2019 performance speculation

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Phil
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Re: 2019 performance speculation

Post by Phil » Tue Dec 04, 2018 10:51 pm

I wouldnt know why. They didnt swap to Honda because they know Honda will make a better PU. They changed because their working relationship with Renault wasnt working out and working together with Honda gives them the chance at a better partnership with a better PU integration in what is an ‘engine’ formula. They had a year to test waters with their sister team Torro Rosso and the data is promising. We’ve all seen how ‘bad’ Renault have been this year. If you ask me, i’d think chances are good that Honda will be at least on par with Renault next year.

The only concern i’d have at this point is if Honda can build a competitive engine not only on the power front, but reliability wise too.

Personally, i think McLaren will be hitting themselves at seeing RedBull reap the rewards they helped to build up.
Not for nothing, Rosberg's Championship is the only thing that lends credibility to Hamilton's recent success. Otherwise, he'd just be the guy who's had the best car. — bhall II
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Vasconia
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Re: 2019 performance speculation

Post by Vasconia » Wed Dec 05, 2018 8:08 am

LM10 wrote:
Tue Dec 04, 2018 4:32 pm
Vasconia wrote:
Tue Dec 04, 2018 12:18 pm

I think new aero regulations will benefit more Mercedes than Ferrari
so I expect Mercedes to be stronger. I hope I am wrong though. McLaren will improve significantly with all they have learned this year and two Young and fast drivers ready to push in the same direction.
Why do you think that? Just curious, if you have any technical thoughts on why.
No specific technical aspects but I have the idea(maybe I am wrong) that this Ferrari and (obviously) RB feel more confortable with the complex aero we have had the last two years. Taking into account that, among other things, the front wing will be more simple in 2019 I think that Mercedes could feel more confortable as they were between 2014 and 2016.

Just a feeling, indeed.

Vasconia
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Re: 2019 performance speculation

Post by Vasconia » Wed Dec 05, 2018 8:10 am

AMG.Tzan wrote:
Tue Dec 04, 2018 1:14 pm
Why is everyone forgetting Alfa Romeo - Sauber for some reason?? I expect them to be closer to the midfield with Renault Hass and Force India (4th-6th)! At the top pretty much the same as 2018...maybe a bit closer! At the bottom again Williams and Toro Rosso...and about McLaren...hmm who knows...somewhere in between midfield and bottom :P
Ups!, totally right mate. I think they will be strong, maybe the 5th-6th team. I hope to see Kimi doing some good races.

marmer
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Re: 2019 performance speculation

Post by marmer » Wed Dec 05, 2018 9:20 am

Vasconia wrote:
Wed Dec 05, 2018 8:08 am
LM10 wrote:
Tue Dec 04, 2018 4:32 pm
Vasconia wrote:
Tue Dec 04, 2018 12:18 pm

I think new aero regulations will benefit more Mercedes than Ferrari
so I expect Mercedes to be stronger. I hope I am wrong though. McLaren will improve significantly with all they have learned this year and two Young and fast drivers ready to push in the same direction.
Why do you think that? Just curious, if you have any technical thoughts on why.
No specific technical aspects but I have the idea(maybe I am wrong) that this Ferrari and (obviously) RB feel more confortable with the complex aero we have had the last two years. Taking into account that, among other things, the front wing will be more simple in 2019 I think that Mercedes could feel more confortable as they were between 2014 and 2016.

Just a feeling, indeed.
Actually I think the rules favour red bull. They work the body much more than any other team and generally run much less wing angle than others to make up for power deficit yet still the fastest in the twisty sections

If red bull loose out this coming season it will most likely be engine performance not chassis/aero

JordanMugen
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Re: 2019 performance speculation

Post by JordanMugen » Thu Dec 06, 2018 8:30 am

Restomaniac wrote:
Tue Dec 04, 2018 7:10 pm
Someone once said that the Honda PU was a piece of Jewellery.
2015 Honda RA615H:
Image

The size zero version WAS beautifully made, don't you agree? Just compare to the bulky unit from Renault for instance.

Obviously, as it turned out the compact packaging, axial compressor, size zero MGUH and size zero turbine ultimately hindered performance & especially cooling and was a poor decision, a decision taken at McLaren's insistence...

