Matechitz-"We don't manipulate things like Ferrari do."

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Do you support RBs "Equal" policy?

Yes. Good for them.
25
51%
No. They just tossed away a WDC.
9
18%
Matechitz is crazy
15
31%
 
Total votes: 49

Agenda_Is_Incorrect
Agenda_Is_Incorrect
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Joined: 12 Jun 2010, 00:07

Re: Matechitz-"We don't manipulate things like Ferrari do."

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Mateschitz wrote:"We have never even thought about it as long as both our drivers remain in the hunt for the championship. So a second place under correct circumstances might be better than a win on grounds of orders and confirmations."
Maybe the most important part of the interview?

So, team orders are horrible and all only if his team is winning. If not, then it's acceptable. I guess he's either trying very hard to avoid team orders but know deep down that this is a team sport and it might be necessary and not wrong or he is just trying to do marketing and being a big hypocrite who would be better off not talking.

I guess it's time people in F1 and we, the fans, stop seeing or marketing F1 as if it was not a team effort that require things that might seem wrong but are not. Belatti's post illustrate that wishful thinking of F1 fans sometimes. Yes we all like to see competition between team-mates and people/corporations with ethics first, but after some time into the championship it's not only natural as it's noting wrong to start prioritizing the team. Your local community commerce will do that just as much on average as multinational companies BTW.

Obviously some team orders are wrong and unwanted and the trial of hiding them is just as bad, but that's an issue of separating necessary/correct team orders from wrong ones. Ferrari has managed them really badly for instance, but other teams might do it properly.

We will only know if Red Bull is true to their speech if at the end of the race Webber is the only possible winner and would need help from Vettel. If they don't make the swap it's something to applaud for indeed, but doesn't give them the right to say every other team doing orders is wrong. If they do swap them, as he pretty much already admitted, then he could have not spoken anything or could have done a public apology.

Not to get into the issue of Vettel supposedly being favoured, but without evidence or a declaration from Webber (which would be probably also his dismissal from the team) this is all very hard to prove. But if Webber's bursts were true then we all should take this as a big marketing move from RB and an extra confirmation that we and the FIA should accept the fact of F1 being a team sport and the necessity of better rules about this.
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flynfrog
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Re: Matechitz-"We don't manipulate things like Ferrari do."

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there is zero chance that Vettle will finish in front of Webber if Alonso is in third. Redbull are to smart for that.

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Re: Matechitz-"We don't manipulate things like Ferrari do."

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I believe the very reason for Mateschitz (or "Didi" as one of this forum's missing members would call him with the deepest of endearment) speaking out, is that a deal has been done. Webber will indeed be matched to his WDC, but Vettel will be the one looking good, taking pole, the start, being in command, but only as long as Webber's WDC isn't under threat.

Conclusively, Webber will leave for Renault next season, replaced by someone of a lesser threat to Wunderkind.
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Sean H
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Re: Matechitz-"We don't manipulate things like Ferrari do."

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Webbers Q3 tells me the decision has already been made. It is Vettel or nothing.
"The car is slow in the straights and doesn't work well in the corners." JV

segedunum
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Re: Matechitz-"We don't manipulate things like Ferrari do."

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To be fair, Webber has had every chance to win the championship. He's not be in a position like poor Massa. If he'd stayed in the race in Korea he'd be laughing now, but today's qualifying position just tells you that he hasn't got it when it matters.

It looks like Webber will be leaving. He's not going to the Pirelli test next week. However, is the wunderkind really that good? I think Alonso or Hamilton would have beaten him handsomely in that Red Bull.

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Re: Matechitz-"We don't manipulate things like Ferrari do."

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Perhaps my analysis was all wrong seg, this here situation is a deadringer for Carlos Reutemann in 1981 to me.

With a team that didn't really want to se him as the new WDC, he cracked under pressure.
"I spent most of my money on wine and women...I wasted the rest"

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Ray
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Re: Matechitz-"We don't manipulate things like Ferrari do."

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It says alot that Webber signed a contract and then his front wing was taken from his, because of Vettels mistake not Webbers, and now he won't be going to the Pirelli test? Red Bull management are really trying to blow smoke up everyones ass. You don't take a part from one car to another because of the trailing drivers mistake, and you don't take the guy behind in points to your tire test if you don't favor him.

