A letter from Max

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Shaddock
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Re: A letter from Max

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ISLAMATRON wrote:just pointing out the truth
The voting isn't rigged, the people just have to keep voting until the EU gets the right result. Ask the Irish! then ask them again... and again..

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tarzoon
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Re: A letter from Max

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CMSMJ1 wrote:
ISLAMATRON wrote: No worse than so called western "democracies"
You raised the democracy aspect of the middle east...xpensive, as much as he might have before, was not fishing for a bite..

On Topic - It is amazing that the President can try to shoehorn a successor in to the seat... Perhaps a look at African politics and a coup by the army might work?
Well, Jordan is a constitutional monarchy. Theoretically there's a government. And the democratic freedom is always an arguable issue.

And Mosley is doing his best to keep a grip on F1. He's the kind of guy that would come back to haunt everyone if he was dead (no intention to curse him that badly). Honestly I don't understand what type of principles and code of ethics he follows. but it's surely not fit for a president

xpensive
xpensive
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Re: A letter from Max

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"Fishing for a bite"? Naah, not even "pointing out the truth", as that is an approach to discussion I do not belive in.

Anyway, for those who belive in democracy, the FIA makes IOC and FIFA look like the most transparable of organizations.
"I spent most of my money on wine and women...I wasted the rest"

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Ciro Pabón
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Re: A letter from Max

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x, Islam, stop it. The point is Mosley's letter and/or the chances of Vatanen and Mosley being elected.

This is Vatanen answer:
It is very sad he has done this. But they know we are leading now. If he knew they were leading he would never write such a letter. This means the tide is turning. This is what happens in an election when you challenge the establishment.
And he said this, also, about Max proposal to have the envelopes with ballots marked with the names of the delegate:
Obviously this is the key question because there is a fear of intimidation. Contrary to what Max Mosley says it cannot be foreseen how they will vote. They follow their heart and conscience.

The French laws are very good in this respect and we are seeking legal advice. It’s important that we know the ballot papers are going to be anonymous. They should not be given out in envelopes with the voters’ names on it.
If this means anything, as you can see, Bernie Ecclestone grabbed Vatanen by the arm to force him to say hello to Todt... This gets a double exclamation mark in my book. Here you have it: !! (Todt face is priceless, I think).

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qsYRmOVmwhM[/youtube]

For those of you that might be interested in what's the difference, because there is a difference, here you have the transcript of Vatanen point of view on the budget cap and the calendar:

http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2009/07/17/a ... -calendar/

Excerpts you might like to read here:
Take a look at my voting record in the European Parliament on things like block exemption, garage servicing and car taxation. I have always been on the side of the consumer. I backed legislation which allowed Finnish citizens to go abroad and import cars, which manufacturers didn’t like, but was what consumers wanted.
... and this:
Things like this (budget caps) have to be done in an intelligent way. Ferrari is a brilliant example of this. Ferrari produces only 6,000 cars per year yet is able to run its production and an F1 team, thanks to its brand value and the sponsors it is able to bring in. You can’t go to Ferrari and say “F1 is too expensive” because their business concept is sound. You have to negotiate with everybody, not just come up with proposals that would change the setup totally.
Now, I don't expect everybody to be a person of note, sane and rational, fearless and intrepid, witty and forceful, and above all, devilishly handsome like the mods here, but, pleeze, if you keep fighting about Kim-Il-Jong and arab democracies you'll never become one, and, worst of all, I'm goint to make jokes about you... and you already know how bad my jokes are. You have been forewarned.
Ciro

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WhiteBlue
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Re: A letter from Max

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Mosley has every right to take a partisan view on his successor candidates. That happens in every democratic election as well. Does Ari honestly think that freebies are going to be handed out? I don't think so. It is all part of the game if he proclaims that the sitting president should be neutral but not very credible.

It is difficult at this time to know who is ahead in the elections because the electorate can't be polled and is likely to lie like hell about their intentions as Balestre found out to his detriment.

Personally I do not like any of the candidates. If Ari wins it I will be very curious to see him change the system of representation shortly. It is the most obviously unfair feature of the FIA constitution. It helps every elected president considerably to stay in power. If he is true to his word we would see this changed within months from his presidency, if he makes it.

