Mercedes AMG F1 Team 2012

[user001]

I read some articles that Airtel, Mercedes AMG Formula One Team tie up!

according to this http://www.airtel.in/wps/wcm/connect/Ab ... ounce-race its only for the indian grand prix or did you read an article about more?

[spadeflush]

It is only for the Indian GP. They are running a lot of advertisements and contests here. Airtel is also the official sponsor of the Indian GP.

[Raptor22]

1.3 and 1.5 seconds slower than Vettel in final practice.......oh dear oh dear.

What happened too "this track really suits our car! We'll go well here"

Looks like we'll be scrapping with the Force India's and the Sauber's today, tomorrow and forever after

Coca-Cola? Oh dear. can't remember them ever sponsoring something successful. its coming down to a League of inextraordinary gentlemen

[Cocles]

Coca-Cola? Oh dear. can't remember them ever sponsoring something successful. its coming down to a League of inextraordinary gentlemen

Geez Raptor, now you're even dumping on the possible Coca-Cola deal? Really?

As for practice. Who knows. Nico was faster, which is inconsistent with the trend these days. Schumie thinks they can make Q3... guess we'll know soon.

[clipsy1H]

Coca-Cola? Oh dear. can't remember them ever sponsoring something successful. its coming down to a League of inextraordinary gentlemen

Geez Raptor, now you're even dumping on the possible Coca-Cola deal? Really?

As for practice. Who knows. Nico was faster, which is inconsistent with the trend these days. Schumie thinks they can make Q3... guess we'll know soon.

Coca-Cola never sponsored a team or something like that! they are to other level (World Cup and Olympics Games), never but never Cola will invest over 50 millions in F1 just for branding .... ( do you think they need more branding ) and also Petronas will not be replaced only chance is to replace Monster but also i don't think....

ON: both car in Q3 (P10 and P9) Nico beat Michael and let's hope no incidents tomorrow in first corner (will be for sure )

[marcush.]

I´m surprised most by the passivity of Daimler in all those years . One could say they are really patient with Brawn and his guys to build the team ...but how long should one give credit ? They have changed direction quicker than a lightning ,first emphasizing their "lean"structure then turning around recruiting every "bighead" unable to reach the top of a tree in less than 3 seconds..they asked for this asked for that and every wish was signed off ...but ..there is no light at the end of the tunnel ..discounting "Messiah" Hamilton who should drag them out of obscurity alone?
They have a habit of contradicting themselves and announcing very often things that pan out very differently and force them to reannounce modified views ...all seemingly just made up to save their ass from the board.
The real lack is -they are not competitive most of the time -unable to grasp the reasons for being too slow in a time window they could actually use to rectify their speed deficit.
So all the new people just did not have the impact needed.
They need a group of people who are not afraid to take decisions and turn things upside down at short notice if the need arises.To me it looks all just awfully sluggish like a big ship in the storm ..it ´s moving yes but no ways it can get where it wants to go with any prcision.

[user001]

They have been innovative in the last two years. exhaust in 2011 car, wheelbase 2012 ddrs but it didn't work out. Besides all this restructuring:

Why did they upgrade the windtunnel to 60% not until now? I mean ok this takes time. As also with the state of the art simulator they also not had until now.

Regarding all this "NON"development during a season. Besides Merc giving money for new top guys. Could it be, that Mercedes GP inherited debt form Brawn GP? Brawn GP fired up to 60 % (!!!) of all its staff. Does anybody know how much a new driving simulator costs? Does anybody has a clue how much the new/upgraded windtunnel costs? For sure Merc has a strong financial backing but we do not know about the income and cost structure in detail. Maybe this will be all better next year when all those investments are made. But I doubt that. The technical development/improvement of the upgrades comes and goes with the better correlation with the wind tunnel. But is this the only reason?

I mean now with the coanda exhaust merc is still 1.2 - 1.4 sec away from pole time. How can that be with the overall basis of the car wasn't so bad? I doubt there will be much improvement next year. Also because all those guys (costa, elliot, willis) are mostly working on their own and manpower is splittet for 2013 and 2014 development.

[marcush.]

Their tunnel was laid out for 100% cpability back in 2007 .So the adjustment of modelsize was a matter of adapting model size (new Windtunnel model + added instrumentation to measure the greater detail possible with 60%model size) .the rest should have been a reshaping of the tunnel walls (calibrating and correlating tunnel results to real life) .We have seen them use on car probes on the young driver test recently so presumably this is what happened rrecently..
It may well be they took the chance to install PIV now (if it were not already part of their system)?

