elite segment in the automobile market. I don't know if some of Mercedes' customers want Lewis to deliver their newly purchased car as he is 7 time WDC. Most brands chase successful F1 team for sponsoring. If Mercedes doesn't win for another couple of years, sponsors disappear even if Lewis is there in the team. That's how it works.

A driver's commercial viability for an F1 team is purely performance oriented. Brands did not throng at Mercedes in 2010-12, despite having a 7 time WDC driving for them. When they started winning, they started making fortune from sponsor deals that not just covered the F1 expenses, but gave profitability, despite their annual F1 spending in the range of 500 million a year.

Red Bull is back to winning ways and they started attracting mega millions sponsor deals.

I have no doubt if Mercedes creates another car with 3 to 5 tenths advantage, even Russell can win championships and the sponsors would flow in thick and fast even if Lewis disappears from the scene.

Marketability works for individual athletes. The more success they get, more marketable they become. Marketability of the driver is no reason for an F1 team to offer fortune deals. It's the speed and how long that speed is going to persist. The younger and faster, the more valuable.
What do you think happens when Mercedes and Lewis Hamilton has 8 driver WC?

Hamilton becomes the undisputed GOAT, and mercedes becomes the undisputed F-1 engine goat, as they powered him to those 8 championships.
Already the AMG One success is mostly to do with Hamilton. A lot of mercedes sports cars sales and desirability was driven by Hamilton's success in F-1. Even in the Nico Rosberg and Shumacher days, the cars didn't have the same pull.
Hamilton has indirectly increased desirability of the mercedes cars as sports cars.
8 championships benefits both, but helps mercedes more than Hamilton. If mercedes don't give Hamilton what he wants, he walks away and they never get the opportunity to be the GOAT for the next decade or more.
For Sure!!

mendis
mendis
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Joined: Sun Jul 03, 2022 3:12 pm

Re: 2022 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

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ringo wrote:
Tue Jan 24, 2023 4:34 pm
mendis wrote:
Mon Jan 23, 2023 12:28 pm
Tiny73 wrote:
Mon Jan 23, 2023 11:58 am
I think you’re underestimating the power of the LH brand, that’s why they pay top dollar, same as Tom Brady, Ronald, Messi amongst others.
From a business standpoint, I don't understand how Mercedes is going to benefit out of Lewis' marketability or his brand. Mercedes is a massive brand and caters to a certain elite segment in the automobile market. I don't know if some of Mercedes' customers want Lewis to deliver their newly purchased car as he is 7 time WDC. Most brands chase successful F1 team for sponsoring. If Mercedes doesn't win for another couple of years, sponsors disappear even if Lewis is there in the team. That's how it works.

A driver's commercial viability for an F1 team is purely performance oriented. Brands did not throng at Mercedes in 2010-12, despite having a 7 time WDC driving for them. When they started winning, they started making fortune from sponsor deals that not just covered the F1 expenses, but gave profitability, despite their annual F1 spending in the range of 500 million a year.

Red Bull is back to winning ways and they started attracting mega millions sponsor deals.

I have no doubt if Mercedes creates another car with 3 to 5 tenths advantage, even Russell can win championships and the sponsors would flow in thick and fast even if Lewis disappears from the scene.

Marketability works for individual athletes. The more success they get, more marketable they become. Marketability of the driver is no reason for an F1 team to offer fortune deals. It's the speed and how long that speed is going to persist. The younger and faster, the more valuable.
What do you think happens when Mercedes and Lewis Hamilton has 8 driver WC?
It would be same if George wins his first. Like I already mentioned, success brings sponsors, regardless of whether a 7 time WDC becomes 8 or newbee gets crowned. Equally, if success evades for another year, sponsorship money would drain, even if they have a 7 time WDC in the stable as someone else that is winning, would attract them.

ringo wrote:
Tue Jan 24, 2023 4:34 pm
Already the AMG One success is mostly to do with Hamilton. A lot of mercedes sports cars sales and desirability was driven by Hamilton's success in F-1. Even in the Nico Rosberg and Shumacher days, the cars didn't have the same pull.
Hamilton has indirectly increased desirability of the mercedes cars as sports cars.
I am not sure how much you have followed the Project One. But here are a few nuggets.

