2018 McLaren F1 Team - Renault

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McHonda
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Re: 2018 Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

Post by McHonda » Wed Jan 03, 2018 4:51 pm

dren wrote:
Wed Jan 03, 2018 4:37 pm
The biggest challenge Alonso ever had was Hamilton in his rookie season. They finished equal on points at the end of the year. Hamilton is better now. Is Alonso? A lot of your questions with the car will be answered once we can compare them to Red Bull. Based on some information here, the Honda (at the end of 2017) really isn't that far off of the Renault, and might be on par with it this year. Mclaren can feel comfortable in knowing that a repeat of 2017 is unlikely with Renault's reliability and performance record vs Honda's, but I don't see them magically becoming a podium machine. I think they'll be around where they were at the end of last year.
I think it's likely Alonso is better now as well. He was young himself,new to the team,new to Bridgestones and switched driving style for that tyre change so there is scope for him as well and he did match up to Button in much the same fashion as Hamilton years later.

Might be on par with Renault is something I've been reading about since Arai said it in Summer 2015. Maybe this will be the year, I hope so from a Honda perspective but obviously McLaren who have plenty of data themselves obviously don't think so.

Podium machine is a stretch even for me but I think they'll have a couple yeah. Might even sneak a win somewhere in the 2nd half if things fall their way and Alonso adds some magic.

dren
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Re: 2018 Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

Post by dren » Wed Jan 03, 2018 4:56 pm

Oh I do think Alonso is still good, but Vandoorne doesn't seem to be a good measuring stick. Alonso did quite well in the 500. Yes, I do expect a podium or two through the year. A win will have to be gifted.

The top three teams all had good cars last year; I expect them to evolve and improve. There isn't much of a chance they change directions and screw up. FI should be strong again, too, but the gap to the front leaves room for Mclaren. I think Renault will jump in that fight, too.
Honda!

dren
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Re: 2018 Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

Post by dren » Wed Jan 03, 2018 6:22 pm

You could probably look at the qualifying and finishing position of both drivers at the start of 2017 and see their progression relative to the field over the year. I wouldn't call that progress little. Mclaren said goodbye because Honda didn't deliver at the start of the season.
Honda!

aral
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Re: 2018 Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

Post by aral » Wed Jan 03, 2018 6:52 pm

Once again I would remind you that the thread is about 2018 McLaren Renault . comparing drivers in years gone by (even Alonso has been brought into the "discussion") is not in keeping with the topic. Some posts have been removed and there are others that should be !

PLEASE stay on topic.

etusch
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Re: 2018 Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

Post by etusch » Wed Jan 03, 2018 8:10 pm

According to me if Mclaren switch to another PU inseason, it would be logical. But now it is a hard situation. I think they did this switch with trust of hope that they can build a good chassis for this season . and I believe they will try to convince everyone ( Mclaren fans, F1 fans, share holders etc) by making speed test as soon as possible at the beginning of winter testing. They will push to be one of fastest from the start of testing even if this cost them a Pu and after that some of well known forumers will start to talk about being Wdc.
Mclaren switch a power unit more powerful from a Pu less powerful but has low cog and 10 kg lighter. I expect from renault to built more competive PU. I expect from Honda to be closer than end of last season. It would not make enough difference for 2018 for Mclaren having renault PU instead of Honda. Whatever. What happened is happened.
If Mclaren can put on what they did last year they can be 4th or 5th team. Big probibly they will have battle with renault works team with that position. So that will make angry them at the end of season

techman
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Re: 2018 Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