As with the simulator ..you just have to look no further as Raikkonen ..The driver in the loop simulation is useful for Rookie
training -getting accustomed to all the switches and the complexity of all thinsg rushing at you when you are new to f1 ..but for an established pro the Simulator is pretty much a nice to have if you are willing to bear the nausea..

There are very useful multi physics simulation packages around though -like ADAMS for example which are indeed instrumental to arrive at the track runing and not wondering which set of springs might be the choice..

[Raptor22]

They'e not innovative and poor follower.


Last year they developed a Exhaust that was most similar to the current COndoleeza Exhaust yet they completely missed the evlution of that design.
They dabbled with interinked suspension and made nothing of it.
They evolved passive F0duct into DDRS and found it to be a performance neutral and a blind alley.

The only area they made some progress with is tyre use.

[marcush.]

I would not say they are NOT innovating .
I´d say they have a poor understanding of in which basket to put their eggs in development :
blade type rollhoop
integrated wheelnuts
side exit exhaust
double stacked radiators
Nose heights
ultrashort wheelbase
passive F-duct
ddrs

None of all this really set the world on fire even if some of the developments have been inherited by others and even made to work.

What I seriously don´t understand :
Why not develop a failsave wheelretention system
Why not come up with a serious solution to do away with the blockage between front wheels and moncoque (Brakeductless brakedrums)
Why not use the expertise in MGP and AMG high performance engines to produce a fully integrated KERS/Battery package mounting inside the gearbox -as RedBulls- with the recources available to Daimler they could have made this more compact and efficient -freeing up valauable space for the Fuel tank.

[user001]

i also think that one point of the last years was/is. though development of a seasons next car a streamline design has been disturbed when new people came in and also wanted to have their influence in next years car or had to cope with the design if some who was leaving..

what throw them back last year was the cooling problem. and after solving that they found out, that due to the short wheelbase the airflow under the car was too little and so forth. i've hoped they would gain much more downforce now with the new exhaust in order to ride with more downforce at the frontwing as they reduced it to balance the car. i am still astounded they are so far away from pole. 1,2 secs. its a shame.

does anybody know, due to the fact that regulations stay mainly the same if the next car will be a evolution or new design (would be worthless looking at 2014).

[marcush.]

Bell was interviewed last year about his views on car design and he basically said that you will never start with a clean sheet of paper (an empty screen these days).
Look you got a set of rules plus you got CATIA V5 and you are associated to an OEM so presumably you will use the environment everyone is designing their automotive stuff in (OEM Startmodell) .
The set of rules and your general design ideas will create a comprehensive set of constraint in which you will design your car -it´s not like you could design in free space.
It definetly makes sense to load the old car into your work and as this was already parametrically designed it will adjust itself to the new cornerstones .If you have set your constrints wisely all will cater for itself and you can concentrate on
reworking those areas you really want to change .
The lineage of W0x cars clearly shows they are indeed following this approach ,especially the cockpit surround seems unvahnged over the years -an area they seem to be very happy with or they simply don´t have recources left to try and improve that area.

[user001]

i came up with another idea why the new exhaust does not have the impact we wish for. I don't know when it was, but after hockenheim the team may only use the engine-mappings they used and defined in the first four races.

they said it would be no problem but i don't think so.

this could also be the problem with lotus and their coanda upgrade.

[marcush.]

i came up with another idea why the new exhaust does not have the impact we wish for. I don't know when it was, but after hockenheim the team may only use the engine-mappings they used and defined in the first four races.

they said it would be no problem but i don't think so.

this could also be the problem with lotus and their coanda upgrade.

This was the quoted reason for MGPs reluctance to introduce a Coanda exhaust a few months back (in AMuS) As I understand the teams are allowed to use any of the engine manufacturers maps in use in the first 4 races?

Talk is the reduced diameter of exhaust endtip for Coanda will rob some maximum power -so one would assume the mappings need to differ....

But Lotus seems reasonably happy with their new exhaust ?

on a differnt note:

Daimler has already stated they would force Ecclestone out of Formula 1 in case the accusations for corruption are investigated further..
Or alternatively make use of their right to terminate the contract to avoid being brought into connection with people who do not adhere to "clean" business.This is not over yet.
I´m sure Ecclestone will not bow ...but Daimler has no choice but stick to their own company policy as they are under scruteenity due to fallout with US laws not so long ago.

[snoop1050]

i came up with another idea why the new exhaust does not have the impact we wish for. I don't know when it was, but after hockenheim the team may only use the engine-mappings they used and defined in the first four races.

i thought they could use the same engine maps as anyone they had supplied engines to?