The Project One got announced in 2016! But it was in the pipeline for about a year before.

https://www.motortrend.com/news/mercede ... een-light/
https://www.topspeed.com/cars/mercedes/ ... oject-one/

https://www.thedrive.com/news/39057/her ... g-to-build
n 2017, less than a year after the announcement and just before the Nürburgring 24 Hours, we had an early chance to take a look at the AMG Project One's chassis, including its 1.6-liter V6 turbo, complex exhaust, battery packs, electric motors and pushrod suspension. Check out what that early rolling chassis mockup looked like:
Second, the brain behind Project One was Tobias Moers.

https://www.cnet.com/roadshow/news/proj ... interview/
The idea itself was birthed back in October of 2015, just two years ago, a remarkably rapid turn-around for a car that looks set to reset performance benchmarks and redefine the term "racecar for the road." I sat down with Tobias Moers, chairman of the board of management for Mercedes-AMG, about how it all came together.

'Something special'
"We wanted to do something special for the 50th anniversary," Moers told me in a quiet spot away from bustling Mercedes-Benz booth at the 2017 Frankfurt Motor Show. The nice thing about anniversaries is that you know they're coming well in advance. The bad thing, though, is that they tend to be pretty inflexible, so the team needed to have something ready to show this year, at this show, and that something had to be a hypercar.
They planned only 275 units of it and all of that was sold out, before they could produce it!

https://www.guideautoweb.com/en/article ... tion-form/
“The team at AMG and the [AMG] High Performance Powertrain Formula 1 arm came to us about four years ago and said ‘we’ve got a great idea, let’s put a Formula 1 engine into a road car’. I will have to go back to check the meeting minutes, but I’m sure we were drunk when we said yes,” Mercedes-Benz CEO Ola Källenius joked a short while ago, as quoted by British website Autocar.
Ascribing Project One's genesys or it's progress or success (?) to Lewis is a far stretched idea to build his commercial viability for Mercedes, which can influence a hefty pay packet. Mercedes is an established global name and their brand's success in F1 is enough to propel their sales and brand image. Lewis does add to it, but as a small part. Does that warrant the kind of rumored remuneration he is negotiating for? I don't think so, but other can have different opinions.

Mosin123
Mosin123
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Joined: Tue Oct 11, 2022 4:03 pm

Re: 2022 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

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mendis wrote:
Tue Jan 24, 2023 5:02 pm
ringo wrote:
Tue Jan 24, 2023 4:34 pm
mendis wrote:
Mon Jan 23, 2023 12:28 pm
From a business standpoint, I don't understand how Mercedes is going to benefit out of Lewis' marketability or his brand. Mercedes is a massive brand and caters to a certain elite segment in the automobile market. I don't know if some of Mercedes' customers want Lewis to deliver their newly purchased car as he is 7 time WDC. Most brands chase successful F1 team for sponsoring. If Mercedes doesn't win for another couple of years, sponsors disappear even if Lewis is there in the team. That's how it works.

A driver's commercial viability for an F1 team is purely performance oriented. Brands did not throng at Mercedes in 2010-12, despite having a 7 time WDC driving for them. When they started winning, they started making fortune from sponsor deals that not just covered the F1 expenses, but gave profitability, despite their annual F1 spending in the range of 500 million a year.

Red Bull is back to winning ways and they started attracting mega millions sponsor deals.

I have no doubt if Mercedes creates another car with 3 to 5 tenths advantage, even Russell can win championships and the sponsors would flow in thick and fast even if Lewis disappears from the scene.

Marketability works for individual athletes. The more success they get, more marketable they become. Marketability of the driver is no reason for an F1 team to offer fortune deals. It's the speed and how long that speed is going to persist. The younger and faster, the more valuable.
What do you think happens when Mercedes and Lewis Hamilton has 8 driver WC?
It would be same if George wins his first. Like I already mentioned, success brings sponsors, regardless of whether a 7 time WDC becomes 8 or newbee gets crowned. Equally, if success evades for another year, sponsorship money would drain, even if they have a 7 time WDC in the stable as someone else that is winning, would attract them.

ringo wrote:
Tue Jan 24, 2023 4:34 pm
Already the AMG One success is mostly to do with Hamilton. A lot of mercedes sports cars sales and desirability was driven by Hamilton's success in F-1. Even in the Nico Rosberg and Shumacher days, the cars didn't have the same pull.
Hamilton has indirectly increased desirability of the mercedes cars as sports cars.
I am not sure how much you have followed the Project One. But here are a few nuggets.

