2018 Scuderia Toro Rosso F1 Team - Honda

[McHonda]

What kind of half a second engine upgrade leaves no difference in speed traps or top speed?

You can't just assume Gasly had as good a lap because it's Gasly against Hartley. How would those assumptions have played out at Mercedes and McLaren?

Hartley had 2ths on Gasly in S3 which is just two straights and a chicane so at least start from there before jumping to half a second for little good reason.

Hartley had the highest speed trap in one of FPs. Also power through the whole range is what matters not just highest power and could make an effect when you have an accelerate/brake/accelerate... situation - even on slight corner in the middle of the straight - you have to go off and back on the throttle - there you would also notice the power difference in the time measurement.

But some of those 0.5s, could be down to older/worn engine, a 0.2-0.3 would be more realistic, I guess - maybe someone with more background knowledge could provide us with a better explanation.

Was that the FP he was complaining about the low downforce set up? I'm aware of what kind of differences a speed trap misses but that never seems to matter when Honda top it. Maybe Hartley was running more wing as the extra power allowed him to, there are a lot of possibilities but the argument for a half second engine gain is literally because that's the gap between the drivers which is all manner of silly. Hartley looked faster all weekend anyway.

All we know is there was not much of any difference in those traps outside S1 but a 2ths advantage in S3, and that's it.

[McMika98]

What kind of half a second engine upgrade leaves no difference in speed traps or top speed?

You can't just assume Gasly had as good a lap because it's Gasly against Hartley. How would those assumptions have played out at Mercedes and McLaren?

Hartley had 2ths on Gasly in S3 which is just two straights and a chicane so at least start from there before jumping to half a second for little good reason.

Ever heard of terminal velocity, thats what is causing a flat speed between all cars, obviously cars with low drag config likes of FI have slighter higher values. Why isnt mercedes few kph over Toro rosso with supposedly 50hp power going faster.

Look at the acceleration and speed at various sectors, clearly gets between two points quicker with new engine.

[McHonda]

What kind of half a second engine upgrade leaves no difference in speed traps or top speed?

You can't just assume Gasly had as good a lap because it's Gasly against Hartley. How would those assumptions have played out at Mercedes and McLaren?

Hartley had 2ths on Gasly in S3 which is just two straights and a chicane so at least start from there before jumping to half a second for little good reason.

Ever heard of terminal velocity, thats what is causing a flat speed between all cars, obviously cars with low drag config likes of FI have slighter higher values. Why isnt mercedes few kph over Toro rosso with supposedly 50hp power going faster.

Look at the acceleration and speed at various sectors, clearly gets between two points quicker with new engine.

You think STR don't have low drag config? But again we're back to much deeper investigation into speed trap numbers than usual. Why?

They were 5.5kph apart in S1 (Wouldn't mind seeing Gasly's onboard as that has mistake written all over it)
1.4kph apart in S2
0.4kph apart in S3
Dead even Max speed

Those are the only facts. I think Hartley hinted at it being more of a sizeable race upgrade than a qualifying one anyway.

What's the evidence of a half second upgrade?

[McMika98]

There you go, dont be blinded by the top speed which is just a result of car config. Its meaningless and any car can be run to have high top speed but at a cost of laptime. No they didnt setup for top speed as they went much quicker in Free practise.

TR were on same top speed range as Ferrari and Mercedes but sector speeds on acceleration tells us the story, between top engines and Honda, as well as the old and new engine. 5.5kph is a lot based on acceleration.

[MMMMMMMM]

Acoording to motorsport it’s:
Mercedes
Ferrari - 10 to 12 hp
Renault - 27 hp
Honda - 50+ hp

The article is in italian, and they are generally disappointed by the Honda qualy performance.

https://it.motorsport.com/f1/news/anali ... a/3119544/

[McHonda]

There you go, dont be blinded by the top speed which is just a result of car config. Its meaningless and any car can be run to have high top speed but at a cost of laptime. No they didnt setup for top speed as they went much quicker in Free practise.

TR were on same top speed range as Ferrari and Mercedes but sector speeds on acceleration tells us the story, between top engines and Honda, as well as the old and new engine. 5.5kph is a lot based on acceleration.

Jesus the fact it's similar to Mercedes is what tells you they have a low downforce config. Just because it's not as low as they've gone when it was undriveable for Hartley in FP doesn't mean it's not low downforce. And again, you don't have to tell me what speed traps hide,lol. This is the most a speed trap figure has been questioned in this topic all year, since winter testing they've been drooled over when it suits.

5.5 is a lot, which is why it screams of a mistake as it's not a repeated gap elsewhere and is the slowest of everyone in S1.

So what's the evidence of a 0.5 gain then?

[ArcticWolfie]

Maybe it was just a shitty sensor and might get the engine back for the race.

[hasika]

https://members.f1-life.net/race/70272/
https://headlines.yahoo.co.jp/hl?a=2018 ... 9-rcg-moto

As gasly will start in 16th gird position,so Honda consider changeing a spare set of new spec PU for him and take penalty as a option.
But no news yet.

[techman]

interesting news. i hope they do , because gasly had the pace. unlike brendon who was very lucky gasly had this issue. brendon is not a racer. if it was alonso in brendon place, it probably could be 0.5 faster than the time harlty did. just replace the damn engine. only few place lost. sometime these japanese are just scarred to be brave. one reason mclowns got them bashed for everything.

[McHonda]

Jesus the fact it's similar to Mercedes is what tells you they have a low downforce config. Just because it's not as low as they've gone when it was undriveable for Hartley in FP doesn't mean it's not low downforce.

So what's the evidence of a 0.5 gain then?

Oh really. Which school did you get your aero degree? Everyone is running low downforce, how do you know whcih is more low than others, the top speed figures? Isnt that your point.

Anyways back to the topic of engine, you cant deny there is a gain. Sitback and enjoy the race.

I never tried to deny there was a gain. I'm questioning why some seem to think it's a 5th gain.

Hartley points to it being more influential during the race so should be good and as long as he keeps his nose clean I think he'll get a point or two. I think Gasly will get pretty close too even if he has to take a penalty.

[Sayeman]

I am happy with Harley's progress, he has been working hard to improve and the results are showing. Not easy to keep motivating yourself when people ask you when you are gonna get replaced all the time.

[Sayeman]

According to Speedweek reports, Red Bull is likely to make the switch to Honda, Ricciardo will extend contract to 2020.

From an insider in the Redbull camp - "The progress on Honda is obvious. I am convinced that Honda will overtake Renault in 2019."

http://www.speedweek.com/formel1/news/1 ... iardo.html

https://translate.google.nl/translate?s ... t=&act=url

[techman]

good to hear. redbull honda has a good ring to it. i hope its true. woooo

[nzjrs]

After reviewing the post qualification interviews, the sector and qualifying times from the previous races, I'm inclined to now believe that Hartley just had a good qualifying, especially reading together with his Monaco weekend.

Let's see how the update performs in the race - at least Hartley mentioned it should be better in race trim.

[Revs84]

There, you got what you asked for.

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/gasl ... e-1045463/