2024 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

[f1jcw]

I disagree, if he scores the 8th with Merc then it is mercs record it was won in a Merc, Ferrari just have a 8 time winner driving for them instead of a 7th.
None of the hype goes to Ferrari.

They are driver titles, the hype and marketability goes where that driver goes. From 2025 onwards Ferrari will be the ones selling LH merch and marketing him for their products. So to pretend that it's a "no-brainer" to prioritise Lewis to the detriment of your future team leader is, IMO, nonsense.

1. Toto disagrees
2. Merc/lewis fans disagree
3. A few people who are neither a Lewis or Merc fans and have no skin in this game, are eager to push the narrative thst Merc shouldn’t support Lewis, as mentioned, Renault didn’t take this attitude with Alonso, or do you think they should have done?

[denyall]

Merc will want to hold on to fans that were brought to the team since 2013. There is still marketability for the Mercedes brand and their sponsors in being someone's second team. People who follow Lewis will likey continue to follow Mercedes as well. If they piss off #teamlh by not giving Lewis a fair go for 2024 then they will lose a lot of those people and overall cost them in sponsorship and marketability for Mercedes. 25% of Lewis following is more value than all of George's

[Cs98]

I disagree, if he scores the 8th with Merc then it is mercs record it was won in a Merc, Ferrari just have a 8 time winner driving for them instead of a 7th.
None of the hype goes to Ferrari.

They are driver titles, the hype and marketability goes where that driver goes. From 2025 onwards Ferrari will be the ones selling LH merch and marketing him for their products. So to pretend that it's a "no-brainer" to prioritise Lewis to the detriment of your future team leader is, IMO, nonsense.

1. Toto disagrees
2. Merc/lewis fans disagree
3. A few people who are neither a Lewis or Merc fans and have no skin in this game, are eager to push the narrative thst Merc shouldn’t support Lewis, as mentioned, Renault didn’t take this attitude with Alonso, or do you think they should have done?

1. Toto disagrees with what? He has already stated they aim to be completely fair with both guys, I would expect no other official stance.
2. Lewis fans disagree, no surprise there, they care about Lewis. But Merc fans who will keep being Merc fans in 2025 (and not Lewis fans) would be a far more interesting poll, and more relevant from Merc's own perspective.
3. Renault didn't have a second driver the calibre of Russell. Fisichella couldn't beat Alonso, he never even came close. Russell has already proven he can beat Hamilton. Also, I never suggested they pull support from Hamilton, I questioned this "no-brainer" attitude towards favouring him and thereby pulling support from Russell, who is the future of the team. They can and should use the same set-up they have used before, be fair until it becomes time to pick sides and then you pick the guy who is in better WDC position.

[Sidiamal]

I'm baffled at how this is even an argument. "Oh our driver is fighting for the title at our team but he's going to Ferrari let's just tank the championship so he doesn't get the credit" is not a train of thought that passes through the brain of any normally constituted Formula 1 team.

[f1jcw]

They are driver titles, the hype and marketability goes where that driver goes. From 2025 onwards Ferrari will be the ones selling LH merch and marketing him for their products. So to pretend that it's a "no-brainer" to prioritise Lewis to the detriment of your future team leader is, IMO, nonsense.

1. Toto disagrees
2. Merc/lewis fans disagree
3. A few people who are neither a Lewis or Merc fans and have no skin in this game, are eager to push the narrative thst Merc shouldn’t support Lewis, as mentioned, Renault didn’t take this attitude with Alonso, or do you think they should have done?

1. Toto disagrees with what? He has already stated they aim to be completely fair with both guys, I would expect no other official stance.
2. Lewis fans disagree, no surprise there, they care about Lewis. But Merc fans who will keep being Merc fans in 2025 (and not Lewis fans) would be a far more interesting poll, and more relevant from Merc's own perspective.
3. Renault didn't have a second driver the calibre of Russell. Fisichella couldn't beat Alonso, he never even came close. Russell has already proven he can beat Hamilton. Also, I never suggested they pull support from Hamilton, I questioned this "no-brainer" attitude towards favouring him and thereby pulling support from Russell, who is the future of the team. They can and should use the same set-up they have used before, be fair until it becomes time to pick sides and then you pick the guy who is in better WDC position.

