Post here all non technical related topics about Formula One. This includes race results, discussions, testing analysis etc. TV coverage and other personal questions should be in Off topic chat.
bizadfar wrote:
Australia: Hamilton held in traffic. Even if his fuel stop was a bit slower. Pit crew arn't robots you know. I bet you'd take 25sec to change 1 tire. Simply because you don't know what you're up against, and making stupid comments.
"Hamilton's Mclaren SUDDENLY" Its called Formula 1. Comprehend the race properly. He was struggling with the rear sliding and these tires do NOT like it. So you could imagine the faster dropoff of pace. In the pitstop they probably reduced front wing (they definately adjusted it). So that's your answer...
Do your own clear thinking and research before making such stupid nutcase comments.
I would love to learn your thoughts on McLarens team order in Australia 1998.. Was it fair to treat Coulthard that way? After all it was the FIRST RACE of the season and David was no rookie.
DId you even watch that race? I've been going to the Aus GP since 1996. I was a huge Mika supporter. So this may seem bias. But yes he deserved it. He had a higher pace than Coulthard and basically served a drive through for "miscommunication" He was fastest on the day... Then again drivers can choose to dishonour team orders like in Imola... 82 i think it was.
Driver standings to date:
F. Alonso McLaren 22
K. Räikkönen Ferrari 22
L. Hamilton McLaren 22
McLaren chief executive Martin Whitmarsh says Lewis Hamilton is clear to fight for the F1 drivers' crown this season as the rookie drew level on points with Fernando Alonso and Kimi Raikkonen - the trio tied at the head of the table with 22 points. http://f1.gpupdate.net/en/news/2007/04/ ... e_mclaren/
This statement and facts do not support any theory of "team orders" in Mclaren
DaveKillens wrote:Driver standings to date:
F. Alonso McLaren 22
K. Räikkönen Ferrari 22
L. Hamilton McLaren 22
McLaren chief executive Martin Whitmarsh says Lewis Hamilton is clear to fight for the F1 drivers' crown this season as the rookie drew level on points with Fernando Alonso and Kimi Raikkonen - the trio tied at the head of the table with 22 points. http://f1.gpupdate.net/en/news/2007/04/ ... e_mclaren/
This statement and facts do not support any theory of "team orders" in Mclaren
Give up Dave - you're being perfectly logical and rational!
It's a shame people can't simply enjoy the racing for the on-track action. These are the same people who want their football teams to get fouls/free kicks to win (ie they need help from the officials!).
Can the FIA police team orders? Probably not; it's just too easy to make a slightly skewed pit call and swap drivers. The FIA know this, they are not stupid. What should never happen again is an obvious situation like Ferrari/Austria - that is one the FIA could cry "foul" with.
Are McLaren practising team orders?
Australia - While watching the race I had a sneaking feeling that they gave FA an advantage at the stops. HOWEVER - reading post race reports and lap charts; it looks more likely that FA simply had a great race. So, if you like - I can understand why you started to see team orders.
Malaysia - In this case, it really looked like Lewis was genuinely struggling with pace and FA wasn't. McLaren had JUST enough pace to keep Ferrari behind. Hamilton drove a helluva race to keep the opposition behind. That's called racing for your team (& yourself) - not evil team orders. If you thought there were team orders in Oz. - this must have looked like proof; however, the evidence was not really there.
Time to bring this topic back up as the FIA just issued a statement saying they will investigate McLaren for the use of team orders.
All I wonder is why it took the FIA so long...? McLaren has "controlled" their drivers with FA as no 1 and LH as no 2 from the beginning of this season.
Now in Monaco it was clear that LH had much more pace in his car for tha latter part of the race but was undeniably radio`d by the team and told not to challenge Alonso!
This is not legal!!
The FIA now has a chanche to clean up McLarens team order tactics once and for all...OR let FA keep his undeserved advantages.
Reminds me of AS vs AP, MH vs DC....McLaren never changed their tactics..they always denied it but always used it...still after it`s become illigal.
What is a suitable punishment???
Well a full disqualification from the Monaco GP is definitly in order. And probably 1 or 2 race bans for the coming GP`s aswell.