Has Webber made mistakes? Of course, everyone has. But his compatriot robbed him of a win by running into him and is trailing in points. I don't care what anyone says, you are behind trying to pass and you hit the leader and he's your teammate if you're the idiot and at fault. No different than it happening on a public road. All fo Red Bulls action show playing favorites if I've ever seen it. No matter how they try and play innocent.

LionKing
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Re: Matechitz-"We don't manipulate things like Ferrari do."

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What was Vettel's fault when the front wing failed??? I think there was also reports that Webber actually did not want the new wing in the first place....

Secondly you make it sound like Vettel hit Webber from behind :) When the Turkey incident happened, Vettel's car was a half a car length in front, he was not behind.... If you watch the replays, Vettel's right side-pod touched with Webbers' front left tire. They both made mistakes there!! Vettel steered a bit too quickly to the right after passing and Webber squeezed his team mate on the left a bit too much and did not move right when Vettel's car was in front, to give more room for the incoming corner all.

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Ray
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Re: Matechitz-"We don't manipulate things like Ferrari do."

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Might not have been Vettels fault that his wing failed, I'll have to watch my recorded practice again to see for sure, but given Webbers 'Number two driver' comments over the radio after his win pretty much said it all. He wasn't happy about them taking parts of his car to give to his 'equal' teammate. I'd be pissed too, whether or not I wanted the wing more than the previous version. You don't take parts of the car of your car to give to an 'equal' teammate for any reason, he can do without. If he had blown his trans should they have taken that too? Of course not and it was very clear that Webber was very unhappy about it.

About the Turkey incident, Webber gave Vettel barely enough room to go down the inside. The overtaking driver hit the leader, doesn't matter how, doesn't matter why. You make contact overtaking someone that doesn't move over on you, and you turn right too soon, it's your fault. He tried to overtake him, he had barely enough room and turned into Webber crashing himself and robbing Webber of a potential win. Simple as that. The leader is under no obligation to make room or move over to allow the overtaking driver enough room to make a corner. If Vettel couldn't make it stick there he should have backed off and got him there the next lap or somewhere else. I'd be willing to bet he could have, but it was another stupid mistake and everyone seems to believe that the leader should have given him every inch he needed to pass and not fought him for it. That's not racing.

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FW17
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Joined: 06 Jan 2010, 10:56

Re: Matechitz-"We don't manipulate things like Ferrari do."

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Ray wrote:Might not have been Vettels fault that his wing failed, I'll have to watch my recorded practice again to see for sure, but given Webbers 'Number two driver' comments over the radio after his win pretty much said it all. He wasn't happy about them taking parts of his car to give to his 'equal' teammate. I'd be pissed too, whether or not I wanted the wing more than the previous version. You don't take parts of the car of your car to give to an 'equal' teammate for any reason, he can do without. If he had blown his trans should they have taken that too? Of course not and it was very clear that Webber was very unhappy about it.
1) The number 2 driver had an upgraded floor at silverstone.

2) The team's technical director made the call on switching the wing at silverstone.

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FW17
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Joined: 06 Jan 2010, 10:56

Re: Matechitz-"We don't manipulate things like Ferrari do."

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Ray wrote: About the Turkey incident, Webber gave Vettel barely enough room to go down the inside. The overtaking driver hit the leader, doesn't matter how, doesn't matter why. You make contact overtaking someone that doesn't move over on you, and you turn right too soon, it's your fault. He tried to overtake him, he had barely enough room and turned into Webber crashing himself and robbing Webber of a potential win. Simple as that. The leader is under no obligation to make room or move over to allow the overtaking driver enough room to make a corner. If Vettel couldn't make it stick there he should have backed off and got him there the next lap or somewhere else. I'd be willing to bet he could have, but it was another stupid mistake and everyone seems to believe that the leader should have given him every inch he needed to pass and not fought him for it. That's not racing.
I Wonder if you saw number 2 driver at;

1) Australia

2) Valancia

3) Singapore

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raymondu999
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Re: Matechitz-"We don't manipulate things like Ferrari do."

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Don't forget Korea
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Steven
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Re: Matechitz-"We don't manipulate things like Ferrari do."

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These last X posts are all related to specific GP's and have been discussed in their own race threads.

The season is now over, no need to speculate anymore. Thread closed.