Post by techman » Wed Jan 03, 2018 11:43 pm

It's not just McLaren that has praised their last two chassis's though so it's not coming from nowhere. AMuS has reported several times how well the car does with it's tyres and how the chassis matches up using GPS traces and rival engineers told James Allen that at the end of 2016 they felt McLaren had the 3rd best(Only because Ferrari stopped developing to be fair). Then you've got the known shortfalls of the engine but in spite of that McLaren kept finishing 7th on the traditional chassis tracks. The cars have been largely praised since Spain 2015 when Button described it as "scary" and only twice since then have the drivers had a go at it, Suzuka 2016 and Button in Brazil 2016.
honestly if you want to get impresive GPS data, just run max drag forget about efficiency and you will achieve it. mclaren only care about their GPS and boasting about their chassis and blaming the engine supplier. let be honest, mclaren renault will not be as efficient as a redbull with their current high drag philosophy. 2018 is the year of the truth. and if they achieve anything less than 3rd place in title chase, its a big disappoinment after so much boasting about GPS data

zoroastar
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Re: 2018 Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

Post by zoroastar » Thu Jan 04, 2018 1:03 am

for someone that claims that you would "love to see mclaren fighting at the front" you seem rather anti-mclaren. anti alonso, pretty much anti anything that has to do with mclaren. no need to try hiding it, because its obvious. haha. all this talk from everyone that sounds like they have a crystal ball, and know exactly how mclaren are going to do next year, save it. you dont know. everyone in the paddock have their eyes on mclaren and expect good things, and you know what? they have the same gps data that mclaren has. they have a lot more insight than almost anyone in the forums. this is a completely different team than any time in the past. new people, new ideas, a good chassis, and alonso. dont underestimate that.

Manoah2u wrote:
Wed Jan 03, 2018 3:53 pm


I'm really baffled at how people take it from thin air that Mclaren could reach P4 in the WCC just by an engine transplant.

Force India with a relatively tiny budget snatched P4. They were above all consistant and had a great driver pairing, given.
yet all the money in the world that Williams carries, Renault carries, and Toro Rosso carries, diddn't get them past Force India,
with a gigantic lead over the rest one might say. And that includes 2 teams that had the Renault engines.

It's a stretch to think Mclaren instantly can beat or reach RedBull only because of the same engine, and them saying they have the best chassis.
Funny enough, RedBull also claims they had the best chassis, but if they had an engine like Mercedes/Ferrari, they'd be miles and miles away in the distance.

And here comes Mclaren from years and years of abysmal results, incredible stress that only recently with Brown has been 'relieved' somewhat, years of missing
the mark completely with the chassis, and we are to expect them to just jump in and beat RedBull?

As much as i'd like to see Mclaren back at the front, that rather sounds like still believing Santa exists.

Do people forget Adrian Newey is essentially still the one that makes the magic happen at RedBull? RB missed the mark at the start a bit - also hampered by engine problems -
and Newey involved himself more and in no-time they were back at the top. It's already announced he's far more involved with 2018's competitor than last years, which only
tells you to expect even more from RedBull.

Mclaren at best would find themselves right behind Force India for 2018. And that is if their engines aren't handgrenades like the both the renaults and the honda engines
of 2017.

Matter of fact, Alonso parked a perfectly good working Mclaren - supposedly more than once - with no engine problems because he didnt feel like finishing p16 or something like that.
"No speed" No speed!". I do wonder how many times the Renault engine will desintegrate in 2018 with the even more restricted engine usage, and Renault's work to get more power
from it.

And as mentioned above, who's to say the Alonso-VanDoorne combo is that good?
Is Alonso still 'that good' or is VanDoorne actually rather bad by being far behind him for the larger part of the season?
vanDoorne is relatively still quite the rookie. If any, you'd have to compare him to Bottas in his 2nd year, and quite frankly, that was very underwhelming. As for Alonso, how good still is he? how motivated is he still?
I like to think of him as great, and he has had some great battles during the year.
He could be still the very best and mature one out there - but at the same time, even that is a variable we haven't had any decent comparison for in the last couple of years.
I have a high regards for Button, but don't see Jenson as Hamilton/Senna material. Yet Button stood his ground against Alonso. and after Ferrari, Alonso's only reasonable comparison material has been Button.
After all, VanDoorne is 'just' a rookie,

whereas Ricciardo and Verstappen aswell as Ocon and Perez are all fully on fire and focus.

zoroastar
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Re: 2018 Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

