Mercedes AMG F1 Team 2012

[Cam]

Didn't Brawn pitch to the board a masterplan recently? I'm quite sure that with them investing in Hamilton and all that, their team budget will go up. Not an insane amount, but with whatever additional investments and budgeting Brawn had already outlined.

Wow, that's actually quite a slap to Schumacher isn't it? It's like saying "he's not worth investing in the team, Hamilton though, different story". Says absolute nothing for Rosberg. Makes me wonder about the actual team ethos in there.

[raymondu999]

I can compartmentalise brushing Schumacher off due to the instability of the situation due to his indecision. But IMO bringing Lewis in to lead the team is a slap to Nico, because they obviously don't feel Nico can lead the team.

[ArchAngel]

I just wanna say: Red Bull has a budget of over 300 million euros. Mercedes about 140 mio euros. that should describe enough in terms of in season development capabilities and so forth....

don't know if they (merc) will increase the budget from next year on... just imagine: red bull for instance changed and rebuilt their car 31(!) times so far in this season. what about merc? 5-7?

enough said.

Enough said?

And what about the budgets of Lotus and Sauber? Or even Force India, Williams and Torro Rosso, who are now all faster than Mercedes AMG? A marquee works team getting their collective butts handed to them by customer teams and perennial midfielders operating at only a fraction of their budget, facilities, manpower, etc?

Despite the team's numerous claims of daunting challenges on the organizational & engineering front, none of those absolves them from the fact that smaller teams with no/less big names and who are also dealing with their own problems are now doing a much better job than what this team is pretending to do.

Sorry if that might seem harsh or bitter in any way for some of you. Three consecutive years of big talk, small results, endless excuses and the inevitable disappointments can do that to you.

[Cam]

Not at all. I would consider most agree to some point with you.

I don't think budget plays the key part in winning or loosing. There are many examples where the small guy can punch well above his weight, simply by having the right attitude and the right pieces in the right spots. Having a stable team that trusts its leaders, good ideas that bare fruit and solidarity when it all goes wrong - are worth far more than buckets of cash and usually produce higher yields.

[Raptor22]

I just wanna say: Red Bull has a budget of over 300 million euros. Mercedes about 140 mio euros. that should describe enough in terms of in season development capabilities and so forth....

don't know if they (merc) will increase the budget from next year on... just imagine: red bull for instance changed and rebuilt their car 31(!) times so far in this season. what about merc? 5-7?

enough said.

Ah you've fallen for Whitmarshes crocodile tears have you?

go have a look at RedBull's marketing spend if yo can find it, The amount you're quoting is a good 90% of their global marketing budget so I highly doubt they will be spending that much on the f1 team.

[FoxHound]

Raptor

Schumacher himself has said Red Bull have flouted the RRA guidlines.
It's easy for Red Bull to call it sour grapes, as they are winning. But can you honestly give me an explanation as to how they updated their car over 30 times, with a couple of huge updates especially at the final day of the final test, with a copy of the Sauber style exhaust.
And Red Bull technologies? What exactly is it supplying Red Bull? They are supplying parts, we know that much from Horner.
But if they are spending 100 million at RBtechnolgies, and this is not included in any RRA agreement...

[Cocles]

Brawn discusses the W03, and a little about the W04 roughly half way down.

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/103868

and a little bit more...

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/103873

[user001]

I just wanna say: Red Bull has a budget of over 300 million euros. Mercedes about 140 mio euros. that should describe enough in terms of in season development capabilities and so forth....

don't know if they (merc) will increase the budget from next year on... just imagine: red bull for instance changed and rebuilt their car 31(!) times so far in this season. what about merc? 5-7?

enough said.

Enough said?

And what about the budgets of Lotus and Sauber? Or even Force India, Williams and Torro Rosso, who are now all faster than Mercedes AMG? A marquee works team getting their collective butts handed to them by customer teams and perennial midfielders operating at only a fraction of their budget, facilities, manpower, etc?

Despite the team's numerous claims of daunting challenges on the organizational & engineering front, none of those absolves them from the fact that smaller teams with no/less big names and who are also dealing with their own problems are now doing a much better job than what this team is pretending to do.

Sorry if that might seem harsh or bitter in any way for some of you. Three consecutive years of big talk, small results, endless excuses and the inevitable disappointments can do that to you.

If you want to be a top team you have to have a big/huge budget. Sauber inherited all equipment from BMW and had the luck to have James Key. But we don't think of them as a top team.

There is an auto motor and sport article saying red bull rebuilt most of their car, especially the rear, 31 times so far.

Mercedes said themselves they want to combine cost efficieny with having a very good car. they see know that this is not possible.