If the FIA do NOT act to this rule breaking then what rule is next to go out the window?
Simon: Nils? You can close in now. Nils?
John McClane: [on the guard's phone] Attention! Attention! Nils is dead! I repeat, Nils is dead, ----head. So's his pal, and those four guys from the East German All-Stars, your boys at the bank? They're gonna be a little late.
Simon: [on the phone] John... in the back of the truck you're driving, there's $13 billon dollars worth in gold bullion. I wonder would a deal be out of the question?
John McClane: [on the phone] Yeah, I got a deal for you. Come out from that rock you're hiding under, and I'll drive this truck up your ass.
Murphy's 9th Law of Technology:
Tell a man there are 300 million stars in the universe and he'll believe you. Tell him a bench has wet paint on it and he'll have to touch to be sure.
I agree with Trollrso: McLaren has issued team orders.
Evidently somebody (perhaps Ron Dennis himself!) has said to Alonso:
- Go and kick Lewis "rear wing"
Somebody else has said the same to Lewis:
- Go and kick Alonso's "gearbox" as hard as you can!
Of course, I'm using euphemisms. The real radio orders mentioned the word "*ss", instead of "gearbox" or "rearwing" but this is a decent forum.
I haven't heard the radio orders personally (besides, they disguise them with a code, the fiends!), but somebody told me he has a friend that has a florist that has a friend that heard they were posted in some forum.
You could be confused by the terminology used, but the code is simple (evident!): "Faster, moron!" means "Slow down, dear friend" and "WTF those mechanics think they were doing" means "You have to stay for 2.5 seconds in the pits".
I strongly disagree with this policy. They (Alonso and Hamilton) should hold hands before starting the race and stare at each other with pride and love, in front of cameras, as a magnificent example of coordination and lack of personal ambition. Lewis should learn to dance flamenco and Alonso should abandon red wine for tea.
They haven't done that, ergo, team orders.
A two-races suspension is little for the magnitude of the sin. If Michael was demoted to the back of the grid once at Monaco for an innocent manouver, Alonso deserves to be expelled from the championship forever!
Two and a half seconds! That's like 30 or 40 tenths of a second in european imperial units. TWO AND A HALF SECONDS! They shouldn't allow Alonso to drive karts anymore. Hey, he shouldn't be allowed to use public transportation, either. That man is a danger on any vehicle.
FIA must act quickly. Before too long Barrichello will hurt Button pride, by kicking his "button" (note: that's another euphemism) at every race, instead of holding hands, like true, real teammates. First one of them wins, then the other, that's the way it should be. Evidently, Honda is skewed toward brazilians. As a matter of fact, did you know that "Honda" is a brazilian word? Do you need further proof?
What about Coulthard? This guy thinks he is "better" than Klien! Just because Mr. David has the record of most points in history for a british driver he thinks he was better than Christian last year! Team orders, team orders... I assure you. You MUST believe me.
I have proof: somebody told me! It's not that Coulthard beat Klien: it's team orders.
Shame on you, David. We tolerated your playboyish behaviour, even your gray beard.... but to destroy through clever connivances, collusions and in cahoots with the team principal the emotions and hopes of Christian, a young, innocent, tender man that lacks ambition (as all the drivers in the grid do) it's despicable... we will never forgive you, David Corehard!
I could go on and on. You just have to think about Fisichella and Kovalainen. Team orders. Flavio has a heavy hand...
OMG, where have the old spirit of "compete, not win" gone? Remember Barrichello and Schumacher? That was the true spirit of gentle competition: Schumacher won almost all the time, not because he was better, but because Rubens have a gentle soul. Evidently, Rubens should have some words with Ron Dennis, to teach him some humility. Specially after lapping the entire field at Monaco.
Let's hope FIA, in its rational and popular style cracks down on McLaren. I think I speak for all fans if I say we'll be delighted watching Alonso and Hamilton out of the competition for the WDC.
What could be better for F1? Besides, Kimi would have a chance.
(VERY, EXTREMELY, REALLY IMPORTANT NOTE: if someone answer this post thinking I'm serious, well... what can I say? I'll never confess I received orders from my team to post this).