1. Toto will support Lewis in his attempt to win 8th WDC in the Merc.
2. Lewis fans are Merc fans, it would be an interesting poll, but unfortunately none Merc/lewis fans would also vote meaning it isn’t valid.
3. A) ah so the your thoughts don’t apply to Alonso. B) not sure where anyone has suggested they pull support from Russel, not once has anyone ever said that. Merc have never favoured one driver over another even when it was detrimental. C) so.. if they continue to be fair until only one is in a WDC why are you even raising any type of issue

[mendis]

Merc will want to hold on to fans that were brought to the team since 2013. There is still marketability for the Mercedes brand and their sponsors in being someone's second team. People who follow Lewis will likey continue to follow Mercedes as well. If they piss off #teamlh by not giving Lewis a fair go for 2024 then they will lose a lot of those people and overall cost them in sponsorship and marketability for Mercedes. 25% of Lewis following is more value than all of George's

We already witnessed some Lewis fans calling Toto a snake here. Do you think Lewis fans would remember fondly of Mercedes or cheer for them if George gets ahead in championship? I don't think so. I bet you, as the season progresses, the divide between Lewis fans towards his second home would be toxic when development items would be bolted first on George and he gets more performance than Lewis or when Mercedes need to prioritise George over Lewis for obvious reasons. I already mentioned before, this thread is one to watch this season.

[denyall]

Merc will want to hold on to fans that were brought to the team since 2013. There is still marketability for the Mercedes brand and their sponsors in being someone's second team. People who follow Lewis will likey continue to follow Mercedes as well. If they piss off #teamlh by not giving Lewis a fair go for 2024 then they will lose a lot of those people and overall cost them in sponsorship and marketability for Mercedes. 25% of Lewis following is more value than all of George's

We already witnessed some Lewis fans calling Toto a snake here. Do you think Lewis fans would remember fondly of Mercedes or cheer for them if George gets ahead in championship? I don't think so. I bet you, as the season progresses, the divide between Lewis fans towards his second home would be toxic when development items would be bolted first on George and he gets more performance than Lewis or when Mercedes need to prioritise George over Lewis for obvious reasons. I already mentioned before, this thread is one to watch this season.

As I said, event 25% of #teamlh is more valuable than all of George's following..

The more fair Mercedes conducts the season the more retention they will have.

The opinion of LH super fans is not representative of the entire fan base of Mercedes....

[Chuckjr]

Can’t believe this is even a question. Merc will do what is best for merc and that is to build the team value which will stay with King George~the only loyal driver they have driving for them this year. It’s goofy to think merc title will go to Ferrari if Toto has any say in it. No, his loyalty now rests with George. Lewis has become the adversary. Toto, like Lewis, is in this for his own interests. There’s no loyalty here folks. Stop fooling yourself. You honestly think Merc wants Lewis to win a title this year over George?!? Not so much.

Make no mistake, the move to Ferrari by Lewis was pure selfishness. Pure. It had ZERO to do with Merc. It was entirely in the interest of Lewis. Why would it be otherwise? His loyalty runs as deep as where the fastest car is and how much money he can make and fan base he can gather. Period. He saw this as his last chance with a huge untapped market for him and Ferrari was willing to whore themselves into a relationship with a championship driver that offered them a marketing gala to exploit. It’s the same no loyalty pattern as Liberty is doing with the F1 sport and its heritage and history. This all is marketing and money folks. Take loyalty and toss it in the trash. It’s why Lewis did this. He never was loyal to Merc. He was loyal to winning. Merc just so happened to be there for him in that capacity and so of course come the gag tag lines, ‘I’m here for life. I’m dedicated to this team to the end. I’ll never leave. Bla. Bla. Bla.” What happened when their ability to win vaporised? He vaporized. The end. It never was about Merc. It was about winning and his career and money.

This is purely an ego driven set of events folks and Merc absolutely will give favor and all new updates to George. Absolutely. Lewis has shown his hand and it’s filled with his own interests. Toto sees this. Merc will follow Lewis’ lead and shove Lewis’ arse out the door ASAP while hiding him from as much tech as possible all year. Why would it be otherwise? It’s like having an insubordinate on staff for a year. It’s gonna get ROUGH in the Merc garage. Get your popcorn.

[Luscion]

Can’t believe this is even a question. Merc will do what is best for merc and that is to build the team value which will stay with King George~the only loyal driver they have driving for them this year. It’s goofy to think merc title will go to Ferrari if Toto has any say in it. No, his loyalty now rests with George. Lewis has become the adversary. Toto, like Lewis, is in this for his own interests. There’s no loyalty here folks. Stop fooling yourself. You honestly think Merc wants Lewis to win a title this year over George?!? Not so much.