For the time the campaign is entertaining and will probably become even better as it goes. It appears that there will be a french hussier overseeing the election and the F1 press will probably continue to try unearthing conspiracies in a Pulitzer winning way. :lol:
Formula One's fundamental ethos is about success coming to those with the most ingenious engineering and best .............................. organization, not to those with the biggest budget. (Dave Richards)

Pup
Pup
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Re: A letter from Max

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Regardless of how one feels about Arab governance, you have to wonder at Max's lack of tact here. I mean, an Englishman and a Frenchman suggesting to a Hashemite king how they might fiddle in his affairs - just how did they expect that to go over?

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Ciro Pabón
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Re: A letter from Max

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WhiteBlue wrote:...

It is difficult at this time to know who is ahead in the elections because the electorate can't be polled and is likely to lie like hell about their intentions as Balestre found out to his detriment.

...
..and that's the point.

Which leads me to think three simple things:

- Local members of FIA clubs should be able to "bind" the vote of his representative. Better yet, in times like these, ballots should be sent directly by individual members over the net.
- When a campaign is underway there should be some restrictions on the incumbent candidate , not to mention that re-election should have a clear limit (let's say, two terms).
- Candidates should put forward a program, explaining what they think of key points, like (for example) team and circuit financing, driver careers, local club expansion and public safety.

Yes, I know, "pain is ready, pain is waiting, primed to do it's educating" but can you really stay quiet about it?
Ciro

xpensive
xpensive
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Re: A letter from Max

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I find MrM's suggestion of marking the voting envelopes with the name of the voter not only outrageous, but that it also discloses his not enough documented political background and beliefs all too well.

Such a suggestion alone should disqualify him for any assignment anywhere and be no help for Jean Todt either.

And nobody expected "freebies handed out", other than to Todt supporters of course, but some common decency perhaps?
"I spent most of my money on wine and women...I wasted the rest"

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WhiteBlue
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Re: A letter from Max

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What is this business about names on envelopes. It seems to be an inside story. I have not seen a source for this. What are the facts? If there are names on an envelope when the papers are handed out it doesn't mean that the envelope has to be used by the voter? Where does this info come from?
Formula One's fundamental ethos is about success coming to those with the most ingenious engineering and best .............................. organization, not to those with the biggest budget. (Dave Richards)

autogyro
autogyro
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Re: A letter from Max

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It is strange that Vatanen is searching for votes in the middle east.
Women are not even allowed to drive a vehicle without male supervision there.
But then Vatanen is after all only a failed Euro trough feeder and has run absolutely nothing.
Hardly a choice for president of something as important as the FIA with all it's diversity of which Vatanen knows zilch.
Jackie Stewart was over there with him, which says it all. A once great driver who has achieved little since except spending taxpayers money promoting criminal bankers.
Vatanen will damage the FIA beyond repair if he gets in, he is simply the mouth piece of the now mostly bankrupt car manufacturers,he will be poison for ordinary vehicle users.

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ISLAMATRON
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Re: A letter from Max

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autogyro wrote:Women are not even allowed to drive a vehicle without male supervision there.
As is should be... mostly kidding... but that is only truely the case in "Saudi"... and what does that have to do with the FIA?

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gcdugas
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Re: A letter from Max

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Autogyro has one post to his credit. FIA Todt supporting shill??? You decide where you have heard his recited talking points before.
Innovation over refinement is the prefered path to performance. -- Get rid of the dopey regs in F1

autogyro
autogyro
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Re: A letter from Max

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Women being treated as a lower class of human being in the middle east is very relevant to the FIA elections.
It proves that Vatanen is searching for votes at the expense of all women involved with motoring in the world. Women out there should take a very special note.
In a democracy which is not the case out there even though some members of Royal families would have you think so along with their mate Jackie Stewart, in a true democracy women would hold fifty percent of the vote equally.
Not so, where Ari is raising support women have to have male supervision to even drive a vehicle.
Bit of a joke for somebody trying to sell a so called but not explained new fairness for a world motoring organization.
In fact absolute un arguable hypocrisy from someone with absolutely no experience or track record suitable for the job.
Supporting Vatanen is a very very big mistake.

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ISLAMATRON
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Re: A letter from Max

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Not allowing them to drive without a male family member does not relegate them to being a lower class human being. Women had the right to vote and own property in Islamic Society long before they did in so called western democratic society. Stop trying to impose your values on the world, and stop using it as a reason to try and help install Todt into the FIA presidency... I hope his side has much more valid and relevent topics to discuss.

Pup
Pup
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Re: A letter from Max

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Odd, this discussion.

Irrelevant, too, since Jordan has no restrictions on women drivers.