Post by zoroastar » Thu Jan 04, 2018 1:15 am

but, blaming your engine partner is so easy when your engine partners blame themselves as well.
mclaren knows what "failure" is as of late. and trust me, 4th in the wdc after 3 straight years in the bottom half is NOT it. no matter what the honda fanboys say. c:
techman wrote:
Wed Jan 03, 2018 11:43 pm
It's not just McLaren that has praised their last two chassis's though so it's not coming from nowhere. AMuS has reported several times how well the car does with it's tyres and how the chassis matches up using GPS traces and rival engineers told James Allen that at the end of 2016 they felt McLaren had the 3rd best(Only because Ferrari stopped developing to be fair). Then you've got the known shortfalls of the engine but in spite of that McLaren kept finishing 7th on the traditional chassis tracks. The cars have been largely praised since Spain 2015 when Button described it as "scary" and only twice since then have the drivers had a go at it, Suzuka 2016 and Button in Brazil 2016.
honestly if you want to get impresive GPS data, just run max drag forget about efficiency and you will achieve it. mclaren only care about their GPS and boasting about their chassis and blaming the engine supplier. let be honest, mclaren renault will not be as efficient as a redbull with their current high drag philosophy. 2018 is the year of the truth. and if they achieve anything less than 3rd place in title chase, its a big disappoinment after so much boasting about GPS data

Squid
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Re: 2018 Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

Post by Squid » Thu Jan 04, 2018 3:00 am

Maybe we should have an unmoderated McLaren vs. Honda thread and start giving out temporary bans for people arguing outside that thread.

Clearly asking people to just move on is not working.

Webber2011
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Re: 2018 Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

Post by Webber2011 » Thu Jan 04, 2018 3:43 am

My biggest concern isn't whether McLaren have a great chassis, but whether Renault can supply the goods, so that effects Red Bull as well.

This will undoubtedly be a major factor in the battle between these two teams.


Let's face the facts, we all know the Renault PU was flattered last season because of Honda's failings, and Red Bull managing to get some great results when they didn't retire.

With the new rule on parts usage they need to significantly up their game in 2018 or face some very hefty grid penalties.

I tend to think, and this is just my opinion, that Renault will most likely favour McLaren over Red Bull due to the fact RBR are leaving, so that's an advantage.

But reliability is going to play a huge part in 2018, and the balance between finishing races or actually competing is going to be a fine line.

If Renault do have to dumb things down to improve reliability then I fear McLaren might find themselves scrapping for the odd few points with the rest of the midfield.

For me, this just shows the stupidity of the regulations.
It's the token system all over again, but worse 😢

carisi2k
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Re: 2018 Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

Post by carisi2k » Thu Jan 04, 2018 4:33 am

I think 5 engines in 2016 was the best solution. It also means that people at the 7th or 14th race are not going to truly see the capabilities of the cars if they have to run in a detuned mode due to having to meet this stupid 3 engine rule.

As for Mclaren I think they will do better this year then last year but I think that would have been achievable with the Honda as well since they seem to have gotten over there problems by the end of the year with some extra hp. Mclaren Renault will be fast in Fernando's hands but can Renault fix there reliability and find that 40hp to mercedes. I still think they will be in the mid field battle but will they be able to do anything against the Force India's which should be strong again in 2018.

kaepernickus
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Re: 2018 Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

Post by kaepernickus » Thu Jan 04, 2018 7:47 am

Manoah2u wrote:
Wed Jan 03, 2018 3:53 pm
I'm really baffled at how people take it from thin air that Mclaren could reach P4 in the WCC just by an engine transplant.
...
Mclaren at best would find themselves right behind Force India for 2018.
So others "taking sth from thin air" is stupid and baffling, but you doing the same thing is perfectly fine?

marmer
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Re: 2018 Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

Post by marmer » Thu Jan 04, 2018 10:17 am

Why do it find it hard to like McLaren. 25 now great up as a Schumacher fan
Missed all of the real domination that they have ever had

By the time they next won yes the driver was inspiring but the team was very boring. And has been like this since until Ron left and they started to get some life back under Zak.

