Honda Power Unit Hardware & Software

All that has to do with the power train, gearbox, clutch, fuels and lubricants, etc. Generally the mechanical side of Formula One.
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Wouter
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Re: Honda Power Unit Hardware & Software

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Pyrone89 wrote:
Tue Jun 30, 2020 12:30 pm

Unfortunately that is not allowed. Frozen spec for whole season. And I think the lockdown has really hurt Honda in fact, because now they cant have spec 2 and 3. If they could have gotten spec 2 that would have been good, but now I fear they will just lag behind still that little bit.
Could you please put the FIA ​​regulations here where this is stated? This is new to me. Thanks in advance.

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Pyrone89
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Wouter wrote:
Tue Jun 30, 2020 2:24 pm
Pyrone89 wrote:
Tue Jun 30, 2020 12:30 pm

Unfortunately that is not allowed. Frozen spec for whole season. And I think the lockdown has really hurt Honda in fact, because now they cant have spec 2 and 3. If they could have gotten spec 2 that would have been good, but now I fear they will just lag behind still that little bit.
Could you please put the FIA ​​regulations here where this is stated? This is new to me. Thanks in advance.
Hi,

See the official F1.com article I posted. They refer to the fact. Was also news for me.
It’s a crucial move as the Technical Regulations for this season dictate the specification a team races in the opening Grand Prix will largely be frozen for the remainder of the season, with manufacturers allowed only to make one performance upgrade to the MGU-K, energy store and control electronics elements.

Alexf1
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Just came across this article covering this topic quite extensive: https://the-race.com/formula-1/the-full ... facturers/

Bill
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During testing Honda and Redbull were pretty confident about gains made on pu side quite frankly I don't expect them to be lagging, it's Merc and Ferrari who have made extensive changes to their pu who should be worried for simple reasons that realibility issues usually pops out before pu is polished.the 4 pu were pretty matched up last so real time for excuses should be over Redbull has to deliver chassis that fight for wc

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Pyrone89
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Bill wrote:
Wed Jul 01, 2020 10:36 am
During testing Honda and Redbull were pretty confident about gains made on pu side quite frankly I don't expect them to be lagging, it's Merc and Ferrari who have made extensive changes to their pu who should be worried for simple reasons that realibility issues usually pops out before pu is polished.the 4 pu were pretty matched up last so real time for excuses should be over Redbull has to deliver chassis that fight for wc
Yes, but it also means Mercedes and Ferrari have more room for improvement. And you are allowed to do reliability fixes, but not performance fixes. So big advantage Mercedes if they really improved their architecture and only need to fix reliability.

I think Mercedes has made a huge step forward and are only waiting for the reliability fixes (which they can do freely under the new token-based rules as said) to unleash it. That would lock in yet again an advantage for the coming years as performance is frozen.

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HPD
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Re: Honda Power Unit Hardware & Software

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Yasuaki Asaki

"My goal was to catch up with the Mercedes AMG in the last year. However, due to the efficiency of the turbo, I was able to go to a good place at high altitude, but I am still losing at low altitude. "

“We have developed with the goal of catching up with Mercedes AMG even on the flat ground. If we manage to catch up this year, we will fight through the year in a way that any of the 3 strong teams can win and if we can win the championship. Is my current goal."

"I will suck out this combustion concept. For the first time after trying it, I can tell if there is extra power here or there is room for improvement, and if I improve it, I find that I can do it again (to bring out the performance) ... It's a battle to reach the final point by speeding up as much as possible.

In that sense, there is still room to spare. I've said that for a long time, but I haven't reached the final point yet. I thought I could get there by Spec 3 this year.”

"At the start of Australia, the development of Spec 2 was progressing quite a bit, but the confirmation work was delayed due to the shutdown, and some were missed. However, the development was as expected. The Austrian spec 1.1 is what I did, even though it wasn't perfect.
Some, if not all, have changed completely. Some of these are technologies that were collaborated (with other departments) following the evolution of MGU-H (*) development with Honda Jet and joint fuel development with ExxonMobil."

Honda focus in spec 1.1 is to improve reliability and durability.

This will change how you can use it in actual battle.

The radio message "Engine 11 position 5" that was talked about at the Austrian GP last year is exactly that. This was the setting of how to run by twisting out the power while allowing damage to the power unit.