[yener]

Higher the downforce the lower tire degredation. Is that really that hard to understand?

I know it's not that simple but it seems they don't even care about development. It took them more then a half of the season to implement coanda exhaust, they even removed cascades on front wing due to lack of rear downforce. And they don't understand tires? If you have no downforce the car will be more likely to oversteer and that will increase tire wear. And RedBull being fast in last sectors of Korea just shows how much downforce they create and still they were last pitting in India.

Not exactly.

The more grip you have the less you slide. So you will go smooth trough a corner and your tyres will stay alive.

When you have less grip, you car will slide. You will correct the car but the tires will slide (spin) on the asfalt which cause high temp and that will kill your tires.

More downforce is not always more grip.

[yener]

This is a nice vid about tyres overheating.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X_epErRH ... redirect=1

[raymondu999]

It's a balancing act. Too high downforce, means you put a lot of energy into the tyres and heat them that way. Even on the straights you have the tyres heating up due to downforce, which is why Monza/Spa are the circuits where blistering generally is a problem. Too little downforce and you have your effect of sliding and extra slip angles.

[marcush.]

every time MrBrawn shares his views i feel very very sick .
Wow-how on earth could they realise after three races the coanda exhaust needs time to develop -each and every team using the system successfully had massive issues and went through BIG revamps with all new parts more than once..So basically these broads sat on the fence watching Ferrari ,RedBull,Mclaren develop their system and NOT doing anything serious ...now they relaise there is something to find but they have no idea how to extract the performance .sure .All the others had to learn as well ...so in the end a wrong decision taken at the start of the season and a good six months lost in the development race.
I have to admit -I was sure there is not that much in it ,but obvously there is quite a bit of potential .
Clearly management issues .

[Raptor22]

every time MrBrawn shares his views i feel very very sick .
Wow-how on earth could they realise after three races the coanda exhaust needs time to develop -each and every team using the system successfully had massive issues and went through BIG revamps with all new parts more than once..So basically these broads sat on the fence watching Ferrari ,RedBull,Mclaren develop their system and NOT doing anything serious ...now they relaise there is something to find but they have no idea how to extract the performance .sure .All the others had to learn as well ...so in the end a wrong decision taken at the start of the season and a good six months lost in the development race.
I have to admit -I was sure there is not that much in it ,but obvously there is quite a bit of potential .
Clearly management issues .

Mercedes are a bit of a rudderless ship aren't they. Brawn's deficiency in technical management and simply overall leadershi have really been shown up in 2012.
You really start to realise that the Ferrari glory years was more about Todt's political and management genius, Rory Byrnes understanding was his driver wanted and a hungry driver looking for success. Brawn was just a large filler in the pictures that was carried along for the ride.
Glory by association.

[Nando]

Schumi gets to keep a W03 as sort of a gift from Mercedes.
His pole in Monaco was probably why he wanted to keep it.

http://totalf1.com/full_story/view/4339 ... well_gift/

[sAx]

every time MrBrawn shares his views i feel very very sick .
Wow-how on earth could they realise after three races the coanda exhaust needs time to develop -each and every team using the system successfully had massive issues and went through BIG revamps with all new parts more than once..So basically these broads sat on the fence watching Ferrari ,RedBull,Mclaren develop their system and NOT doing anything serious ...now they relaise there is something to find but they have no idea how to extract the performance .sure .All the others had to learn as well ...so in the end a wrong decision taken at the start of the season and a good six months lost in the development race.
I have to admit -I was sure there is not that much in it ,but obvously there is quite a bit of potential .
Clearly management issues .

Mercedes are a bit of a rudderless ship aren't they. Brawn's deficiency in technical management and simply overall leadershi have really been shown up in 2012.
You really start to realise that the Ferrari glory years was more about Todt's political and management genius, Rory Byrnes understanding was his driver wanted and a hungry driver looking for success. Brawn was just a large filler in the pictures that was carried along for the ride.
Glory by association.

Interesting comments. So is the following:

"At Mercedes, there is hope, as every year, now that everything is getting better. Last year for the new technical structure made ​​of five engineers who had worked in teams as technology leaders - but after a mixed season opener, the performance is now worse than in the first two years of the team. In the last three races of the troops Brackley remained even without points - a record that in this period, only the three Nachzüglerteams Marussia, Caterham and HRT.

Now is given his hopes in Lewis Hamilton, who will bring the team to replace Michael Schumacher with his speed from 2013 forward - the new board Niki Lauda is responsible for ensuring that the communication between the top management in Stuttgart and Brackley works better and that those in charge of the Formula 1 team to keep its promises."

Translation Google - http://www.motorsport-total.com/f1/news ... 03003.html