Rambling i know just thought some people that are blinded by McLaren should see where others come from when we don't have much appreciation for McLaren

Jolle
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Re: 2018 Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

Post by Jolle » Thu Jan 04, 2018 10:35 am

carisi2k wrote:
Thu Jan 04, 2018 4:33 am
I think 5 engines in 2016 was the best solution. It also means that people at the 7th or 14th race are not going to truly see the capabilities of the cars if they have to run in a detuned mode due to having to meet this stupid 3 engine rule.

As for Mclaren I think they will do better this year then last year but I think that would have been achievable with the Honda as well since they seem to have gotten over there problems by the end of the year with some extra hp. Mclaren Renault will be fast in Fernando's hands but can Renault fix there reliability and find that 40hp to mercedes. I still think they will be in the mid field battle but will they be able to do anything against the Force India's which should be strong again in 2018.
PU's are always build/downtuned on their needed lifespan, for one GP a lit less then for 7 GP's. In the past few years Honda and Renault took advantage off this to run a PU not for it's intended length but to sacrifice a few GP's to have more power at others. Just imagine how far Mercedes (who haven't got a real penalty for new components except for Hamilton) would be if they all would need the PU for just one or two races...

RonDennis
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Re: 2018 Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

Post by RonDennis » Thu Jan 04, 2018 2:54 pm

kaepernickus wrote:
Thu Jan 04, 2018 7:47 am
Manoah2u wrote:
Wed Jan 03, 2018 3:53 pm
I'm really baffled at how people take it from thin air that Mclaren could reach P4 in the WCC just by an engine transplant.
...
Mclaren at best would find themselves right behind Force India for 2018.
So others "taking sth from thin air" is stupid and baffling, but you doing the same thing is perfectly fine?
That's Honda logic for you. Renault don't stand a chance, but Honda will beat everyone over the winter. Based on what? Thin air.

techman wrote:
Wed Jan 03, 2018 11:43 pm
It's not just McLaren that has praised their last two chassis's though so it's not coming from nowhere. AMuS has reported several times how well the car does with it's tyres and how the chassis matches up using GPS traces and rival engineers told James Allen that at the end of 2016 they felt McLaren had the 3rd best(Only because Ferrari stopped developing to be fair). Then you've got the known shortfalls of the engine but in spite of that McLaren kept finishing 7th on the traditional chassis tracks. The cars have been largely praised since Spain 2015 when Button described it as "scary" and only twice since then have the drivers had a go at it, Suzuka 2016 and Button in Brazil 2016.
honestly if you want to get impresive GPS data, just run max drag forget about efficiency and you will achieve it. mclaren only care about their GPS and boasting about their chassis and blaming the engine supplier. let be honest, mclaren renault will not be as efficient as a redbull with their current high drag philosophy. 2018 is the year of the truth. and if they achieve anything less than 3rd place in title chase, its a big disappoinment after so much boasting about GPS data
How many times are you going to post the same old crap?

A small collection of your constant whining about McLaren, but when someone post something negative about STR and Honda you act like a child.
thats fine but dont come to honda or TR forums and act a troll like you are.
i thought mclaren boast about that chassis, surely they should be in top 3 at the end of the 2018 season, if not that a failure for mclaren and will expose their incompetent engineers.
didnt mclaren say they have top 3 chassis , and it only due to honda that they cant show performance. so yes i hope they can show us a top 3 performance in 2018 and finish ahead of redbull, if not its a disappointment from their engineers. let see
i thin mclaren renault fans will be dissappointed to find their car behind redbull.
this again by another mclaren fan

as for TR. i believe there will be good progress as the season progress.
its the best news for honda that they joins hands with redbull, the best chassis designing team. so happy mclaren going with renault. mclaren will not win any title with them that 4 sure. redbull honda champs in 2019
Keep your --- in the STR and Honda topics and stop bugging us with your retarded ---.