When I got the victory in Austria a year ago, I started from "engine 11 position 2" and attacked until "position 7", and even borrowed the damage accumulated from the next race onward .. That's why it was an overtake play.

It will be more aggressive and usable this year. With durability, you can do that.

"This development has the highest reliability, but if it becomes more reliable, you can use the power mode more. The combustion system is also slightly higher, and the turbo is changed in addition to the combustion system. We are considering how to use it, how to attack it, and how to protect it, along with the results of durability confirmation at HRD Sakura.”
#googleTranslate

https://sportiva.shueisha.co.jp/clm/mot ... split_amg/

gruntguru
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When I got the victory in Austria a year ago, I started from "engine 11 position 2" and attacked until "position 7", and even borrowed the damage accumulated from the next race onward .. That's why it was an overtake play.
Awesome that they have such a handle on engine degradation that they can deliberately trade some engine life for temporary performance and still have the confidence to use that engine at the next race.
je suis charlie

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Wouter
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Re: Honda Power Unit Hardware & Software

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HPD wrote:
Wed Jul 01, 2020 10:05 pm
Yasuaki Asaki

"My goal was to catch up with the Mercedes AMG in the last year. However, due to the efficiency of the turbo, I was able to go to a good place at high altitude, but I am still losing at low altitude. "
............................................
#googleTranslate

https://sportiva.shueisha.co.jp/clm/mot ... split_amg/
Thanks for the link of the article @HPD. Unfortunately You forgot the most important first sentence. :D :wink:

 今年のホンダは、パワーと信頼性でメルセデスAMGに並ぶ。

This year Honda is on par with Mercedes-AMG for power and reliability. =D> \:D/

GhostF1
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Honda being able to squeeze the 1.1 out in time for race 1 is a big plus. They got that crucial durability update out and as per the new rules, they still have scope to introduce one more update during the season. So Spec 2 or whatever they choose to label it should be the final form in relation to the combustion system that Asaki mentions as Spec 3.

Either way it's damn close now and I expect the racing to be unreal!

Alexf1
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Re: Honda Power Unit Hardware & Software

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GhostF1 wrote:
Thu Jul 02, 2020 9:13 am
Honda being able to squeeze the 1.1 out in time for race 1 is a big plus. They got that crucial durability update out and as per the new rules, they still have scope to introduce one more update during the season. So Spec 2 or whatever they choose to label it should be the final form in relation to the combustion system that Asaki mentions as Spec 3.

Either way it's damn close now and I expect the racing to be unreal!
Then spec 3 would have to be largely software update as under the new rules engine hardware is almost completely frozen during this season. (As I understand it)

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Sieper
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Maybe (if the rumour is true and all 6 mercedes engine were replaced last minute) they have also been able to upgrade theirs? I believe you are correct in stating the ICE and turbo itself is frozen for the whole season. Only mgu-h an CE Etc. May be upgraded once.
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Wouter
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Sieper wrote:
Thu Jul 02, 2020 10:49 am
Maybe (if the rumour is true and all 6 mercedes engine were replaced last minute) they have also been able to upgrade theirs? I believe you are correct in stating the ICE and turbo itself is frozen for the whole season. Only mgu-h an CE Etc. May be upgraded once.
The rumour was partly true. :D
About the engine:

This year no changes will be allowed for major combustion engine components, the turbocharger, MGU-H or fuel and engine oil. These have been vital areas for improvement in recent years.

Only one change will be permitted for the MGU-K, control electronics and energy store, but these cannot be changed again before the end of 2021.

Manufacturers will be allowed to make one change to ICE components, the turbo, MGU-H and fuel/engine oil between the start of the 2021 season and the end, and the same again for 2022 and 2023.

fellowhoodlums
fellowhoodlums
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Re: Honda Power Unit Hardware & Software

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Just checking with Mercedes and they brought reliability improvements from test to Melbourne, nothing performance related it seems.

Honda got from test to spec 1.1 and it sounds like a performance focus.

For sure it all bodes well for Honda, they have themselves on a par with Mercedes and with the restrictions, it will be tight between them next season too.

trinidefender
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Re: Honda Power Unit Hardware & Software

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Listening to the Honda PU on free practice it sounds incredible....all the odd noises, honda definitely doing some interesting things.

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etusch
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Honda's engine working sound under pit limiter is very similar to their motogp engine sound under pit limiter