Make no mistake, the move to Ferrari by Lewis was pure selfishness. Pure. It had ZERO to do with Merc. It was entirely in the interest of Lewis. Why would it be otherwise? His loyalty runs as deep as where the fastest car is and how much money he can make and fan base he can gather. Period. He saw this as his last chance with a huge untapped market for him and Ferrari was willing to whore themselves into a relationship with a championship driver that offered them a marketing gala to exploit. It’s the same no loyalty pattern as Liberty is doing with the F1 sport and its heritage and history. This all is marketing and money folks. Take loyalty and toss it in the trash. It’s why Lewis did this. He never was loyal to Merc. He was loyal to winning. Merc just so happened to be there for him in that capacity and so of course come the gag tag lines, ‘I’m here for life. I’m dedicated to this team to the end. I’ll never leave. Bla. Bla. Bla.” What happened when their ability to win vaporised? He vaporized. The end. It never was about Merc. It was about winning and his career and money.

This is purely an ego driven set of events folks and Merc absolutely will give favor and all new updates to George. Absolutely. Lewis has shown his hand and it’s filled with his own interests. Toto sees this. Merc will follow Lewis’ lead and shove Lewis’ arse out the door ASAP while hiding him from as much tech as possible all year. Why would it be otherwise? It’s like having an insubordinate on staff for a year. It’s gonna get ROUGH in the Merc garage. Get your popcorn.

There are reports of Merc not listening to Lewis and Serra that the W13 and 14 were the wrong concepts and doubling down on it, him wanting to stay with Merc for 3 years but only being offered a 1 + 1 because the higher-ups were concerned he would just retire if the car wasn't competitive this year, so not sure how you can say he left because Merc havent been competitive for championships for 2 years especially if the reports are true, he wanted to stay with them but might not have had a seat for 2026 and reports of Merc not wanting to make him a brand ambassador until 2035(this one is a bit iffy as it was only reported by one source). Ferrari offered that to him and much more, theres a lot of things that indicate he was loyal but Merc took him for granted.

[Cs98]

1. Toto disagrees
2. Merc/lewis fans disagree
3. A few people who are neither a Lewis or Merc fans and have no skin in this game, are eager to push the narrative thst Merc shouldn’t support Lewis, as mentioned, Renault didn’t take this attitude with Alonso, or do you think they should have done?

1. Toto disagrees with what? He has already stated they aim to be completely fair with both guys, I would expect no other official stance.
2. Lewis fans disagree, no surprise there, they care about Lewis. But Merc fans who will keep being Merc fans in 2025 (and not Lewis fans) would be a far more interesting poll, and more relevant from Merc's own perspective.
3. Renault didn't have a second driver the calibre of Russell. Fisichella couldn't beat Alonso, he never even came close. Russell has already proven he can beat Hamilton. Also, I never suggested they pull support from Hamilton, I questioned this "no-brainer" attitude towards favouring him and thereby pulling support from Russell, who is the future of the team. They can and should use the same set-up they have used before, be fair until it becomes time to pick sides and then you pick the guy who is in better WDC position.

1. Toto will support Lewis in his attempt to win 8th WDC in the Merc.
2. Lewis fans are Merc fans, it would be an interesting poll, but unfortunately none Merc/lewis fans would also vote meaning it isn’t valid.
3. A) ah so the your thoughts don’t apply to Alonso. B) not sure where anyone has suggested they pull support from Russel, not once has anyone ever said that. Merc have never favoured one driver over another even when it was detrimental. C) so.. if they continue to be fair until only one is in a WDC why are you even raising any type of issue

1. Indeed, but on fair terms with Russell. That's been the debate but it seems you are arguing a different point.
2. I'm sure some are, and I'm sure many are loyal to Lewis meaning wherever he goes they go. Then there will be some who are loyal to Merc. We don't need to conflate them as one, they are not. They all have different motivations.
3. a, They would except Renault only had one driver who was good enough to compete at that level. No point in giving equal priority to two drivers when they are nowhere near the same calibre. Russell has proven he can beat Lewis, so he deserves such consideration. Fisi, not so much. B + C. Reading the start of the argument helps with that. The suggestion was made that it was a "100% no-brainer" to get behind Hamilton in answer to a question about who they should prioritise this year. So actually someone did suggest to pull support from Russell, given that you can't prioritise one driver without de-prioritising the other. I didn't think it was that simple with Hamilton leaving and made my case why.