Phil wrote:
Tue Dec 04, 2018 10:51 pm
Personally, i think McLaren will be hitting themselves at seeing RedBull reap the rewards they helped to build up.
McLaren obviously hindered Honda a lot with the size zero requirement which ultimately wasted the 2015 and 2016 seasons (due to the token system), plus an annual $100m is far better spent on the power unit than thanklessly donated to the McLaren chassis, so it is for the best they are apart. 8)

Being with Red Bull who have arguably the finest chassis in F1, gives Honda the best chance to take podium results -- even if their PU is still quite inferior to Mercedes and Ferrari.

JordanMugen
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Re: 2019 performance speculation

Post by JordanMugen » Thu Dec 06, 2018 8:41 am

anzx wrote:
Wed Nov 28, 2018 11:04 pm
Sorry guys, but I think you underestimate Renault too much. It's about time that French team joins the front. They invested to much to be just 4th. I believe that Renault will be max 0.5 sec behind. And their driving pairing is probably the best in F1.
It's possible! I will believe it when I see it. It would be great if Renault could join the top teams and regularly finish races in the top 5 (driver) positions.

AJI
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Re: 2019 performance speculation

Post by AJI » Thu Dec 06, 2018 11:15 am

Renault for the title in 2020

Blackout
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Re: 2019 performance speculation

Post by Blackout » Sun Dec 09, 2018 10:09 am

JordanMugen wrote:
Thu Dec 06, 2018 8:30 am
Restomaniac wrote:
Tue Dec 04, 2018 7:10 pm
Someone once said that the Honda PU was a piece of Jewellery.
2015 Honda RA615H:
https://cdn-image.as-web.jp/2016/08/070 ... 80x853.jpg

The size zero version WAS beautifully made, don't you agree? Just compare to the bulky unit from Renault for instance.

Obviously, as it turned out the compact packaging, axial compressor, size zero MGUH and size zero turbine ultimately hindered performance & especially cooling and was a poor decision, a decision taken at McLaren's insistence...

Phil wrote:
Tue Dec 04, 2018 10:51 pm
Personally, i think McLaren will be hitting themselves at seeing RedBull reap the rewards they helped to build up.
McLaren obviously hindered Honda a lot with the size zero requirement which ultimately wasted the 2015 and 2016 seasons (due to the token system), plus an annual $100m is far better spent on the power unit than thanklessly donated to the McLaren chassis, so it is for the best they are apart. 8)

Being with Red Bull who have arguably the finest chassis in F1, gives Honda the best chance to take podium results -- even if their PU is still quite inferior to Mercedes and Ferrari.
The Merc was, and still is, more size zero than all the Honda PU: overally shorter/smaller/less wide/with a smaller foot print and 'lower' , atleast as "beautifully made" and clean as the Honda... and obviously way stronger.
The real "size zero" was and still is the Merc.

Not very impressed with Honda's progress this year. Thir progress appears logical and normal to me; nothing groundbraking. And to say they're better than Renault now is a joke... Maybe their PU has produced more peak power than the Renault in two or three qualy sessions, but what about reliability, fuel consumption, race power etc? how many Honda engines did and are capable of doing 7 gps? how many gps did their spec 3 run without breaking? Will Honda keep that peak power or increase it and sort out the reliabilty and the efficiency at the same time?

I'm not writing off honda, they can succeed, catch Renault (without having to bring a new pu every 3 gp) and really catch the others, but in 2018 did none of that, contrary to what many medias say.

majki2111
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Re: 2019 performance speculation

Post by majki2111 » Sun Dec 09, 2018 4:59 pm

Hoping that we wont see whole field being lapped by TOP 3 teams, and whole team giving at least small resistance in fights on track compared to previous years. Hoping to see new winner except Red Bull, Ferrari and Mercedes since Melbourne 2013.

digitalrurouni
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Re: 2019 performance speculation

Post by digitalrurouni » Mon Dec 10, 2018 2:49 pm

I am hoping the aero changes allow for cars to follow each other - all PU craziness aside!

netoperek
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Re: 2019 performance speculation

Post by netoperek » Mon Dec 10, 2018 5:56 pm

JordanMugen wrote:
Thu Dec 06, 2018 8:30 am
...
Being with Red Bull who have arguably the finest chassis in F1, gives Honda the best chance to take podium results -- even if their PU is still quite inferior to Mercedes and Ferrari.
Haven't McLaren claimed they have the best chassis and it's only because Honda's barely-suitable-for-landmower PUs are crap that they're not winning? :lol: Maybe it's an engine designed for not the absolute best chassis, so let's hope Newey get something slightly wrong :D