The Project One got announced in 2016! But it was in the pipeline for about a year before.

https://www.motortrend.com/news/mercede ... een-light/
https://www.topspeed.com/cars/mercedes/ ... oject-one/

https://www.thedrive.com/news/39057/her ... g-to-build
n 2017, less than a year after the announcement and just before the Nürburgring 24 Hours, we had an early chance to take a look at the AMG Project One's chassis, including its 1.6-liter V6 turbo, complex exhaust, battery packs, electric motors and pushrod suspension. Check out what that early rolling chassis mockup looked like:
Second, the brain behind Project One was Tobias Moers.

https://www.cnet.com/roadshow/news/proj ... interview/
The idea itself was birthed back in October of 2015, just two years ago, a remarkably rapid turn-around for a car that looks set to reset performance benchmarks and redefine the term "racecar for the road." I sat down with Tobias Moers, chairman of the board of management for Mercedes-AMG, about how it all came together.

'Something special'
"We wanted to do something special for the 50th anniversary," Moers told me in a quiet spot away from bustling Mercedes-Benz booth at the 2017 Frankfurt Motor Show. The nice thing about anniversaries is that you know they're coming well in advance. The bad thing, though, is that they tend to be pretty inflexible, so the team needed to have something ready to show this year, at this show, and that something had to be a hypercar.
They planned only 275 units of it and all of that was sold out, before they could produce it!

https://www.guideautoweb.com/en/article ... tion-form/
“The team at AMG and the [AMG] High Performance Powertrain Formula 1 arm came to us about four years ago and said ‘we’ve got a great idea, let’s put a Formula 1 engine into a road car’. I will have to go back to check the meeting minutes, but I’m sure we were drunk when we said yes,” Mercedes-Benz CEO Ola Källenius joked a short while ago, as quoted by British website Autocar.
Ascribing Project One's genesys or it's progress or success (?) to Lewis is a far stretched idea to build his commercial viability for Mercedes, which can influence a hefty pay packet. Mercedes is an established global name and their brand's success in F1 is enough to propel their sales and brand image. Lewis does add to it, but as a small part. Does that warrant the kind of rumored remuneration he is negotiating for? I don't think so, but other can have different opinions.
I dont remember other teams losing sponsors because Merc won every thing for years.... you sure it has any influence ?

Would sponsoring the brand not come before being champion? only one team can be champion after all, Ferrari havent won for ages yet are still the most sponsored team on the grid

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chrisc90
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Re: 2022 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

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The selling of the AMG-one wouldn’t have been helped by Lewis in the slightest. Look at all the big manufacturers knocking out limited runs. People with a lot of money will just go out and buy one - simply because they can. Ferrari FXX, Porsche, Aston martins, Bugatti to name a couple. How many of those have been sold because a race driver said to go and buy one? None.

Anything of a limited run - and that nature - will always keep its value and you will get the rich kids buying them because they have a few million quid spare to blow on a fancy car
No Mikey Noo! No! Nooo Mikey! That was sooo not riiight!!

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ringo
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Re: 2022 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

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mendis wrote:
Tue Jan 24, 2023 5:02 pm
ringo wrote:
Tue Jan 24, 2023 4:34 pm
mendis wrote:
Mon Jan 23, 2023 12:28 pm
From a business standpoint, I don't understand how Mercedes is going to benefit out of Lewis' marketability or his brand. Mercedes is a massive brand and caters to a certain elite segment in the automobile market. I don't know if some of Mercedes' customers want Lewis to deliver their newly purchased car as he is 7 time WDC. Most brands chase successful F1 team for sponsoring. If Mercedes doesn't win for another couple of years, sponsors disappear even if Lewis is there in the team. That's how it works.

A driver's commercial viability for an F1 team is purely performance oriented. Brands did not throng at Mercedes in 2010-12, despite having a 7 time WDC driving for them. When they started winning, they started making fortune from sponsor deals that not just covered the F1 expenses, but gave profitability, despite their annual F1 spending in the range of 500 million a year.

Red Bull is back to winning ways and they started attracting mega millions sponsor deals.

I have no doubt if Mercedes creates another car with 3 to 5 tenths advantage, even Russell can win championships and the sponsors would flow in thick and fast even if Lewis disappears from the scene.

Marketability works for individual athletes. The more success they get, more marketable they become. Marketability of the driver is no reason for an F1 team to offer fortune deals. It's the speed and how long that speed is going to persist. The younger and faster, the more valuable.
What do you think happens when Mercedes and Lewis Hamilton has 8 driver WC?
It would be same if George wins his first. Like I already mentioned, success brings sponsors, regardless of whether a 7 time WDC becomes 8 or newbee gets crowned. Equally, if success evades for another year, sponsorship money would drain, even if they have a 7 time WDC in the stable as someone else that is winning, would attract them.

ringo wrote:
Tue Jan 24, 2023 4:34 pm
Already the AMG One success is mostly to do with Hamilton. A lot of mercedes sports cars sales and desirability was driven by Hamilton's success in F-1. Even in the Nico Rosberg and Shumacher days, the cars didn't have the same pull.
Hamilton has indirectly increased desirability of the mercedes cars as sports cars.
I am not sure how much you have followed the Project One. But here are a few nuggets.