[mendis]

Can’t believe this is even a question. Merc will do what is best for merc and that is to build the team value which will stay with King George~the only loyal driver they have driving for them this year. It’s goofy to think merc title will go to Ferrari if Toto has any say in it. No, his loyalty now rests with George. Lewis has become the adversary. Toto, like Lewis, is in this for his own interests. There’s no loyalty here folks. Stop fooling yourself. You honestly think Merc wants Lewis to win a title this year over George?!? Not so much.

Make no mistake, the move to Ferrari by Lewis was pure selfishness. Pure. It had ZERO to do with Merc. It was entirely in the interest of Lewis. Why would it be otherwise? His loyalty runs as deep as where the fastest car is and how much money he can make and fan base he can gather. Period. He saw this as his last chance with a huge untapped market for him and Ferrari was willing to whore themselves into a relationship with a championship driver that offered them a marketing gala to exploit. It’s the same no loyalty pattern as Liberty is doing with the F1 sport and its heritage and history. This all is marketing and money folks. Take loyalty and toss it in the trash. It’s why Lewis did this. He never was loyal to Merc. He was loyal to winning. Merc just so happened to be there for him in that capacity and so of course come the gag tag lines, ‘I’m here for life. I’m dedicated to this team to the end. I’ll never leave. Bla. Bla. Bla.” What happened when their ability to win vaporised? He vaporized. The end. It never was about Merc. It was about winning and his career and money.

This is purely an ego driven set of events folks and Merc absolutely will give favor and all new updates to George. Absolutely. Lewis has shown his hand and it’s filled with his own interests. Toto sees this. Merc will follow Lewis’ lead and shove Lewis’ arse out the door ASAP while hiding him from as much tech as possible all year. Why would it be otherwise? It’s like having an insubordinate on staff for a year. It’s gonna get ROUGH in the Merc garage. Get your popcorn.

There are reports of Merc not listening to Lewis and Serra that the W13 and 14 were the wrong concepts and doubling down on it, him wanting to stay with Merc for 3 years but only being offered a 1 + 1 because the higher-ups were concerned he would just retire if the car wasn't competitive this year, so not sure how you can say he left because Merc havent been competitive for championships for 2 years especially if the reports are true, he wanted to stay with them but might not have had a seat for 2026 and reports of Merc not wanting to make him a brand ambassador until 2035(this one is a bit iffy as it was only reported by one source). Ferrari offered that to him and much more, theres a lot of things that indicate he was loyal but Merc took him for granted.

Most of that is hearsay. Lewis wanted to stay, Mercedes not offering brand ambassador role etc. Nobody knows what Ferrari has offered! Like everything else, that's also speculation. The only facts are Lewis leaving Mercedes while he had 1+1 contract and joining Ferrari for 2025 (terms and details unknown).

[Luscion]

Can’t believe this is even a question. Merc will do what is best for merc and that is to build the team value which will stay with King George~the only loyal driver they have driving for them this year. It’s goofy to think merc title will go to Ferrari if Toto has any say in it. No, his loyalty now rests with George. Lewis has become the adversary. Toto, like Lewis, is in this for his own interests. There’s no loyalty here folks. Stop fooling yourself. You honestly think Merc wants Lewis to win a title this year over George?!? Not so much.

Make no mistake, the move to Ferrari by Lewis was pure selfishness. Pure. It had ZERO to do with Merc. It was entirely in the interest of Lewis. Why would it be otherwise? His loyalty runs as deep as where the fastest car is and how much money he can make and fan base he can gather. Period. He saw this as his last chance with a huge untapped market for him and Ferrari was willing to whore themselves into a relationship with a championship driver that offered them a marketing gala to exploit. It’s the same no loyalty pattern as Liberty is doing with the F1 sport and its heritage and history. This all is marketing and money folks. Take loyalty and toss it in the trash. It’s why Lewis did this. He never was loyal to Merc. He was loyal to winning. Merc just so happened to be there for him in that capacity and so of course come the gag tag lines, ‘I’m here for life. I’m dedicated to this team to the end. I’ll never leave. Bla. Bla. Bla.” What happened when their ability to win vaporised? He vaporized. The end. It never was about Merc. It was about winning and his career and money.

This is purely an ego driven set of events folks and Merc absolutely will give favor and all new updates to George. Absolutely. Lewis has shown his hand and it’s filled with his own interests. Toto sees this. Merc will follow Lewis’ lead and shove Lewis’ arse out the door ASAP while hiding him from as much tech as possible all year. Why would it be otherwise? It’s like having an insubordinate on staff for a year. It’s gonna get ROUGH in the Merc garage. Get your popcorn.