The Project One got announced in 2016! But it was in the pipeline for about a year before.

https://www.motortrend.com/news/mercede ... een-light/
https://www.topspeed.com/cars/mercedes/ ... oject-one/

https://www.thedrive.com/news/39057/her ... g-to-build
n 2017, less than a year after the announcement and just before the Nürburgring 24 Hours, we had an early chance to take a look at the AMG Project One's chassis, including its 1.6-liter V6 turbo, complex exhaust, battery packs, electric motors and pushrod suspension. Check out what that early rolling chassis mockup looked like:
Second, the brain behind Project One was Tobias Moers.

https://www.cnet.com/roadshow/news/proj ... interview/
The idea itself was birthed back in October of 2015, just two years ago, a remarkably rapid turn-around for a car that looks set to reset performance benchmarks and redefine the term "racecar for the road." I sat down with Tobias Moers, chairman of the board of management for Mercedes-AMG, about how it all came together.

'Something special'
"We wanted to do something special for the 50th anniversary," Moers told me in a quiet spot away from bustling Mercedes-Benz booth at the 2017 Frankfurt Motor Show. The nice thing about anniversaries is that you know they're coming well in advance. The bad thing, though, is that they tend to be pretty inflexible, so the team needed to have something ready to show this year, at this show, and that something had to be a hypercar.
They planned only 275 units of it and all of that was sold out, before they could produce it!

https://www.guideautoweb.com/en/article ... tion-form/
“The team at AMG and the [AMG] High Performance Powertrain Formula 1 arm came to us about four years ago and said ‘we’ve got a great idea, let’s put a Formula 1 engine into a road car’. I will have to go back to check the meeting minutes, but I’m sure we were drunk when we said yes,” Mercedes-Benz CEO Ola Källenius joked a short while ago, as quoted by British website Autocar.
Ascribing Project One's genesys or it's progress or success (?) to Lewis is a far stretched idea to build his commercial viability for Mercedes, which can influence a hefty pay packet. Mercedes is an established global name and their brand's success in F1 is enough to propel their sales and brand image. Lewis does add to it, but as a small part. Does that warrant the kind of rumored remuneration he is negotiating for? I don't think so, but other can have different opinions.
I wont argue with you. But if you think Hamilton has not influenced Mercedes sales in any way shape or form, then there is nothing i can say to convince you. I guess Mercedes joined F1 with Shumacher in 2010 had nothing to do with selling cars. And bringing Lewis in 2013 and winning with him 6 times had nothing to do with selling cars. It's just to go racing! :mrgreen:

And Senna driving the NSX had nothing to do with sales..



Cars arent only bought by f1 nerds. There are normal people with money that will buy a car because of its association with a driver.
Senna, Shumacher, Lauda, Makinen etc.
Normal surface level fans attach sentiment to sports cars associated with the drivers who win the championships. An AMG One will be marketed by mention of Hamilton. Hamilton won 2 championships prior to 2016 season. Mercedes would not have considersd to make the AMG One if not for Hamilton's 2 championships. Rosberg's came at the end of 2016, after the idea. Customers will associate the success of the f1 engine powered road car with hamilton; afterall he legitimizes the F1 pedigree. There is no getting around that. If he wins 8 championships with mercedes, i will not be suprised if there is another mega car created and marketed tge heck out of because of that success.
Last edited by ringo on Thu Jan 26, 2023 1:26 am, edited 2 times in total.
For Sure!!

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organic
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Joined: Sat Jan 08, 2022 1:24 am
Location: Cambridge, UK

Re: 2022 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

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ringo wrote:
Tue Jan 24, 2023 4:34 pm
mendis wrote:
Mon Jan 23, 2023 12:28 pm
Tiny73 wrote:
Mon Jan 23, 2023 11:58 am
I think you’re underestimating the power of the LH brand, that’s why they pay top dollar, same as Tom Brady, Ronald, Messi amongst others.
From a business standpoint, I don't understand how Mercedes is going to benefit out of Lewis' marketability or his brand. Mercedes is a massive brand and caters to a certain elite segment in the automobile market. I don't know if some of Mercedes' customers want Lewis to deliver their newly purchased car as he is 7 time WDC. Most brands chase successful F1 team for sponsoring. If Mercedes doesn't win for another couple of years, sponsors disappear even if Lewis is there in the team. That's how it works.

A driver's commercial viability for an F1 team is purely performance oriented. Brands did not throng at Mercedes in 2010-12, despite having a 7 time WDC driving for them. When they started winning, they started making fortune from sponsor deals that not just covered the F1 expenses, but gave profitability, despite their annual F1 spending in the range of 500 million a year.

Red Bull is back to winning ways and they started attracting mega millions sponsor deals.

I have no doubt if Mercedes creates another car with 3 to 5 tenths advantage, even Russell can win championships and the sponsors would flow in thick and fast even if Lewis disappears from the scene.

Marketability works for individual athletes. The more success they get, more marketable they become. Marketability of the driver is no reason for an F1 team to offer fortune deals. It's the speed and how long that speed is going to persist. The younger and faster, the more valuable.
What do you think happens when Mercedes and Lewis Hamilton has 8 driver WC?

Hamilton becomes the undisputed GOAT, and mercedes becomes the undisputed F-1 engine goat, as they powered him to those 8 championships.
Already the AMG One success is mostly to do with Hamilton. A lot of mercedes sports cars sales and desirability was driven by Hamilton's success in F-1. Even in the Nico Rosberg and Shumacher days, the cars didn't have the same pull.
Hamilton has indirectly increased desirability of the mercedes cars as sports cars.
8 championships benefits both, but helps mercedes more than Hamilton. If mercedes don't give Hamilton what he wants, he walks away and they never get the opportunity to be the GOAT for the next decade or more.
I agree with most of what you said but to call the AMG One a "success" is a big big stretch :lol:

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ringo
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Re: 2022 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

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well whatever it turns out to be. It may well be another ferrari f50. After some time it will be appreciated because of the F1 engine.
I think im starting to appreciate it more than the f40.
For Sure!!

AR3-GP
AR3-GP
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Re: 2022 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

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Hamilton is certainly a well known name, but I question some of the commentary here. The way it's been explained to me above, no one would capable of selling cars without Hamilton :wink:

Without seeing any data, it's hard to understand one way or the other.

I'm sure he's creating a lot of brand awareness in the cities where the GP is held but I don't know if this is unique as the same applies to the other manufacturers.

Mosin123
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Re: 2022 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

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organic wrote:
Thu Jan 26, 2023 1:22 am
ringo wrote:
Tue Jan 24, 2023 4:34 pm
mendis wrote:
Mon Jan 23, 2023 12:28 pm
From a business standpoint, I don't understand how Mercedes is going to benefit out of Lewis' marketability or his brand. Mercedes is a massive brand and caters to a certain elite segment in the automobile market. I don't know if some of Mercedes' customers want Lewis to deliver their newly purchased car as he is 7 time WDC. Most brands chase successful F1 team for sponsoring. If Mercedes doesn't win for another couple of years, sponsors disappear even if Lewis is there in the team. That's how it works.

A driver's commercial viability for an F1 team is purely performance oriented. Brands did not throng at Mercedes in 2010-12, despite having a 7 time WDC driving for them. When they started winning, they started making fortune from sponsor deals that not just covered the F1 expenses, but gave profitability, despite their annual F1 spending in the range of 500 million a year.

Red Bull is back to winning ways and they started attracting mega millions sponsor deals.

I have no doubt if Mercedes creates another car with 3 to 5 tenths advantage, even Russell can win championships and the sponsors would flow in thick and fast even if Lewis disappears from the scene.

Marketability works for individual athletes. The more success they get, more marketable they become. Marketability of the driver is no reason for an F1 team to offer fortune deals. It's the speed and how long that speed is going to persist. The younger and faster, the more valuable.
What do you think happens when Mercedes and Lewis Hamilton has 8 driver WC?

Hamilton becomes the undisputed GOAT, and mercedes becomes the undisputed F-1 engine goat, as they powered him to those 8 championships.
Already the AMG One success is mostly to do with Hamilton. A lot of mercedes sports cars sales and desirability was driven by Hamilton's success in F-1. Even in the Nico Rosberg and Shumacher days, the cars didn't have the same pull.
Hamilton has indirectly increased desirability of the mercedes cars as sports cars.
8 championships benefits both, but helps mercedes more than Hamilton. If mercedes don't give Hamilton what he wants, he walks away and they never get the opportunity to be the GOAT for the next decade or more.
I agree with most of what you said but to call the AMG One a "success" is a big big stretch :lol:

How was it not a success? they all sold...