There are reports of Merc not listening to Lewis and Serra that the W13 and 14 were the wrong concepts and doubling down on it, him wanting to stay with Merc for 3 years but only being offered a 1 + 1 because the higher-ups were concerned he would just retire if the car wasn't competitive this year, so not sure how you can say he left because Merc havent been competitive for championships for 2 years especially if the reports are true, he wanted to stay with them but might not have had a seat for 2026 and reports of Merc not wanting to make him a brand ambassador until 2035(this one is a bit iffy as it was only reported by one source). Ferrari offered that to him and much more, theres a lot of things that indicate he was loyal but Merc took him for granted.

Most of that is hearsay. Lewis wanted to stay, Mercedes not offering brand ambassador role etc. Nobody knows what Ferrari has offered! Like everything else, that's also speculation. The only facts are Lewis leaving Mercedes while he had 1+1 contract and joining Ferrari for 2025 (terms and details unknown).

theres a reason i said they're reports and specifically mention IF they are true, in the same vein as claiming it as fact that Lewis left because he wasnt loyal and this is all ego-driven

[dialtone]

There are reports of Merc not listening to Lewis and Serra that the W13 and 14 were the wrong concepts and doubling down on it, him wanting to stay with Merc for 3 years but only being offered a 1 + 1 because the higher-ups were concerned he would just retire if the car wasn't competitive this year, so not sure how you can say he left because Merc havent been competitive for championships for 2 years especially if the reports are true, he wanted to stay with them but might not have had a seat for 2026 and reports of Merc not wanting to make him a brand ambassador until 2035(this one is a bit iffy as it was only reported by one source). Ferrari offered that to him and much more, theres a lot of things that indicate he was loyal but Merc took him for granted.

Most of that is hearsay. Lewis wanted to stay, Mercedes not offering brand ambassador role etc. Nobody knows what Ferrari has offered! Like everything else, that's also speculation. The only facts are Lewis leaving Mercedes while he had 1+1 contract and joining Ferrari for 2025 (terms and details unknown).

theres a reason i said they're reports and specifically mention IF they are true, in the same vein as claiming it as fact that Lewis left because he wasnt loyal and this is all ego-driven

It’s not a fact, it’s your opinion. Calling someone disloyal after the longest stint of any driver for the same team in history seems excessive, especially when he brought so many championships to said team, wouldn’t you say?

[mendis]

Most of that is hearsay. Lewis wanted to stay, Mercedes not offering brand ambassador role etc. Nobody knows what Ferrari has offered! Like everything else, that's also speculation. The only facts are Lewis leaving Mercedes while he had 1+1 contract and joining Ferrari for 2025 (terms and details unknown).

theres a reason i said they're reports and specifically mention IF they are true, in the same vein as claiming it as fact that Lewis left because he wasnt loyal and this is all ego-driven

It’s not a fact, it’s your opinion. Calling someone disloyal after the longest stint of any driver for the same team in history seems excessive, especially when he brought so many championships to said team, wouldn’t you say?

He left McLaren as he couldn't win a title and now he left Mercedes as he doesn't think he can win a title there again (my opinion)! This team gave the tools to achieve success. Literally, there was no other team that could have won a title for 5 out of 7 seasons. Such was the dominance of the cars. If it was not him in the team, Nico could have won at least 5 of them as he would be unchallenged by any team. So I don't know if "he brought" was a right terminology here. In my opinion, just my opinion, loyalty is sticking with a team that gave you success and turn things around after a difficult period. He is looking after his own interests, which he has the right to. I don't see anything that can stop people from calling he wasn't loyal. Staying in a team for 12 years in F1, clearly means the team gave what he needed and puts itself in better light. Otherwise, drivers just leave the teams at the drop of a hat. Do you think he would have stayed with Mercedes for 12 years if they wouldn't have produced a car capable of winning title?

[Luscion]

Most of that is hearsay. Lewis wanted to stay, Mercedes not offering brand ambassador role etc. Nobody knows what Ferrari has offered! Like everything else, that's also speculation. The only facts are Lewis leaving Mercedes while he had 1+1 contract and joining Ferrari for 2025 (terms and details unknown).

theres a reason i said they're reports and specifically mention IF they are true, in the same vein as claiming it as fact that Lewis left because he wasnt loyal and this is all ego-driven

It’s not a fact, it’s your opinion. Calling someone disloyal after the longest stint of any driver for the same team in history seems excessive, especially when he brought so many championships to said team, wouldn’t you say?

i'm not sure if you meant to quote me or the other guy saying this is all because Lewis was never loyal but we're agreeing